Will be ending a group tour in Munich & would like to spend 5 days doing day trips around southern Germany before flying out of Frankfort. Dachau, the Eagle's Nest, Nuremburg, Augburg, Salzburg, Garmisch are all on our possible list. Staying based in Munich when possible.

Will renting a car vs taking rail be more efficient/pleasant? How much time will we save by driving vs. taking trains. Will finding/paying for parking be a big issue?

I don't mind the driving & thought ending with a drive through the Castle country on the way back to Frankfort might be nice.

Would driving into & back out of Switzerland/Austria be an issue?
Guessing I would rent in Munich & return @ Frankfort airport.

It's not much fun driving in and out of Munich proper for outings. Trains serve your destinations adequately. Not the Eagle's nest, but you can't drive there either - a bus is needed. A Bayern Ticket (day pass) or in some cases the cheaper Werdenfels Ticket will get you to those places and back for less than €30 per day.

Don't know what castle country you're talking about driving - but the best option would be to take a train not to FRA but slightly beyond FRA to Bingen on the Rhine for a night or two - there, instead of driving past the castles, you can board a cruise boat north for 1.5 hours to St. Goar through fabulous, castle-studded scenery - and really take it all in. St. Goar's Rheinfels Castle is worth a tour:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qxFF80wORNQ
Then from Bingen you're less than one hour by direct train from FRA airport.

Going east to west and vice versa in Bavaria below Munich can be a bit more problematic by rail than going north to south and vv. You can get to Berchtesgaden by rail from Munich where the Eagles nest tours start out.

You can reach all four of the Ludwig castles from Munich either by rail or rail and local bus depending upon which castle/palace you want to visit.

Heidelberg has a castle of your dreams high on a hill overlooking the town center and is a neat old town - one of the few not destroyed in WW2 - right on the way to Frankfurt and to get there you can motor down the castle-studded Castle Road along a cute river valley with untouched old small towns and castles dotting the way.

But for day trips from Munich like fussganger says driving in and out can be tedious - great once you get out but the trains will easily take you to any place you mentioned and the bargain Bavarian Lander Card or whatever they call it will give up to several people unlimited travel on regional trains and municipal transit for a full day for around 30 euros total - not p.p.

For lots of Germany trains check out www.seat61.com; www.ricksteves.com and www.budgeteuropetravel.com.

Marksburg Castle is much more impressive to me than St Goar's, which is only a partial castle that has in part been rebuilt - Marksburg just down the Rhine towards Kobnlenz was about the onluy castle on the Rhine not to have been obliterated in war and IME is a much nicer authentically medieval castle. A short detour up the Mosel from Koblenz brings you to Burg Eltz, like Marksburg not decidmated thru the ages by marauding armies and one of the most famous castles in Germany - formerly being pictured on the DM 500 banknote or some large-value note.

Well I know a lot of people will disagree but this is the type of area/trip we love to drive. That way everything is on your schedule - not waiting for trains or you have to backtrack to get there from here. Also you can visit any number of small villages or other sights you run across serendipitously, eat where and when you want - and just have a lot more freedom.

Caveat: It may well cost more. We don't know and don't care - since our vacations are limited primarily by time we can get off together.

Mostly it is personal choice. Nytraveler (Paul?) likes the car and it obviously works for him and his wife. We lived in Germany for a number of years and traveled by car, to our pleasure.

Now that we are returning for vacations, we prefer train travel. For us it is one less thing (a car) to lug about. As we prefer moderate towns - like Nürnberg, Augsburg & Salzburg - the train usually takes us right to the heart of them with little fuss. We do our sight-seeing on foot and enjoy it best this way.

It works both ways. Just make a decision and don't second-guess yourselves.

For travel within Bavaria, you can get the Bayern ticket which is 28 euros a day for two people, as long as you travel after 9am and use local transport (no high-speed trains).

http://www.bahn.com/i/view/GBR/en/pr...r-ticket.shtml

Hi 2idocs,

I think taking the train is the very best way to go, for a number of reasons.

One is that it will get you closer to locals. You may well get the chance to strike up a conversation with folks at the train stations or on board the train; Germans are curious people, and they'll like to ask about your home and what you're seeing in their country.

Even if you don't get to chat with locals, you'll have a nice opportunity for world-class people-watching. It's a great way to spend a long time observing a culture that's not your own -- the businessman or businesswoman hunkered over the laptop grinding away on a digital graph; the gaggle of teens and how they quickly quiet down when a stately elder gentlemen glares at them; the elderly couples out for a day's hike; the fashionistas coming back from a shopping trip in Milan or Paris; the grandmas going out to visit the grandbabies. It's a delightful way to spend a few hours. Basically, you won't be isolated inside your private bubble but will be inside the society.

Another reason to prefer the trains is that it will be so different from your travel at home. This is an opportunity to add even more "Europe" into your European adventure.

When you travel by train, everyone gets to enjoy the scenery -- no one has to have eyes on the road or eyes on a map; there is no stress about a wrong turn or stumbling upon a long stau (traffic jam) on the highway. If you get tired of the scenery, you can read, chat, nap, listen to music, play cards, or enjoy a picnic while you travel.

And finally, of course, travelling by train is more green (yaaay). Again, we rarely have the opportunity to so easily and enjoyably reduce ou carbon footprint. (There is already a lot of damage to the Bavarian glaciers due to global climate change.) You may really be happy to help preserve the beauty you came over to see.

I live in Garmisch, and I gave up my car when I moved here in 2008. I love it!

s

Some good points from Swandav. A few other clear advantages of riding the rails:

- No legal contracts or legal responsibilities as with the car.
- No rental outlet scams (travel boards are full of such complaints in Germany.)
- No DUI alcohol blood limit concerns. It's .5 in Germany, NOT .8. Enjoy a couple of beers with no worries and hop on the train. Or have a brew while you're on the train.
- Reduced risk of accident/injury
- No need to interrupt travel for bathroom breaks.
- No parking fees, environmental sticker fees or vignettes, no traffic or parking tickets.

However... train users should be aware of the current contentious relationship between the train drivers union and DB. There have been numerous strikes in Germany over the last year or so that have undone many a traveler's itinerary. Be careful to get information from DB or news outlets every few days so that you can change your plans and get bus tickets or reserve a car if necessary.

Actually, Fussgaenger, it's not true that Bavarian travellers might be affected by the DB strikes. Regional trains in Bavaria are run by other companies (such as Meridian) and are not affected by any DB strikes. All of the op's routes from Munich are run by regional trains, not DB.

The only problem may come with folks on a long-distance train such as an IC or ICE. Otherwise, no worries with a DB strike.

s

If it is the destinations you are interested in, then the train is a great choice. I used trains/buses on my last two trips and it was great.

However, if you are interested in visiting many places along a route, then a car is the obvious choice.

Well actually it's me and my husband.

And we have done probably 20 road trips in europe - when it made sense for the itinerary. Usually a large anchor city at each end - but renting a car in between for smaller towns, villages and countryside - in France, Italy, Germany, Belgium/Luxembourg, Switz and Austria.

Swandav: "Actually, Fussgaenger, it's not true that Bavarian travellers might be affected by the DB strikes. Regional trains in Bavaria are run by other companies (such as Meridian) and are not affected by any DB strikes. All of the op's routes from Munich are run by regional trains, not DB."

I was speaking generally about the car/train issue.

But in the OP's case... they'll have to reach Frankfurt in order to fly out of there, right?

Also, I believe that DB does operate regional trains on some of the other routes the OP plans to use. Is the Werdenfelsbahn not DB?

http://www.bahn.de/regio_oberbayern/...teilnetz.shtml

What about Munich-Nuremberg?

http://www.bahn.de/regio_oberbayern/...teilnetz.shtml

Yes, Fussgänger, the op will be subject to the DB when travelling to & from Frankfurt.

And -- I have to absolutely recant what I posted above. I believe the Meridian company used to operate the regional trains between Munich & Garmisch, but either I was mistaken, or they apparently no longer do. I swear I used to see the "M" in the train column for travel between Munich & Garmisch, but now all the trains show "RB" or "R" rather than the "M."

Meridian operates the line from Munich to Salzburg.

My apologies for giving wrong information -- and thanks Fussgänger for cathing it!

s

The GDL has agreed not to strike only until June 25. When they strike, they sometimes give only a day or two advance notice. It's of course very confusing for the average visitor to Germany to know which trains are private and which are DB, which of their own DB trains will be impacted and which not - but DB knows. Train travelers with their own best interests in mind should check regularly with DB for strike updates. As much as I prefer train over car travel, this ongoing labor conflict has been very nasty, and I might even want to have a car reservation to back up my summer/fall train plans within Germany, depending on the developing circumstances between DB and the GDL.

Well yes the dicey strike situation in Germany on trains that seems unresolvable makes planning on trains rather iffy - but if doing day trips from Munich play it by ear - strikes are announced in advance I think so use car as a back up - can easily rent one there.

Meridian operates the line from Munich to Salzburg.>

Only for regional train though right - express trains I believe are run by Deutsche Bahn - German Railways who I believe also owns the tracks?

"Would driving into & back out of Switzerland/Austria be an issue?"
Yes. We are going from Munich to Fussen, Germany and then to Switzerland. We have to cross Austria for about a minute near lake Constance and must pay their road tax ("vignette"). You get a sticker to put on your car before you go. In Switzerland there is also a road tax. Also need a sticker. So look them up and take note. We had no idea about this until I checked it out, partly with caveats by some Fodorites.

Here's a link to the Austrian vignette.
http://www.tolltickets.com/country/a...spx?lang=en-GB

Yes, Pal, Meridian only runs the regional trains between Munich & Salzburg. The fast trains are run by DB (EC for instance). There are also some fast Austrian trains on that route, as well, the Railjet run by ÖBB. The Bavaria Ticket is only valid on the regional trains, not the EC or Railjet.

s