mikelg

Spain has changed a lot in the past 20 years, but not necessarily for better. Schools, roads, health system...have greatly improved, the economy is strong, the unemployment tax is in its lowest figures, we are now a (very) rich country (the 8th economy in the world).

But I feel we have lost our "essence". Spain used to be a country to have fun (still is), to enjoy life, to relax...but we have "europeized" this country a bit too much. Too many regulations, too many laws, too many rules...popular restaurants where locals went to eat are now full of (local and international) tourists, prices have risen incredibly (the cost of housing is unbelievable, the cost of living is just too high for many), taberns have turned into tourist attractions, we all dress identically, we all go to the same places...I donīt know, but I find it harder everyday to find "real" places as the ones I knew before.

Is this just a symptom of me getting old(Iīm 37), just a feeling of the "old times were better" or just the plain truth?

buongiorno

Jeez, what's the matter with those kids today???

LoriNY1

I find this to be true throughout Europe. There are very few places left that are 'undiscovered', and those that are, well I'm not telling. As we enter a more global economy, it is difficult to find the 'essence', altho if you look hard enough it is still there. I lament the intro of the Euro, altho the different currency was a pain for the traveler, it gave each country an identity. Progress, not necessarily a good thing.

PalQ

When i first went to Spain in 1969 (!) i saw thousands of shacks people were living in along rail lines - this shocked me - in both Madrid and Barcelona - in the Franco era and now all vestiges of this gross poverty are seemingly gone. So it seems at least for a segment of the population Spain wasn't very fun or relaxing back then and i doubt they'd want to return. And in youth hostels in the Franco era they would often not let people with long hair in - at the borders long hairs were also often hassled.
Viva the new and freer Spain!

mikelg

Well, Iīm not talking about Franco times, itīs rather the 80īs in Spain, when we were a young democracy and there was a special feeling about many things that itīs not longer there...Of course we have improved a lot economically, but itīs not that...

Carrybean

In 30 years, these will be your good old days.

parisonmymind2

To quote Lee Hayes from The Weavers - "Nostalgia isn't what it used to be, and then again, it never was."

nessundorma

I think Spain just keeps getting better and better. It keeps opening up in the most marvelous, humane and welcoming ways.

I am sure it is more sophisticated about tourism than it used to be, and therefore "undiscovered" places now are advertising for tourist dollars.

But try going to the heart of Catalonia, to a place like Vic. You'll be the only tourist in sight and in the midst of artistic treasures that will leave you thinking for months on end.

Spain is the best destination in Europe today, and with the brightest future.

PaulRabe

Let's look at your own words:

> Schools, roads, health system
> ... have greatly improved,
> the economy is strong,
> we are now a (very) rich country

I think it's fair to say that most people would rather have better jobs with better wages, better health care, better schools, and a better infrastructure; than to have the "essence" of twenty years ago. Essense doesn't give you food on your table, a roof over your head, a doctor you can afford, or schools for your children.

As a rich American I have the luxury of going to just about anywhere I want in order to get whatever "essence" I want. I don't deny a sense of loss when it's more difficult to find something different than what I have at my home. But I fully understand WHY people would rather have the essence of where I live than the one they have in their own country.

I should mention I also have no problem with the fact that many people DON'T want the essence of where I happen to live.

Raydotman

I think I have to agree with mikelg. Spain was a different country not all that long ago and it was better. Inflation has taken a terrible toll since the advent of the euro and a lot of the Spanish are hurting. Salaries have not kept up with the price increases. And, the essence of Spain, is getting harder and harder to find. The European Union has imposed rules and regulations on everything and the Spanish soul is suffering under this yoke. Not even Franco took away the huerga.

laclaire

I have spent a lot of the past 8 years in Spain, and I first met the country with a peseta where I could do all kinds of things with "mil pelas." I could take 500pts and make it downtown, have drinks, and take a taxi home without a problem. Now even the metro seems expensive. I have seen a definite change in attitude. Perhaps it is that I have known my Spanish friends since high school and college requires a certain elevation of maturity, but it seems they have all become work-obsessed and competitive. I know that business is like that, but it seems they are taking the capitalist and very American approach, which does not suit them.

I think that the weights are also shifting towards a more regulated Spain, and that sometimes seems to repress, but at the same time, I think there was a little "descontrol" before.

I don't feel it is missing any essence, but I do feel that it is sometimes blurred by imported customs.

PalQ

I think that if you want to turn the Spanish clock back 20 years you move to Portugal!

Dukey

"I know that business is like that, but it seems they are taking the capitalist and very American approach, which does not suit them...."

Do you honestly think that Americans are the <b>only</b>competitive folks on the planet?

Do you think people take approaches and do things because someone makes them do it or because they see it as advantageous, even if you do not?

Romance and idealized notions and visions of a place and people are often not held by the very people in question....and for reasons Mr. Rabe has already pointed out.

Barbara

The European Union may have imposed a bunch of rules etc, but it's because of the masses of money the EU poured into Spain that the country is now doing so well.

laclaire

I never said Americans were any kind of superlative, just that Spain has chosen that as a model, as opposed to other countries.

Seamus

Maybe you are getting old (I certainly am, though cling to the notion that while I may have to admit my age I don't have to act it) AND things are changing. Your obervation and the responses it evokes would pertain in many locations. Have you read about the emerging &quot;zippie&quot; class in India? These are the equivalent of what we called yuppies in the 90's in the US, though less narcissistic. Tourism forecasts predict that within the next year or two the US will be displaced as the largest source of tourists to Paris - by China. It is a changing world...

mikelg

I agree mostly with laclaire. There was a Spanish way of being and we are gradually (and quickly) losing it, in favour of a more civilized country (with all its fors and againsts). The &quot;descontrol&quot; before was part of the Spanish character, so charming to many and so annoying for others...

NEDSIRELAND

We are all getting older and yes, Spain has changed a lot in the past 20-years, more often for the better but too often for the worse. Blame it on immigration: many EU Citizens taking up residence in Spain because of the way it used to be and actually becoming agents of change. Or, in big cities like Barcelona and Madrid, blame it on the 'drug scene.'

Maybe it's Franco's Revenge: after all, he wanted nothing more than acceptance within the European Community and this is what that has brought to Spain.

Then there's the Illegal immigration problem; but that's a whole nuther story.

Change is inevitable! It's not just in Spain; it's all over the world. Spain's 'saving grace' is that its essence may still be found, mostly in out-of-the-way places, by people like yourself.

hsv

I completely agree with Barbara. The irony of this thread lies in its bashing the European Union. Subsidies from the EU have made Spain the rich country it now is - and they still keep a huge amount of fund flowing in.

While I am in no way overly sympathetic with the European autocracy in Brussels, there are quite a number of member states that do benefit immensely from the intransparency of the EU's household and funding channels - Spain being one of them.

Sue_xx_yy

I am reminded of how people used to blame 'society' for this or that supposedly corrupted individual. This hinged on the idea that in the absence of such society such individual would be a &quot;noble savage&quot; full of only natural instincts that, being natural, were invariably good. In the 60s, people took this idea to extremes, and went into communes in which there would be no rules, free love, and a kind of natural, earthly paradise.

Oddly enough - at least, it's odd if one buys the noble savage theory - the communes failed miserably.

Then along came identity politics in which entire groups were and are permitted to see themselves as victims. This is a convenient role to play since it absolves everyone in the group of responsibility, be it for rules OR for their 'essences' - whilst allowing the group to bully other groups into doing this or that out of guilt.

The irony is that this very guilt is what has prompted all that EU spending in the first place. But wait - apparently now people are to feel guilty for acting on - wait for it - the wrong guilt. And worse yet, it seems the wrong essence, the wrong nature, of the subject group is flourishing, apparently having been encouraged to do so by the spending!

Of course, it's been a long time since the comic strip &quot;Pogo&quot; ran with the immortal lines:

&quot;We has met the enemy, and he is us.&quot;

Wonder how that translates into Spanish?