Buying Train Tickets on line in advance of Trip to Italy
Jul 14th, 2014, 06:15 AM
#21
Pal, give up, OK? There are people who who have decided that RailEurope is the evil one and they are not going to change their mind. Not even when you remind them that their beloved SNCF OWNS RE and all the rest of it.
And do try to remember that all of these people were actually BORN knowing all the ins and outs of European rail travel and they never ever bought a pass or anything silly like that.
You simply try to give the OP as much useful information as possible because at least the OP is actually traveling and that counts for quite a lot IMO.
And do try to remember that all of these people were actually BORN knowing all the ins and outs of European rail travel and they never ever bought a pass or anything silly like that.
You simply try to give the OP as much useful information as possible because at least the OP is actually traveling and that counts for quite a lot IMO.
Jul 14th, 2014, 09:16 AM
#22
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You have received great advice but it should be 1st Class definitely>
Yes on the trip of a lifetime where folks here regularly pay $200 or more a night for a hotel don't skimp to save a few euros - despite another Fodor's mantra that 1st class 'is not worth the extra moneuy' to me and the poster above and others - like the one last weeks said their 2nd class train car was totally miserable - so congested - yes on the trip of a lifetime, especially with perhaps too much luggage - go in a much more relaxed style - in first class - I base this recommendation of zillions of Italian train trips observing both classes.
Even Fodorites' guru Man in Seat 61 admitted here on a post about Italy that 'he too was an aficionado of first class (even though alas he makes his living off pushing discounted 2nd-class tickets on his commercial site www.seat61.com!)
Yes on the trip of a lifetime where folks here regularly pay $200 or more a night for a hotel don't skimp to save a few euros - despite another Fodor's mantra that 1st class 'is not worth the extra moneuy' to me and the poster above and others - like the one last weeks said their 2nd class train car was totally miserable - so congested - yes on the trip of a lifetime, especially with perhaps too much luggage - go in a much more relaxed style - in first class - I base this recommendation of zillions of Italian train trips observing both classes.
Even Fodorites' guru Man in Seat 61 admitted here on a post about Italy that 'he too was an aficionado of first class (even though alas he makes his living off pushing discounted 2nd-class tickets on his commercial site www.seat61.com!)
Jul 14th, 2014, 11:43 AM
#24
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http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b9/Frecciarossainterno.jpg>
Well Dukey you know all - ALL - second class train cars will look like this staged photo op obviously a PR thing when those trains rolled out - she brings it out to support her statement that 2nd class is just fine - why pay one euro more - well if trains actually in use looked like this it would be - put people, including screaming babies, in every seat and luggage all over and you have IME and several others in other threads reveal the real 2nd class.
Why this poster shows this obviously un-real 2nd class picture defies credibility. It only serves as serious misinformation and expectations IME. I refer to one person who took 2nd class from Venice to Florence last week on another thread she said 'never again - I'll go first class next time.'
Tourists often have too much luggage and this makes 2nd class even worse - trying to find a place to hoist it in crowded luggage racks, etc.
Put me with Man in Seat 61 - at least for the tourist on the trip of a lifetime - an aficionado of first class - if you are riding like Italians do with a simple handbag or brief case every day of course 2nd class would be a lot cheaper over many times.
But when paying $200-300 a day for a hotel don't skimp on train travel either - that's my take.
Well Dukey you know all - ALL - second class train cars will look like this staged photo op obviously a PR thing when those trains rolled out - she brings it out to support her statement that 2nd class is just fine - why pay one euro more - well if trains actually in use looked like this it would be - put people, including screaming babies, in every seat and luggage all over and you have IME and several others in other threads reveal the real 2nd class.
Why this poster shows this obviously un-real 2nd class picture defies credibility. It only serves as serious misinformation and expectations IME. I refer to one person who took 2nd class from Venice to Florence last week on another thread she said 'never again - I'll go first class next time.'
Tourists often have too much luggage and this makes 2nd class even worse - trying to find a place to hoist it in crowded luggage racks, etc.
Put me with Man in Seat 61 - at least for the tourist on the trip of a lifetime - an aficionado of first class - if you are riding like Italians do with a simple handbag or brief case every day of course 2nd class would be a lot cheaper over many times.
But when paying $200-300 a day for a hotel don't skimp on train travel either - that's my take.
Jul 14th, 2014, 11:43 AM
#25
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I just went to the RailEurope site to see what's new there.
Since you get the best discounts by buying 120 days in advance, I chose the 11th of November. I also chose the early morning trains, because the discounts don't sell out as quickly for those. I selected a trip from Rome to Florence.
On the Trenitalia site for that date, they show three trains between 6 and 7. The first is a regional train, whose tickets can't be bought online more than 7 days in advance, but there's no advantage to buying them online anyway, as they never sell out and they never have discounts.
The other two trains are a Frecciarossa at 6:20 and a Frecciargento at 6:50. Both have €19 tickets for sale.
On RailEurope, for the same date, they say that "At this time we are waiting for tickets and schedules to be updated for the date and route you requested by the Italian railways." So I tried the 7th instead and got the same message.
That's interesting, because yesterday they had the schedules for that date; I got interrupted before checking the Trenitalia site. Obviously they're system is down and they're pretending it's the fault of Italian railways.
Since you get the best discounts by buying 120 days in advance, I chose the 11th of November. I also chose the early morning trains, because the discounts don't sell out as quickly for those. I selected a trip from Rome to Florence.
On the Trenitalia site for that date, they show three trains between 6 and 7. The first is a regional train, whose tickets can't be bought online more than 7 days in advance, but there's no advantage to buying them online anyway, as they never sell out and they never have discounts.
The other two trains are a Frecciarossa at 6:20 and a Frecciargento at 6:50. Both have €19 tickets for sale.
On RailEurope, for the same date, they say that "At this time we are waiting for tickets and schedules to be updated for the date and route you requested by the Italian railways." So I tried the 7th instead and got the same message.
That's interesting, because yesterday they had the schedules for that date; I got interrupted before checking the Trenitalia site. Obviously they're system is down and they're pretending it's the fault of Italian railways.
Jul 14th, 2014, 12:03 PM
#26
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Well why not go to August 20 - starting at 13:30 - RE has lots of trains Venice to Florence at $23 - high-speed trains and the best I could see on www.trenitalia.com was one train at 19 euros and 2 trains at 22.50 euros and several at 29 euros.
Please check this out to see what mistake I must be making - in this case for this August 20 RailEurope is significantly cheaper than www.trenitalia.com.
Again please point out my fault or accept what I say is often true.
No what once was true of RE is no longer always true as some experts continue to claim. The cheapest tickets on RE tend to be on Italo so may not appear on trenitalia.com - and I believe RE or its parent company SNCF has something to do with Italo but not sure.
What was once true is no longer true - though if you say it enough folks may believe it and that is the problem.
Please check this out to see what mistake I must be making - in this case for this August 20 RailEurope is significantly cheaper than www.trenitalia.com.
Again please point out my fault or accept what I say is often true.
No what once was true of RE is no longer always true as some experts continue to claim. The cheapest tickets on RE tend to be on Italo so may not appear on trenitalia.com - and I believe RE or its parent company SNCF has something to do with Italo but not sure.
What was once true is no longer true - though if you say it enough folks may believe it and that is the problem.
Jul 14th, 2014, 01:29 PM
#27
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Another check for August 20, 2014
Trenitalia had one 9 euro fare - for a much slower IC train and also 19 euro fares for IC trains
RailEurope had nothing to match the one 9 euro fare on trenitalia.com but did have $18 fares - which would be cheaper than the 19 euros trenitalia.com was charging for other IC trains
Trenitalia.com has 29 euro fares for many Frecciarussa (sp?) trains but RailEurope actually had $22 fares for Italo trains taking about the same time and $37 for trenitalia trains.
So it seems now that RailEurope could well be cheaper than www.trenitalia.com and easy to use and you pay no foreign transaction fees on your c cards, etc.
So let's put the myth to rest that on "RE you pay twice as much" when in fact it could be cheaper - look on Aug 20, 2014 and see the proof in the pudding.
Trenitalia had one 9 euro fare - for a much slower IC train and also 19 euro fares for IC trains
RailEurope had nothing to match the one 9 euro fare on trenitalia.com but did have $18 fares - which would be cheaper than the 19 euros trenitalia.com was charging for other IC trains
Trenitalia.com has 29 euro fares for many Frecciarussa (sp?) trains but RailEurope actually had $22 fares for Italo trains taking about the same time and $37 for trenitalia trains.
So it seems now that RailEurope could well be cheaper than www.trenitalia.com and easy to use and you pay no foreign transaction fees on your c cards, etc.
So let's put the myth to rest that on "RE you pay twice as much" when in fact it could be cheaper - look on Aug 20, 2014 and see the proof in the pudding.
Jul 14th, 2014, 01:49 PM
#28
>>>Why this poster shows this obviously un-real 2nd class picture defies credibility.<<<
That's silly PQ. That's the actual train and it's silly for you to claim it's a created photo.
All that "trip of a lifetime" is also nonsense. The majority of people (including Italians) travel 2nd class, not 1st which is why it's always empty. You didn't bother to check RailEurope prices or how the process worked. You just made a wild claim and didn't even know you would be paying $8 to print your own ticket that you don't have to pay if you buy directly from Trenitalia or Italo.
>>>I was in First. There were racks above the seats which would accommodate most moderately-sized suitcases.<<<
>>>Tourists often have too much luggage and this makes 2nd class even worse<<<
PQ/Dukey - FYI - The OP was not pricing first. The OP was pricing premier which is 2nd and HAS NO MORE ROOM than standard 2nd.
>>>I too picked a randon date - July 29 for Florence to Rome<<<
Yes, PQ, you picked a random date in July which is useless. The OP is traveling in OCT which is why I looked at Oct. to see if your wild claim was even true (it wasn't).
If someone wants to travel 1st class it's fine, but they should know premier isn't 1st and I provided that info along with an actual picture of what premier will be like. You didn't provide pictures any and never have.
***>>>You pay almost double with RailEurope.>
this is not always the case and I say just check with RailEurope because they do at times at least match those trenitalia.com deals <<<<
The point is RE doesn't list all the discounted tickets on Trenitalia at any given time even if they are available. They weren't even listing all the trains available.
Byron1 - If you want to purchase 1st class then do so, but know that premier is not 1st and you will have to book one that says Business to get 1st. If you want to pay double for your ticket on RailEurope, feel free to do that too. It's your money to spend, but at least now you know what you are/aren't getting at what cost.
That's silly PQ. That's the actual train and it's silly for you to claim it's a created photo.
All that "trip of a lifetime" is also nonsense. The majority of people (including Italians) travel 2nd class, not 1st which is why it's always empty. You didn't bother to check RailEurope prices or how the process worked. You just made a wild claim and didn't even know you would be paying $8 to print your own ticket that you don't have to pay if you buy directly from Trenitalia or Italo.
>>>I was in First. There were racks above the seats which would accommodate most moderately-sized suitcases.<<<
>>>Tourists often have too much luggage and this makes 2nd class even worse<<<
PQ/Dukey - FYI - The OP was not pricing first. The OP was pricing premier which is 2nd and HAS NO MORE ROOM than standard 2nd.
>>>I too picked a randon date - July 29 for Florence to Rome<<<
Yes, PQ, you picked a random date in July which is useless. The OP is traveling in OCT which is why I looked at Oct. to see if your wild claim was even true (it wasn't).
If someone wants to travel 1st class it's fine, but they should know premier isn't 1st and I provided that info along with an actual picture of what premier will be like. You didn't provide pictures any and never have.
***>>>You pay almost double with RailEurope.>
this is not always the case and I say just check with RailEurope because they do at times at least match those trenitalia.com deals <<<<
The point is RE doesn't list all the discounted tickets on Trenitalia at any given time even if they are available. They weren't even listing all the trains available.
Byron1 - If you want to purchase 1st class then do so, but know that premier is not 1st and you will have to book one that says Business to get 1st. If you want to pay double for your ticket on RailEurope, feel free to do that too. It's your money to spend, but at least now you know what you are/aren't getting at what cost.
Jul 14th, 2014, 01:56 PM
#29
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It's your money to spend, but at least now you know what you are/aren't getting at what cost.>
And believe me in 2nd class you WILL NOT being getting any sparsely filled spanking new train car that is so so obviously a PR photo that I am shocked some can't see that and portray that as a relaity - misinformation IMO of the worst type and not sure why it is done over and over - don't you have any REAL pictures of 2nd class and not this IME - I've sat and watched hundreds of trains roll into and out of Florence's station - way up and outside of the station is an isolated platform - number 26 or some such number where you can see every train come and go and rarely do you see 2nd class that sparsely filled - that's a new train right out of the factory and a PR photo and I will call you out on that every time so folks don't expect something they will RARELY encounter on actual trains.
And believe me in 2nd class you WILL NOT being getting any sparsely filled spanking new train car that is so so obviously a PR photo that I am shocked some can't see that and portray that as a relaity - misinformation IMO of the worst type and not sure why it is done over and over - don't you have any REAL pictures of 2nd class and not this IME - I've sat and watched hundreds of trains roll into and out of Florence's station - way up and outside of the station is an isolated platform - number 26 or some such number where you can see every train come and go and rarely do you see 2nd class that sparsely filled - that's a new train right out of the factory and a PR photo and I will call you out on that every time so folks don't expect something they will RARELY encounter on actual trains.
Jul 15th, 2014, 04:19 AM
#31
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If someone wants to travel 1st class it's fine, but they should know premier isn't 1st and I provided that info along with an actual picture of what premier will be like>
do you really REALLY purport that that PR photo opp picture of 2nd class you keep trotting out is what a real second-class car will look like - well physically maybe but the staged photo you keep showing has all of three or four people in the whole car with most seats empty - you are saying this is what to expect?
IME the second-class train car will be chock full - few if any empty seats and in your staged photo there is no luggage anywhere, etc.
No that photo is deceptive and I think you should stop using it as it gives a very unreal picture of what one may expect ion 2nd class - and I am not saying second class is terrible - it is just in reality rarely if ever what you purport it to be from that photo.
Again- do you honestly believe that that photo is what a typical 2nd-class train car will look like - I mean only a handful of folks in it?
hahttp://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b9/Frecciarossainterno.jpgs
do you really REALLY purport that that PR photo opp picture of 2nd class you keep trotting out is what a real second-class car will look like - well physically maybe but the staged photo you keep showing has all of three or four people in the whole car with most seats empty - you are saying this is what to expect?
IME the second-class train car will be chock full - few if any empty seats and in your staged photo there is no luggage anywhere, etc.
No that photo is deceptive and I think you should stop using it as it gives a very unreal picture of what one may expect ion 2nd class - and I am not saying second class is terrible - it is just in reality rarely if ever what you purport it to be from that photo.
Again- do you honestly believe that that photo is what a typical 2nd-class train car will look like - I mean only a handful of folks in it?
hahttp://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b9/Frecciarossainterno.jpgs
Jul 15th, 2014, 08:35 AM
#33
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GAC opines: "Some solo travellers (and even couples, in facing seat arrangements) have expressed the pleasure of being seated in the solo seat row on the Freccia trains in first class, thereby having nobody with whom to "rub shoulders or elbows".>
and to me these solo seats - an aisle and a window seat - just one seat in a row - are priceless and if booking first class try to nab these - no one sitting next to you - perhaps a stranger - no when you must get out to go to the loo, etc asking a person next to you excuse me (they may have food on their tray, etc inhibiting you even asking) - anyway complete freedom to move around at will - priceless for me and also for folks with long legs - easy to stretch them out without bothering someone next to you.
those who say there is virtually no difference between classes must be blind to the advantages of these seats - perhaps because they've never ridden in first class? But to me they are priceless.
and to me these solo seats - an aisle and a window seat - just one seat in a row - are priceless and if booking first class try to nab these - no one sitting next to you - perhaps a stranger - no when you must get out to go to the loo, etc asking a person next to you excuse me (they may have food on their tray, etc inhibiting you even asking) - anyway complete freedom to move around at will - priceless for me and also for folks with long legs - easy to stretch them out without bothering someone next to you.
those who say there is virtually no difference between classes must be blind to the advantages of these seats - perhaps because they've never ridden in first class? But to me they are priceless.
Jul 18th, 2014, 03:07 PM
#34
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One problem may be that the Raileurope site has no option to choose your station, although they do indicate the stations in their search results. On August 20th, Rail Europe seems to have all the trains leaving from Venice Mestre at a cheapest fare of $44 and all the trains leaving from Venice S. Lucia at $67. On Trenitalia, all of these have €29 (about $40) fares. The only cheaper train is an IC train from Venice Mestre to Firenze Rifredi, a seriously inconvenient itinerary for most people. This is available for €19 (about $26) on Trenitalia and $29 on RailEurope.
Basically it looks as though on RailEurope, if you're willing to use inconvenient stations, you can get tickets with a markup of a mere 38% (counting the delivery fee), while if you opt for convenience, you will pay a 250% markup.
If you don't like using Trenitalia, I suggest you use www.italiarail.com, which is the American agent for Trenitalia (although you can use it from other countries as well). On their site, all of the tickets that are €29 on Trenitalia are $42, which is pretty close to the actual exchange rate. Their processing fee is $5.
The cheapest place to get your tickets is Trenitalia. There is no processing fee and the cheapest fares available are found online if you book 120 days in advance of travel. (However there are often some discounts available even at the last minute, especially if you're willing to travel at less busy times of the day.) You have to know the Italian names of the cities, and you should find out which station is best for you in each city. These are things you should learn no matter how you're getting around in Italy, though, unless you want to find yourself stuck with a ticket from Venice Mestre to Florence Rifredi.
Basically it looks as though on RailEurope, if you're willing to use inconvenient stations, you can get tickets with a markup of a mere 38% (counting the delivery fee), while if you opt for convenience, you will pay a 250% markup.
If you don't like using Trenitalia, I suggest you use www.italiarail.com, which is the American agent for Trenitalia (although you can use it from other countries as well). On their site, all of the tickets that are €29 on Trenitalia are $42, which is pretty close to the actual exchange rate. Their processing fee is $5.
The cheapest place to get your tickets is Trenitalia. There is no processing fee and the cheapest fares available are found online if you book 120 days in advance of travel. (However there are often some discounts available even at the last minute, especially if you're willing to travel at less busy times of the day.) You have to know the Italian names of the cities, and you should find out which station is best for you in each city. These are things you should learn no matter how you're getting around in Italy, though, unless you want to find yourself stuck with a ticket from Venice Mestre to Florence Rifredi.
Jul 19th, 2014, 05:31 AM
#35
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On August 20th, Rail Europe seems to have all the trains leaving from Venice Mestre at a cheapest fare of $44 and all the trains leaving from Venice S. Lucia at $67>
When I checked three days ago or so for apr 20 RE has lots of trains at $23 Venice to Florence - so either they disappeared or sold out? I mean lots and lots were $23 - cheaper by far than www.trenitalia.com.
Point is always now check RE and see what is best - if as cheap or cheaper go thru RE and avoid the hassles of using www.trenitalia.com.
When I checked three days ago or so for apr 20 RE has lots of trains at $23 Venice to Florence - so either they disappeared or sold out? I mean lots and lots were $23 - cheaper by far than www.trenitalia.com.
Point is always now check RE and see what is best - if as cheap or cheaper go thru RE and avoid the hassles of using www.trenitalia.com.
Jul 19th, 2014, 08:30 AM
#37
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Thank you everyone. We have booked our train tickets. When you are at the train station in Italy (Rome for instance), does everyone go on at once or is it easily marked for 2nd, 1st, business and executive classes?
Next question. We are traveling for two weeks. Given we are taking the train twice (short trips), what is the best size suitcase to take? We are thinking of buying two 25 inch suitcases and then take a duffle bag over the shoulder or back pack. Does that make sense? I know alot of people travel with only a carryon but that seems too small for us given we may want to buy a few things. Thoughts, please and thanks. Have a good day.
Next question. We are traveling for two weeks. Given we are taking the train twice (short trips), what is the best size suitcase to take? We are thinking of buying two 25 inch suitcases and then take a duffle bag over the shoulder or back pack. Does that make sense? I know alot of people travel with only a carryon but that seems too small for us given we may want to buy a few things. Thoughts, please and thanks. Have a good day.
Jul 19th, 2014, 10:57 AM
#38
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Byron, everyone goes on at once, the first class people go in the first class car, the business in business etc. The train car you want is marked on your ticket.
The size suitcases you're talking about will work fine. Be careful with the weight though. I had a 27" this time I think and it was heavy heavy heavy (the rest of my family had smaller and bit the bullet and took a larger one to carry all the sunscreen, souvenirs, etc.)
The size suitcases you're talking about will work fine. Be careful with the weight though. I had a 27" this time I think and it was heavy heavy heavy (the rest of my family had smaller and bit the bullet and took a larger one to carry all the sunscreen, souvenirs, etc.)
Jul 20th, 2014, 07:54 AM
#40
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1st time train - dictates baggage with wheels - you have to walk lots in stations, when changing trains at perhaps a quick time, etc. But as you are only taking two trains I guess I would just try to keep things manageable.
