nori

what aperatifs would you all recommend before a meal at a French restaurant?<BR><BR>&gt; Kir (white wine with cassis liqeur)or Kir Royal (Champagne with cassis). Often I take the first at average/less restaurants and the second at fine ones. Royal costs about 3 times just Kir. Maybe the most popular aperitif in France. Also they(esp.fine ones) often have "aperitif maison" (aperitif of the house). Perhaps you can ask.

Ardy

What about water? Can you ask for water as soon as you sit down, or will they bring some automatically? I've been told in Paris, that tap water is fine to drink. True?

StCirq

Stentor:<BR><BR>In addition to kirs, I enjoy a vin de noix or a vin de peche or a Lillet.<BR><BR>Ardy: water may or may not automatically be brought to the table. There seems to be the assumption that you will want mineral water, and you would normally order that with your meal. In some nicer restaurants, there may be mineral water bottles already on the table - they're not free. As for tap water, Paris has excellent tap water, and no one will object if you just order a carafe of it.<BR><BR>

x

In Paris, you're better off ordering water - with or with "gas" - you'll see every table in the nicer places with abottle of water - it's very healthful. And it's cheap. You'll decide which type you prefer.<BR><BR>By the way, as in any big city, there are thousands of approaches to what you've asked about - but people are telling you so many specifics about how they would go about it. I'd suggest you simply act the way you would in any large metropolitan area.<BR><BR>When it comes to the bill, just simply look at the waiter and he/she will know what you want. You'll see. L'addition, s'il vous plait, if you wish, will do it too.<BR><BR>Et le service est compris, n'est-ce pas, will settle that matter. But you may be sure it is, so don't bother to ask.<BR>It's supposed to be listed seprately, but sometimes it's not. it's simply a ruse to get more. Just pay the total, unless you'd like to add a bit for exceptional service. <BR>

Nori

To Ardy, Is it in Japan and US (and Canada?) they bring you a free glass of water automatically before you order? Not in European countries‚hknow. If you need water,you order a mineral water(not free) or after you have ordered food and drink(that you pay), at some average/less places you could ask for free tap water. Some restaurants ask for ask extra 1or2 dollors if you don't order a drink.Never seen free tap water at expensive ones. Maybe other people have different experiences from mine. Tap water in Paris may not be best but my parisien friends drink it without question at home if they run out of mineral water.

x

what we're witnessing here is the dumbing down of water service in Paris - gadzooks, I thought this was a TRAVEL website. It's turning into tap water central. Get over it - in Paris you pay for a bottle of water. It's better than their tap water. You're on vacation, live a little. Jeeeeez!!!

Pauline

Ok, most popular aperitif in France:<BR>Kir (mix of white wine and fruity liqueur)<BR>Kir Royal (same as above, but replace white wine by Champagne)<BR>The great thing about kir is that you can have various flavor:<BR>kir mure (blackberry)<BR>kir peche (peach)<BR>kir cassis (black current)<BR>kir framboise (rasperry)<BR>etc.<BR><BR>Other very popular aperitifs :<BR>-Martini bianco or Martini Rosso <BR>( thoses are "vin cuits", nothing to do with the American Martini)<BR>-Pastis <BR>-Marsala amande (vin cuit with a taste of almond)<BR><BR>Suze: This ap&eacute;ritif is flavored with herbs and gentian root. (very bitter, not my favorite)<BR><BR>The French hardly ever order a cocktail (with strong alcohol like American martinis, seabreeze etc.) before dinner, nor will they have a beer. I know that, in the US, lots of people tend to order wine by the glass, which is harldly ever done in France; get the bottle (une bouteille) or, if you think it is too much (rarely is!)<BR>get "une demie-bouteille" (half bottle).<BR>Most people in France tend to order water with dinner as well, "eau minerale" (mineral water) or "une carafe d'eau" (tap water).<BR><BR>Finally, to end a succulent meal, get a "digestif" (cordial).<BR>my favorite:<BR>cointreau :- A liqueur made with fruits of the Angers region and exotic sweet and bitter orange peels. <BR>Grand Marnier: blend of Cognac and orange peels <BR>Armagnac:<BR>Calvados: Apple Brandy <BR>Eaux de vie: (fire water!)<BR>Three different kinds of plum in France are used to make Mirabelle, Reine-Claude, and Quetsch. Other fruits such as raspberries (Framboise), pears (de Poire), strawberries (Fraises), blackberries (Mure Sauvage), and others are also made. <BR><BR>That's all for now!<BR><BR>The French girl on the block

Sant

On my visit to Paris, dining was my only bad experience. We had a two year old, and children seem like anathema in Paris. Dogs are no problems, but God forbid you bring in a little one. The didn't even have high chairs. Then there was all the smokers.<BR><BR>We found a decent solution though. The little patisseries, boulangeries, formageries, etc. in the neighborhoods and take-out places often had very good food that we could eat right there or take back to our hotel and eat out in the garden.

x

more and more wine bars are springing up all over Paris, some with very nice food, such as Willie's. wine by the glass is quite possible many places. Things they are a changin'.

Kay

Everything seemed pretty much like home except they add a service charge and/or cover charge and you tip on top of that. I said "Hi" "Bye" "Thank you" "Could we have the check please" and got very good service. I tried Bonjour and Merci when I wanted to show off my French.<BR><BR>Seriously, don't worry so much. I found the French very friendly and kind. <BR><BR> However, I will caution you on our "big mistake." On our recent trip, I forgot about not ordering a snack in a restaurant. We stopped at one in Loumarin, around 2:00 in the afternoon. I ordered a cheese plate (it wasn't particularly inexpensive) and my husband ordered a large salad and we both had coffee. The manager came over and asked us to leave even though there were only a few tables occupied. We paid for our coffee and left. While I thought it was ridiculous, I remembered that I had read about this and knew we were the ones that had breached etiquette. <BR><BR>In more expensive restaurants, you are expected to leave more than change on top of the already added service charge. Check the fodors miniguides for tipping suggestions.<BR><BR>Have a great trip. Kay

senator

I did not find it just the way in US, of course, it is a degree of differences that each has a different view. It is similar but different.<BR><BR>The service charge of 15% is always included in the bill one way or another. The difference is whether each item already has 15% included in the price or it is added to the total, either way it is always in the bottom line presented. Since Americans tend to get confused on whether this is the case, some shady establishments want you to believe you need to add 15% on top of their bill. You are not obliged legally or morally to add anything more to it. Whether this 15% already included in your bill is called "tip" in American sense causes endless debate. It is not necessary at all to solve this question. You can add some money to "round up" to the next convenient sum if you feel like, which perhaps amounts to few percent, a fraction of American "tip".<BR><BR>Bill paying, as others said, you need to ask. Unlike in Germany, the waiter does not stand next to you while you examine the bill and pay. French waiters leave the bill on the table, like American waiters, and return to collect money if it is a sit down type of place.<BR><BR>For dinner to anywhere worth going, you should reserve. They prefer it that way.<BR><BR>American eats early, around 7pm. French locals do not come in until 8pm or later. <BR><BR>It would solicit strange look if you want to drink coffee with meal or even with desert. Locals do not take milk/cream with coffee after noon.<BR><BR>They don't do doggie bags or split meals because they don't serve enormous portion meals like in the US. Don't ask unless you want to see how French waiters throw up their hands in the air.<BR><BR>French fold the salad with knife and fork, they do not cut salad like Americans.

seniormoment

Kay, elaborate, please on the faux pax re the 'snacks' in a restaurant. Was it the time of the afternoon or the fact that you ordered what would be considered just the first course of a meal, when restaurants expect you to order a main course as well? I think that's it, but can you yes or no? Thanks. Signed Vague.

ttt

ttt

jeanne

"Senior Moment"...Ha Ha Ha! <BR><BR>KAY: I, too, didn't quite understand the faux pas. Help us, please, before we get booted out of a restaurant too!

Red

Try a Lillet for an aperitif. I always found Kir too sweet and Lillet is just divine - a bit herb-like. <BR><BR>The best advise I have for eating in France is to relax and go with the flow. It takes a lot longer to eat there then in the US and you just have to adjust yourself. The waiter isn't going to check on you every five minutes "How's that steak tastin'" like they do here at the Black Angus. ;-) If you need something, catch his/her eye and they'll be right there. You don't have to make a big scene. <BR><BR>Be the most polite you have ever been in your entire life whether you are in a small cafe or a fancy restaurant.

kate

I like a kir but then with a glass of red wine with my meal,there is danger I may fall asleep in my dessert!<BR>So,usually I like to order a bottle of water-no gas! then the wine with my meal.<BR>erin-Why would someone look foolish? Do you think people are expected to just drink wine? I missed something in that reply~

erin

To Kate<BR>Neversaynevermade the comment that ordering wine before you ordered your meal was ok if that was the wine you were going to drink the rest of the meal. But if you order you wine before your meal like we do in the states the sommelier will come by and tell you he cannot be of help until you order your meal so he can suggest a wine to complement the meal.

Christina

I have only rarely been given water without asking in a French restaurant, and if I recall, it has only been with dessert or something like that. As a beverage with the main meal, you have to order it like anything else, even if it's a carafe of tap water. I have been given a glass of water with certain desserts/espresso, some of the nicer places do that. I don't usually order bottled water (only a carafe of tape water) --and I don't think it's that cheap, either--but I don't usually dine in expensive restaurants, either. <BR><BR>The thing about not ordering snacks in a restaurant isn't exactly etiquette but a matter of business, I'd say. Restaurants just aren't snack bars and can't afford to give tables to people ordering just a salad or snacks or drinks. Fancy restaurants in the US would do the same thing, I would guess--they wouldn't seat you at a table for you to order a cup of coffee. Some upscale brasseries or cafes won't do that either in Paris, at least not during dinner time (I have seen "no salads as a meal" printed on the menu in some places in Paris, although I forget exactly where). However, this scenario sounds odd as if it were in the middle of the day and tables were empty, I am surprised one would be asked to leave, it sounds rather rude. Also, most restaurants in France as in the USA kind of subtly ask you why you're there (ie, the maitre d' will ask "are you here for dinner?" or "two for dinner?" or something like that -- if someone said "oh no we just want coffee and a cheese plate, then they might say, well, I'm sorry, we are only open for meals or something). If I only want dessert or a drink, I tell them that up front. It's hard to tell what happened there as a cheese plate would not usually be an appetizer, and it sounds like that was not handled very well on the restaurant's part.<BR><BR>I've been in many places in France where you were not seated by restaurant personnel that were not casual snack bars. Most of the cafes I've eaten in do not seat you except in the formal dining area during dinnertime (if they have one, some do). Usually you can tell by just looking around to see if you see someone seating people, but I would not wait around to be seated in a cafe except the dinner section (which has tablecloths on the set tables).

kate

Thanks erin,I see.Although,we often order a glass of wine while looking over the menu then order the same wine by the glass while we eat.There are times that a bottle of wine for the two of us is too much.<BR> But then there is the night that we ate at Le Violin D'Ingres and there was a bottle of wine to go with about every bite I took!! It was wonderful but really cannot eat and drink like that every night,although now that I think of it, it might be fun to try~

Jim P

At all of the local bar/restaurants--the ones on every street corner--you can pay up to three different prices for the same drink etc. Cheapest is standing at the bar, next cheapest is sitting at a table w/o a table cloth and the most expensive is at a table with linen etc. In the tourist areas, where most Americans congregate, the differential can be up to three times! This is why you often see locals eating at the bar. These prices are required to be posted; and are they--somewhere.<BR><BR>The 15% service charge is ALWAYS included unless explicitly stated on the bill to be "service non compris".<BR><BR>The French consider Americans to be rude because we often do not begin and conclude our "transactions" with a greeting--never say "gimmie one of those" etc. "Politeness plus attitude" works!