Bill

<BR>Here's where I currently am with my itinerary. I added a day at the beginning of the trip so we could settle in at Salzburg and see Halstatt before we meet up with the boys. <BR> <BR>Day 1: Fly out in the evening, non-stop overnight to Munich. <BR> <BR>Day 2: Arrive in Munich at 8:00 a.m. Pick up rental car. Head toward Salzburg, stopping off for a leisurely visit to Chiemsee. Overnight at Hotel Elefant. <BR> <BR>Day 3: Day trip to Halstatt and surrounding region. Greet our sons as their choir tour arrives late in the evening. Continue at Hotel Elefant. <BR> <BR>Day 4: Tour Berchtesgaden and the salt mines with the boys (all 30 of them!). Listen to their concert in the evening. Continue at the Hotel Elefant. <BR> <BR>Day 5: Wave goodbye to the boys after breakfast and drive to Lienz, going by a scenic route that includes the Grossglockner alpine road, unless the weather is bad. Overnight at the Hotel Traube in Lienz. <BR> <BR>Day 6: Drive through the Italian Dolomites, up through Brenner Pass, to the village of Brixlegg. Overnight at Schloss Matzen. <BR> <BR>Day 7: Explore the alpine areas east of Innsbruck. Continue at Schloss Matzen. <BR> <BR>Day 8: Drive to Oberammergau, passing through the Innsbruck area and exploring points of interest en route. Late afternoon at Neuschwanstein. Overnight at Hotel Turmwirt in Oberammergau. <BR> <BR>Day 9: Explore Oberammergau in the morning. See Wieskirche and Linderhoff in the afternoon as we drive to Munich. Overnight at _________ Hotel in the Munich area. <BR> <BR>Day 10: Fly out at noon. <BR> <BR>

Mary Anne

Bill - Have you contacted Schloss Matzen yet? We were hoping to stay there and when I contacted them they said they are no longer a Bed and Breakfast. They are just being used for group events like weddings. We were very disappointed. I am sorry to be the bearer of bad news.

Bill

<BR>Just got an e-mail today from the owner informing me of the news. Strangely, they still have their B&B website up. <BR>We're very disappointed. That looked to be a high point of the trip. I'm back to looking at places east of Innsbruck, but maybe we'll do the valleys west of Innsbruck instead.

Marlena

Bill! <BR> <BR>My husband and I are taking a very similar trip in June/July. Would you let me know what type of driving map you will be using. We just returned from a 2 1/2 week driving trip though England and used the Michelin Book which is very detailed. We also ended up buying a driving map while in England. We used both which got us through the countryside. <BR> <BR>Just curious if you've found a detailed map of the area other than just the major highways. Please share! Thanks

Bill

<BR>Hi Marlena - <BR>The map we're using for our planning is the Hallwag map of Austria. Seems to be very complete as to secondary roads, though of course it doesn't have minor roads. Got it at Barnes and Noble bookstore. The map contains a very good chunk of Bavaria, as well as the Italian Dolomites, with the same level of detail as Austria. <BR> <BR>To the general readership: <BR>As I'm researching a substitute for the originally planned 2-night stay at Schloss Matzen in Brixlegg, I'm draw to the Stubai Valley, south of Innsbruck. Does anyone have any recomendations for accommodations in Fulpmes or Neustift, or elsewhere in the Stubaital?

Ann

Bill, I don't know if you're specifically looking for another schloss to stay in, but you might look into one mentioned in my "Dream Sleeps" book and is southwest of Innsbruck, although it may be too far afield for you. It is Jagdschloss Kuhtai, which dates to the 13th century and is run by the graf Stolberg, great-grandson of Emperor Franz Joseph. It appears to be more gasthaus-style architecture than castle, but the interior looks lovely. You can check out their website at www.jagdschloss.kuehtai. Your itinerary seems to be coming along nicely... for both you and Marlena, you might want to know that you can get excellent regional maps at any service station in Germany which will have the little back roads as well as signposted highways and autobahns and are very inexpensive. We always liked just the plain old Esso maps and still use them...

rob

Hi - <BR> <BR>Regrets to the previous poster, but I have driven through Kuehtai, and while the village is very beautifully set in the Alps, there is nothing, repeat nothing, in the entire town except for hotels. Bill, you can do way better, especially for 2 days. <BR> <BR>I would suggest Innsbruck, Hall in Tirol, or Kufstein. I would also suggest opening the trip up a bit at the front end if possible with an overnight stay in Hallstatt instead of just a day trip there. <BR> <BR>Have a great trip. <BR>

Ann

Rob, please don't apologize, that's what this forum is all about! I think it's great that you volunteered that you've been there. Mine was just a suggestion from a book which specializes in castle hotels, based on Bill saying he was disappointed not to get to stay at Schloss Matzen. Doesn't the name Kuhetai have something to do with cows??? Probably says a lot about the area... (Don't shoot, I like cows!) Also, Bill, if you're going to stay just the one overnight in Munich, you might want to look into the Hotel Platzl (www.platzl.de). It is just around the corner from the Marienplatz and beside that wonderful tourist trap, the Hofbrauhaus, and you can make reservations online. I'm sure they could help you decide how best to get to the airport the next day, but I'd stick with the original plan of turning in the auto on arrival if at all possible.

Bill

<BR>Rob - <BR>Thanks for the info on Kuehtai, but I think Ann may have pegged our interests rather accurately - staying at a schloss in the middle of flowering meadows and mountains. This stage of our trip would be a peaceful rest between the touristy environs of Salzburg and Oberammergau. <BR>Actually, based on some great advice from Paulo (who posted to this thread, above) we may work in a night or two in the Italian Dolomites, getting the Alps from the southern perspective (and probably getting sunnier weather). Anyone have any suggestions for sights, routes, and accommodations in the very northernmost part of Italy? <BR>

BOB THE NAVIGATOR

Bill, Do a search and find the Val Gardena and the village of Ortisei. Hard to beat as a base for the western Dolomites and easy to get to from the Brenner Pass Autostrada. Take the route over the Sella pass the next day.

Jochen

<BR>Bill, <BR> <BR>I would recommend a sidetrip to Campo Tures/Sand in Taufers and its surroundings, just a short drive north of Brunico/Bruneck. You'll find some unspoilt alpine valley and a wonderful medieval castle. See <BR> <BR>http://www.ahrntal.com/index_en.html <BR> <BR>for general information and <BR> <BR>http://www.ahrntal.com/fr_e33.html <BR> <BR>and <BR> <BR>http://www.sbi.suedtirol.net/tauff.htm <BR> <BR>for some pictures. <BR> <BR>Regards, Jochen <BR> <BR>

Barb

You should have a wonderful trip! Love Germany and Austria! As for the night before you return to the USA from Munich, I would recommend the Marriott in the town of Friesing which is only a 10 or 15 minute drive to the Airport. We normally opt for smaller European Hotels, but settled on this one since it was so close to the Airport. It was recommended on this website last year. Beautiful and spotless hotel, super little bier stube and light dinner spot, and great breakfast buffet. <BR>Happy travels!

mary

We stayed at a pension in Grodig outside Salzburg two different times. First time in winter with another couple; then in May we could see the castle from the yard. Is easy to find near Salzburg & Berschgarten. Pension Landhaus Bachmann S. Ziegler Buchmannweg 3 A -5082 Grodig

Bill

Seeing as how this thread has been brought back to the top, I figured I might as well show you where we ended up on our itinerary. Quite diferent from the one I started out with. You'll recall that we cross paths with our two sons, who will be in the middle of a 17-day tour of their boys' choir. Turned out that the choir changed their itinerary a bit too. Here's where we are, reservations all made. Any suggestions within this framework would be appreciated. <BR> <BR>Day 1 (Wed, July 4): Fly into Munich around 8:00 a.m. Get the rental car and drive to Oberamerrgau (1.5+ hour drive). Explore the area, e.g. Linderhoff Castle. Overnight at Hotel Turmwirt. <BR> <BR>Day 2 (Thurs 7/5) Stay on in Oberammergau. Meet up with the choir at Weiskirche at 11:30a.m. (concert there at noon) and on to Neuschwanstein Castle. Continue at Hotel Turmwirt. <BR> <BR>Day 3 (Fri 7/6): Drive to Salzburg (2.5 hours). Salt mine tour with the choir along the way. They have concerts at Salzburg Dome (informal 30-minute concert in the afternoon) and in the nearby town of Mattesee (full-blown evening concert). Stay at Hotel Wolf. <BR> <BR>Day 4 (Sat 7/7): Wave goodbye to the boys after breakfast and drive to Cortina d'Ampezzo, Italy (3.5 hours). Stop off in Kitzbuhel and maybe Lienz for a look around. Overnight at the Hotel Menardi. <BR> <BR>Day 5 (Sun 7/8): Stay on in Cortina, exploring the Italian Dolomites, Continue at Hotel Menardi. <BR> <BR>Day 6 (Mon 7/9): Drive to Castelrotto, Italy, going by the Great Dolomites Road (1.5 hours, but many stops to see the sights). Overnight at Hotel Cavallino d'Oro. <BR> <BR>Day 7 (Tues 7/10): Stay on in Castelrotto, exploring the high alpine meadows and small towns. Continue at Hotel Cavallino d'Oro. <BR> <BR>Day 8 (Wed 7/11): Drive to Munich (3.5 hours), stopping in Mittenwald for lunch. Overnight at Hotel Torbrau. <BR> <BR>Day 9 (Thurs 7/12): Stay on in Munich. (Drop off car downtown, early a.m.) Continue at Hotel Torbrau. <BR> <BR>Day 10 (Fri 7/13): S-Bahn train to airport (station next-door to hotel). Fly out of Munich at 12:30 p.m. <BR>

Dan

Nice itinerary! I've never been to the Italian Alps, but it's on my wish list. <BR>If you are still flexible about where you're going, try to get a few days in Vienna. A very charming city, with fantastic food!

BOB THE NAVIGATOR

Bill, One of the great itineraries. You have really been adaptable and it will pay off. Have a fabulous time. I love your hotel choices--perfect.

Ann

Bill, you've done a wonderful job of arranging a fun itinerary that will let you see a lot without being too much on the run. Congratulations, and have a wonderful time! Please post back after the trip so we'll know how everything went... we always wonder. Since you're in downtown Munich, don't miss the glockenspiel and viktualienmarkt, and try to get out to Nymphenburg if you have time. Cheers..