Travelbug13

I've been to Europe once and am going back this Fall, but I lived in Asia for a year.
I never thought Asia would be on my must see places but after living and traveling there for a year, I am completely in love with it. I've been to Japan, China, Korea, Thailand, Malaysia, Singapore and Hong Kong.

Of course you can't compare the two, but I fell in love with everything Asian. Thailand was amazing. I found Singapore comparable to many great European cities except just super clean. And very multi-cultural. Japan was amazing, but a lot more expensive than most people think, especially Tokyo. It is now the most expensive city to live in the world.

But in South East Asia, English is very rampant and it is so easy to get around.

I would say if you have a chance to go, you should. It is an eye opening and fabulous experience, and the reason I don't go more often is becasue i only have 3 weeks vacation a year and the flights take so long from Canada. But I'll be back again soon. I still need to visit Cambodia, Laos and Vietnam, and I've herad from my friends that these places are amazing.

wombat7

I would echo the comments of those who note that it is as difficult to talk about “Europe” as it is to talk about “Asia” – it’s difficult enough to generalize about a country never mind a whole continent.

The experience you will have in, for example, Kerela is completely different to Hong Kong.

I’d be slow to write off a continent and choose to do only a skim the places because we are not coming back – I wouldn’t do it with Europe, Africa o even North America (assuming you follow the seven continent theory – would definitely not do that with America for those who follow the six continent theory) – I‘ll make an exception with Antarctica.

Clifton

Hi julies,

I'd seen your question over on the Asia board, but since there's so many multi-trip posters over there and since you were thinking of Vietnam, where I've not been, I held off on replying.

Since I see you're sort of looking at this from a comparison standpoint and possibly viewing it from a broader standpoint than just the one country, I'll go ahead in. Couldn't hurt and I think our travel styles seem similar, both of us having enjoyed Romania quite a bit. But SE Asia, and Cambodia in particular, knocked my socks off. So, I may ramble a bit.

We took our first trip to Asia this past Jan/Feb after having been on various Euro trips. So, that's our perspective. We went to Thailand and Cambodia. Actually, we like the downsized approach for places to sleep (usually) too. If not B&Bs, then guesthouses and small hotels. We didn't always do that, but could have.

First, the cultural differences that struck me - yes, Europe is different from one end to the other. But generally speaking, I can think of things in SE Asia that you'll see constantly that you'd never see in Europe & N. America.

1) It's chaotic, but not (for me) in a bad way. It's more like life seems to be going on in the middle of the street. Envision an open fire and food being cooked in a wok right in the middle of a sidewalk. In downtown Bangkok. Now imagine you can see people all over the place doing the same thing. Imagine 7 people riding by you on one small motorcycle. In Phnom Penh, I don't think I ever saw just one person on a moto. Motos are everywhere. Phnom Penh - I saw maybe three stop lights and no stop signs in a city of a million people. There's a system going on there where people just sort of weave across each other in intersections, but they seem to get it, even if we didn't. Everyone has something to sell! Every house is also a market, it seems.

2) You aren't from around here. Expect that you will be approached by people for a variety of reasons. My suggestion is that even if you aren't buying, stay open to the idea that you may still enjoy the exchange. We did. We were walking along the road in Kampong Chhnang, Cambodia (not exactly on the tourist track), a good ways from our $5 per night guesthouse when a group of motos pulled up next to us, with twice as many teenage boys aboard. Ah, what's this going to be? The spokesman, a young monk in orange robes, explained that they'd like to practice their english, if we wouldn't mind. He'd been taking lessons in the school for monks, then tutoring is friends. And so we practiced with them for over an hour and had a great time. Earlier that day, we'd gone to see the floating Vietnamese village when a young girl ran uip to our moto driver and asked him to ask us if we'd take a ride in her father's boat and see her village. We did, of course, and she was beaming and jumping up and down about it. She got a half dozen pats on the back from neighbors as she led us down the semi-muddy bank. Huge amount of fun for $3, and likely as much as they made all week from fishing! Also sitting on the wall at the riverbank in Phnom Pehn, helping a student update his book of english slang expressions (carefully noted as to country of origin, and kept clean based on the agreement of all concerned). Every elderly person in PP stopped to stare at us talking, before moving on. It's just the way it is.

3) Poverty. It's bad. It really is. Not that there isn't signs of wealth as well, but the poverty level is something you have to come to terms with. Imagine the worst house you saw in Romania, then remove the front wall, all utilities and flooring. It's Romania level poverty tenfold, easily. Particularly in Cambodia, but I saw it to a lesser extent along the khlongs and in the backstreets of Bangkok too, as well as in Northern Thailand. A wild guess that Vietnam would have similar sights.

Anyway -- I have a lot of places I want to see in one lifetime. Morocco is next for a long trip, and I know I want to get to S. America, more Africa and of course, lots of Europe. But SE Asia is the one place I absolutely know I have got to go back to. I was totally reeled in. The Angkor temples (there are hundreds of them, dating back to 800AD, spread out 80 miles) are as cool and historic as anything in Europe, in my opinion. But the non-stop experience with the people and culture is the reason I need to go back.

Sorry about the length, hope to hear how it goes when you decide.

LoriS

I admit I am definitely eurocentric or europhobe or euro-addict, however you would prefer to describe it. My DH and I have gone to Europe at least 2-3 times per year since 1993 and never tire of it.

My experiences in Asia have been much less thrilling. Yes, it was amazing to stand on the Great Wall in China, but the Forbidden City, Beijing, etc. didn't do much for me. I got the impression that Asia was much more "western" than Europe and without the charm.

I'm headed to Bangkok for my first trip to Thailand in Sept. I'm hoping that's better.

kappa

alan64, I'm glad you liked your trip to Japan. Just for the record, Kanjis are not Japapnese alphabets. Hira-ganas (and Kata-kanas) are.

Kanji = Ideogram
Hira-gana = Phonogram, like Western alphabets

luvtotravel

Although I've been to Europe many times, I'm glad I spent some time in Asia -- the first time was a week in Hong Kong in 1993, and the second time was two weeks in Thailand in 2001 -- both times as independent travelers, not on organized tours. The destinations are quite different, but I enjoyed them both. We visited both times in November/December. The weather in Hong Kong was pleasant. The weather in Thailand was hot and steamy.

Even in 1993, Hong Kong was not much of a bargain, and I'm assuming it hasn't changed much. Still we got some good deals and shopping was everywhere. With its British background, language was not a problem at all. And the food! We ate a lot and wished we'd eaten more. Some of the best food I've ever had.

Thailand was also wonderful, and I think one of the reasons I enjoyed it so much was the friendly people. They say Thailand is the land of smiles, and that is what we experienced. The dollar was very strong in 2001, and we shopped a lot. We were also able to eat in high-end restaurants, and hired a private car and driver for two days in Chiang Mai. At $6 an hour, we had massages every day. There is much to do in Thailand and I'd go back if it wasn't so darn far away. Language was rarely a problem. One down side was all the poverty that was mentioned above.

In Chiang Mai we stayed in a bed and breakfast made completely of teak. The owner rented out four rooms. It was a interesting experience.

If anyone is interested in reading my trip report from Thailand and seeing my photos you can find it at
www.travelswithdiane.homestead.com/Bangkok1.html

gard

Hi

I live in Norway and I think it is great fun to travel to Asia as it is quite different compared to my home country and Europe in general. The culture, religion, food, habits etc are all quite different compared to what I'm used to. The only problem is of course that you might not get a feel of this if you don't get in touch with the locals. I have been lucky enough to be able to stay with people in places like Singapore and Malaysia and you do of course get more knowledge this way. I haven't been to Vietnam but my wife and I have been to trips to Japan, China, Thailand, Malaysia and Singapore and that has been great fun. I have posted trip reports with pictures from the trip on my homepage http://gardkarlsen.com Maybe you can find some useful info there.

Regards
Gard
STavanger, Norway

julies

Thanks for all the thoughts becaue you are really giving me more of a feel for what I can expect if we actually go ahead and do this (which I think is highly likely). Your responses have also helped me to think about where in Asia I might and might not want to visit in the future. Those places cited as expensive, westernized, big cities with lots of shopping are being automatically marked off my list. We would be looking more at a cultural immersion type trip I think.

Clifton--

Great to hear from you especailly inlight of the fact that we've both enjoyed Romania so much. Your comparisons were very helpful. We too are the sort of people who will take advantage of opportunities that drop in our laps even if they are a bit different. Thus, we jumped at the chance when we were invited to lunch at the home of the Romanian who had just backed into our car and damaged it in a parking lot. How many people would ever get the opportunity to get into a private home in a communist block apartment building? We'd look for the same sorts of opportunities in Vietnam. Tell me what a $5 a night guest house in Cambodia is like. I'm curious because lots of people on the Asia board insist that one needs expensive $100 a night westernized 5* hotels in Vietnam, while people on Lonely Planet say that I can get something more than nice for $25. If I can get clean, safe & intersting for $5 a night, I'd go for it.

kerouac

A $5 guest house in Cambodia can either be very simple and rustic -- a plain room with a ceiling fan and attached bathroom with cold water shower. Or it can be much better. One extremely excellent site to visit for more information about Cambodia is www.talesofasia.com -- it is by an American photographer who lives in Siem Reap with his Thai wife and who has been running a modest guesthouse there for the last two years.

Travelbug13

LoriS...I am sorry to hear you didn't love Beijing. Standing on the Great Wall, one of the WONDERS of this world was one of the ost magical places I've ever been.

I do however disagree that Asia lacks charm. There is charm everywhere, you just have to find it. When you go to Thailand keep your eyes and heart open and you will suddenly start to see all the amazing things Asia has to offer. You will have a great time, and I'd love to hear how you liked it.
Clifton really said it best! The people are what make Asia what it is..... spend some time to talk to the locals, their history is amazing!

Travelbug13

Julies

You can get an ok place for $5 a night in Cambodia or Vietnam. In Thailand I stayed just off Khoa San Rd, and the place was $17 a night. And it was gorgeous. The place had a swimming pool, a nice, clean room, with a cute view overlooking the city. There was a television and air conditioning as well.

In Phuket, I paid $8 a night, and the place was amazing, and I was right on the beach. In malaysia (Penang) we splurged for a few nights and spent $40/night for a 5 star resort type place. And malaysia is one of the more expensive S.E Asian countries.
I definitely think you can spend under $30 a night and still get a gorgeous place, that has charm and culture.

I've also stayed in places in Chiang Mai for $2.50 a night and these were rustic, places with no air conditioning. But since I was rarely in my room it suited me fine. I've done both, the budget stuff and the higher end stuff. But you can definitely do it for under $30-$40 a night.

USNR

Let's see if we qualify. We have been on our own or on tour to Japan, China, Hong Kong, Laos, Vietnam, Cambodia, Thailand, India, Jordan plus Australia and New Zealand. French Polynesia, too.

Finland and Albania are the only European countries we have not visited.

Plus most of Africa, S. America, and North America (omitting N. Dakota and Arkansas, alas)

Indonesia and Malaysia? Not yet.

We are in our late 70s -- almost 80. There simply is no way we could generalize about our travels and adventures in Asia that would be helpful to you. The continent is too vast and varied. To over-simplify would be to mislead. You just have to see for yourself. Would we return to any of those Asian countries? Perhaps. But there are still too many unexplored corners waiting for us.

We probably have seen the last of Europe. We carry too much mental baggage, memories extending back to the 1940s, times when travelers were few and the American dollar really bought something, but the problem was that there was hardly anything to buy.

Parts of Asia remain a bargain, but those places are disappearing. So best you go soon.

Clifton

How great you got the chance to visit inside a home in Romania. I really enjoy surprises like that, things you can't plan for and won't forget.

On the guesthouse question - in our case, the $5 bought that rustic room kerouac mentioned. I'd be interested to hear about the even nicer ones though, if he returns to the thread.

Ours came with a ceiling fan, a small tv hooked to satellite and a pair of twin beds. It was very clean, no decoration to speak of. The bath had a basic hot water shower (only $4 if you skipped the hot water option) where the bathroom was essentially the same as the shower. Had a sink and a toilet that was sit down style, but required a ladle of water - no flush. There wasn't a window, but had a brick work grate to the outside just above eye level, running the length of the room. There was a gecko in the room when we arrived, but he was harmless enough.

Better though was that it was very safe. The owner actually slept near the doorway to make sure it was. He made our stay enjoyable. He had been a Khmer interpreter to the UN during the takeover from the Khmer Rouge and had tons of stories to share. In the morning, his wife made us fresh baguettes for breakfast (the French left their mark)

Actually though, $25 really does buy a nice place with the extras and usually minus reptiles. We really splashed out at the end of the trip for a big finish and got a room at the Foriegn Correspondents Club in Phnom Penh, which is in a beautiful French colonial building in the middle of things. Private balcony overlooking the main street and the Mekong, teak floors, huge dark stone tub, stocked mini bar with scotch and French wines, antique furniture and gorgeous vintage black and white photos of Cambodia. Paid $65 a night for that, but hey, as much as we like to travel on budget, we can be bought.

Amy

After years of Europe travel (with a touch of South America as well) I finally got to Vietnam: it was magical.
Sleeping on a boat on Halong Bay, floating down the Mekong, being the only non-Asian on a folksong dragon baot, riding on the motorbike taxis, chatting with a 72 year old lady in Hanoi...it was all good. (Even the rat in the hotel was, um, interesting.)

I went to Cambodia that trip as well, and thoroughly enjoyed Siem Reap, my only stop.

Then I went to China on my own for three weeks a few years after; fascinating, and I think I'm still assimilating everything!

artlover

I'm a Europe addict (Spain, Italy, and France especially) and I lived in Asia for a year and travelled throughout. Although I have no desire to go back, I'm glad I experienced the places I lived and visited. As many people have pointed out, Asia is much less expensive than most of Europe. I certainly would suggest you checking it out since you have the desire to do so.

Happy travels.

althom1122

For years I was a Europe addict - haven't been everywhere, but have been to England, Ireland, France, Germany, Switzerland, Austria, Italy, Spain, Portugal, Sweden, and Norway. I LOVE Europe. My travel style is also similar to yours - prefer moderate pension-type places with local character. Not into big, fancy hotels or restaurants.
In February, I took my daughter (24) on a three-week trip (on our own - no tour group) to Thailand, Laos, and Cambodia. I am HOOKED. It was fascinating - totally different from Europe. Much more exotic. Like Clifton, we found the interactions with locals to the highlight of our trip. I loved the food (especially the fruit shakes!), and our hotels were great for the price. We had a beautiful suite in Chiang Mai for $42 and a bungalow next to a rice paddy in Mae Hong Son (northern Thailand) for about the same. Our huge apartment in Bangkok overlooking the river was less than $85 a night.
I'm sure I'll return to Europe (and still love it), but I'm now as excited about Asia as I ever was about Europe. Next trip is to China (on our own) with my sister next May. After that it will be India, then Vietnam, then Burma (Myanmar).
Hope you have a great time in Asia!
Karen

kit

The language barrier is certainly tough...you might want to do "Asia Light" with trips to Hong Kong and Singapore to begin. Beyond these "easy" locales, a tour would be ideal, if you like that sort of fare.

tonx

I thought Thailand was great, don`t stay by the beaches for the whole holiday though.

If you go to Japan, get a Shinkansen ticket from your local travel agent as you`ll save yourself a packet. Also, you should try to avoid the rainy seasons or Summer, early Spring or late Autumn are great for travelling as it too humid. If you can, try to visit a town during a festival as the atmosphere is great!

ahotpoet

Julies
Thanks so much for posting this question. I too am a Europe addict and can never get enough but lately I am thinking about Asia too. (Almost feel disloyal in a way) This thread has given me insight and a jumping off point to expand on.
I see that you like to bike and in the past have repsonded to my questions regarding bike tours etc. VBT has a Vietnam tour. Check them out. They might have the exposure you are looking for.
Clifton, your response was marvelous.

Rachele

I agree, great question julies! My husband and I go to Europe at least once a year (and my sister lives in London), but I have been thinking about going to Asia at some point. Thailand seems like it would be a great place to start (I've heard only wonderful things about travelling there). All the responses here have been really interesting.