I am copying this from another rather unrelated thread so people might see it.


Author: acereid
Date: 04/18/2005, 07:19 pm
"Billy Elliot" is in previews still at the Victoria Palace and is simply fantastic. At times the Northern accent is so heavy that for an American ear it can be a struggle to understand every word. But having never seen the film we had only a sketchy idea of the story line but we all laughed and cried. It's bound to be a big hit - try to snag a ticket before it becomes the hottest one in town after its May premiere. Good luck.

I'm soooo tempted. But my train for Paris leaves at 5:42. Can I make it?

A close friend of mine's husband (Jake Parker) scored the entire thing by himself. Please go support him!

That last statement may be misleading to some. The entire score of the musical was composed by Elton John. Perhaps Jake Parker did the orchestrations?

Does that mean there will be no "Swan Lake," as Elton John is not Tschaikovsky?

Who is playing the lead?

Regarding who is playing Billy, here is a quote from London Theatre Guide:


"In a case of life-imitating-art-imitating-life, the boys who play Billy and his best friend came from over 3000 who attended open auditions, trying to realise their dream of performing in the West End. As a result, those who auditioned successfully and those who will replace them are trained at the newly opened Billy Elliot School, the only multi-discipline school of its kind in the North of England."

The two main adults are played by Tim Healy (the father) and Hayden Gwynne (the teacher).

That must be it, Patrick...thanks! My last email from his wife: "Jake is working like a dog at the moment having to do "Billy Elliot" all by
himself.." and, as he is a composer, (his father is Director Alan Parker) I assumed...

We want to see this play! First, though, I would love to hear from someone who has seen it if the language has been AT ALL cleaned up from the movie. The movie was brilliant except for the language, which was exhaustingly foul. To be able to show my 13-year-old son (who is an Irish dancer and actor) the better bits of the movie I had to sit with remote in hand, fast-forwarding to the dancing sequences. One online review/ticket booth says:

Like the film, Billy Elliot, the musical, contains strong language and some scenes of confrontation between policemen and miners. As a rule of thumb, when booking tickets for parties including children, please consider the film version of Billy Elliot (rated 15) and whether this would be suitable for all members of your party. The producers recommended minimum age is eight.

I can't imagine anyone other than Count Olav allowing an 8-year-old to watch Billy Elliot, the movie! Has anyone actually seen the play?

Unfortunately, the previews were cancelled while we were in London last month. We would have loved to see it! Our entire family thought the movie was brilliant. At the time we first saw it, I think our kids were about 10 and 14. They still watch it on video from time to time and still love it. Yes, the language is a bit coarse, but it's an authentic representation of real life. I felt like its poignant portrayal of a young person overcoming very difficult odds was incredibly inspiring. For us, this far outweighed any concerns about the profanity.

The movie we rented was rated R, and it seemed as though no character could say anything without adding in the "F" word. I guess we'll just skip the play and wait until the edited version comes out. It's too bad, though, that something which I agree is really inspiring is so vulgar. Perhaps if it comes to New York they'll clean it up. In London I was told that Mama Mia had had a verbal "nip and tuck" for American venues, but I don't know if its true.

Perhaps the writers and producers want the play to be "real" just like the movie. Since the boy comes from a coarse and "vulgar" social level, they probably like the realism of those characters using the F word just like the real people would do.
If they went around saying "Oh, my goodness, golly gee, why do you want to study ballet?" the play would not only be "unreal" but just plain silly.

This is 2005. Like it or not, that is the way many people talk. I realize it bothers you to hear such people speak the way they do, but unless you keep your children in a bubble, they are probably totally unbothered by it the way you are. I would think a good talk about it might actually do some good instead of pretending such language doesn't exist.

I don't even want to start on a comparison to parents who don't want their children to hear about sex or about birth control, knowing that if their kids don't hear about it, then they won't engage in it.

Sorry just my viewpoint. But I do understand why a person may not want to accept the "vulgarity" that is real and alive today. That's your privilege. That's why we have Chitty Chitty Bang Bang and Mary Poppins so people can live in a "make believe" world.

well said Patrick.

I realise that this isn't really what this thread is about, but I couldn't resist asking whether anybody had a theory as to why 'bad language' is so much more shocking to those in the US than in the UK?

Yes, I realise that this is a generalisation and no, I don't want to start a 'who's best?' debate - we've been there and done that - but I am genuinely curious...

"Sorry just my viewpoint. But I do understand why a person may not want to accept the "vulgarity" that is real and alive today. That's your privilege. That's why we have Chitty Chitty Bang Bang and Mary Poppins so people can live in a "make believe" world."

No need to apologize for your viewpoint. I don't apologize for mine. Believe it or not, most of the people with whom we come into contact daily are civil and do not curse. We don't pretend it doesn't exist, but I find it offensive, perhaps in the way some people find racial or gender bias slurs offensive.

And our lives are not make believe, and are also nothing like Mary Poppins or Chitty Chitty Bang Bang.

I've just gone ahead and bought my ticket to Billy Elliot! I'm also interested in the new Guys and Dolls that is opening - has anyone heard anything about it yet?

Tallulah, I believe your question is genuine, and not simply an attempt to stir the pot on a boring Thursday afternoon. I think it is a chicken and egg problem: the more you hear bad language, the less shocking it sounds. The less shocking it sounds, the more you hear it.

I don't find it shocking, I find it distasteful. And vulgar, in the truest sense of the word "common." Obviously, you can't keep chidren away from all bad language, but why does that mean you shouldn't try to minimize their contact with it? That notion, that since you can't stop something entirely you shouldn't even try, is a cultural wave of the surrender flag. I'm operating on the premise that, the less we hear it, the better. Billy Elliot is a good movie, but not good enough to overcome the drearily repetitive language. We were very surprised in the UK (I don't know why) when some girls my daughter met at a dance competition had just awful language. They were all about age 15 or so, and weren't born talking that way. Their culture sanctions it. Our American culture sanctions it, too. What is the logical end of public discourse when everything is permissible?

Gee, kswl, I tried hard to phrase my statement so it wasn't offensive, yet I feel you mistook one point. I didn't mean to say you live in a fantasy world. What I meant was that the "real world" is full of vulgarity, like it or not. But there are "fantasy world" plays to enjoy that don't include the vulgarity of today's "real world". The point of Billy Elliot is that he comes from that "vulgar" world and finds beauty and escape. How can you get that point across without showing the vulgar world he comes from?

And to Tallulah, good question. As an active member of a community theatre in Naples, Florida we have a hard time pleasing our older audiences as it is hard to find newer plays that don't have "vulgarities". Last year we did ART, and removed the constand F word and changed the references to the picture from S--T to Crap. Actually this was based on a new translation of the original play which was written in French. There were no vulgarities similar to the F word which was added to the London production when translated to English. And the French slang word used to describe the painting was something literally more like "piece of trash", so our Crap was actually closer to the original intent. Wouldn't you know it. We were actually raked over the coals by a critic who said we "ruined the playwright's original intention" by softening the language. Huh? Apparently she didn't realize the play was written in French and our version was more like the "original". But in London it seems they MUST have a lot of the F word to make it "real".

So, I'm still wondering if I could make it from the matinee to Waterloo station in time? Probably a dumb idea. I think you have to be at the station an hour ahead of time.

LVSue, if you don't mind living on the edge--of sanity, that is--you could probably make it. We couldn't find a taxi, had to stop at an ATM, got caught in rush hour traffic, got to Waterloo 20 min. before our train was supposed to leave, flew through security, got on correct train (atheists, take note of miracle) Eurostar to Paris. And then for some reason it sat on the tracks an extra 15 minutes and left late.

We'd been told rather sternly to go at least 30 minutes ahead of time, and that is very good advice. But we didn't and we made it. I should think a lot would depend upon when you are traveling. A Sat. or Sun matinee will not put you in rush hour, but there may be loads of people trying to leave town if it's July or August.

I find the language thing interesting and I suppose I am quite guilty of over-using words to the degree that they are meaningless - so I try to keep the very best (worst?) of them in reserve for when I really need to make an impact! If people don't expect me to swear then they pay more attention when I do. But it's always been very clear to me that swearing is far more prevalent here in the UK than in the US. To the point that nearly every time I've mentioned an English film to Americans, one of the first comments has been the amount of bad language in it, something that I hadn't even noticed.

However, I grew up in a household where my parents represented two very different aspects of Irelend - my father is from the bogs in Kerry and thinks nothing of saying 'f' every other word; whereas my mother is a very prim and proper city lady who balks at use of bad language. (However she does have the occasional attack of malapropisms and use words that she doesn't realise are bad! For example, she regularly replaces the 'i' in twit with an 'a', which I cringe at dreadfully!)

I guess that it's very much a contextual thing; could you, for example, stage a production of Chaucer, (the Wife of Bath), for instance, without using language so colourful that it makes ours look rather drab by comparison?