The reason I ask this question is that as a single person, I find it much more affordable to travel in Europe. From the east coast, the airfare seems to be cheaper than for me to fly to other parts of the US. The European hotels actually sell hotel rooms that just aren't for double occupancy, and they seem to be affordably priced for singles. The transportation system in Europe is much better, so there's not always the need to rent a car. Theatre and musical venues in major cities in Europe are a bargain compared to ticket prices in major US cities. And many of the entrances fees to museums and venues in Europe are either very inexpensive or free. And, yes, I do know that I can get into the Smithsonian for free.<BR><BR>Don't get me wrong, I've been to many states, cities and national parks in the US and have wonderful memories, but unless I travel with someone else, I find that traveling within my own country as a single person is extremely expensive. Anyone else feel the same way?<BR><BR>Don't get me wrong, I am proud to be an American, and I would not live anywhere else than in the US.

I disagree w. your first assertion. I would argue most of 'us' in the US do not travel to Europe, at least not until we're older (on a recent trip to Italy the majority of Americans I saw were retirees).<BR><BR>After visiting Europe for the first time, and esp since 9/11, I have an even greater passion to see parts of the US I havent seen yet, ie Maine and the Pacific NWest. As a nature lover, I simply can't beat the American countryside in terms of vastness or beauty.

Mimi, I was making the assumption about the US citizens that participate on this board. I was incorrect in my phrasing and should have limited it to US citizens that participate on the Fodors European Board. Thanks for correcting me, because you are correct that all US citizens do not travel to Europe. Many of my friends say that there is too much to see here.

We travel somewhere in the United States a couple times a year and usually once a year to Europe. For us the call of Europe is the length of her history. My passion is travel...it can be south of my back yard...Oh! If there were only more money and time!

I started annual trips to Europe after I had spent quite a few summer vacations in the USA. Now that I am retired, I take two long trips a year: one to Europe and one somewhere in the USA. I have different trip objectives for each continent. The USA has the best national parks and the best scenic places to visit, other than the Alps of Switzerland and parts of Austria.<BR>I would not want to give up either.<BR>

For some reason, it doesn't get my blood "all excited" to plan a trip to places in the US - - and yet, once I go sonewhere here in America, I do love it, and wonder why I don't travel more here stateside.<BR><BR>Having said that, let me clarify that I do travel here within the US more often than I make trips to Europe. The trips are more often planned on a lot shorter notice, don't last nearly as long (of course), and often have (at least) a "side purpose", related to our kids or work.<BR><BR>I both agree and disagree about your central thesis Leslie - - as to the cost of traveling solo. I just returned from a solo trip to Tucson, where I stayed one night at a Rodeway Inn ($36 a night), and two nights at the Loews' Ventana Canyon resort ($170 a night, special meeting rate). In their own way, both provide very high value for what they portend to be. The room at the Rodeway could have accommodated two adults, and perhaps even one or two small kids. They actually did include (a lackluster) breakfast, even at that cheap price. The Loews is an incredible luxury property, though all dining (especially room service) is horribly over-priced (even if very well done) - - and outrageous telephone surcharges too!<BR><BR>This is quite tangential, but one new trend (I guess maybe it's a trend) really irritated me on this trip. FOUR separate taxes added to my car rental ("airport concessions recoup surcharge", Arizona surcharge, Maricopa county surcharge, and state sales tax) - - for a whopping 28.7%!!! Gee, how dare we complain about Italy now!?<BR><BR>Hope this thread generates plenty more good dialogue.<BR><BR>Best wishes,<BR><BR>Rex<BR>

Rex, so the hotel in Arizona was affordable, but you still had to rent a car, and the tax was more than 25% of the cost of the car. Add that together and it's not that cheap. And you didn't even mention what the cost of the airline ticket was. Could you have flown to somewhere in Europe and stayed for the same number of days that you did in Arizona for less than the cost of your Arizona trip? Also, if this was a business trip, then you can't really compare it to vacation planning (where hopefully there is some flexibility to take advantage of good rates), as many that travel for business sometimes go on short notice and they frequently have to buy airline tickets without restrictions in case they need to cancel.<BR><BR>Any people that travel on their own want to comment on this thread?

Being an architecture lover, the cities of the US just don't do it for me like the older European cities do. However, I could not live without out our national parks and areas such as Hudson River Valley/Berkshires, Northern California,<BR>New Mexico/Arizona etc. etc. I don't like one country or continent more than the other. God feeds my soul with his wonderful creations everywhere.

Leslie,<BR><BR>I certainly didn't mean to be argumentative with you - - I said that I both agreed and disagreed with your premise.<BR><BR>There are lots of airfares across the US for about $200, and almost none to Europe that cheap. And I was able to fly from Ohio to Arizona (2000 miles, two time zones, three hours), and land in a surprisingly different culture/climate with essentially no fatigue factor. Had a full normal day at home the day before and the day after.<BR><BR>So, US travel can be easier. It might or might not be harder or easier to find good budget travel value and/or enjoyment.<BR><BR>But I thought your question (reading from the header) was about the PASSION to explore one versus the other.<BR><BR>I am less passionate to plan a trip to explore Mississippi or parts of west Texas I've never seen, the Wisconsin Dells or Key West. But I'm not sure that affordability (as a solo single or otherwise) enters into it all that much.<BR>

Leslie: My desire to travel is based on my interests more than whether it's in England, France, Italy or Idaho. The extra excitement about going to Europe comes, for me I think, in the fact that it takes extra planning, time off, prep work, etc.<BR><BR>My passion is history. I'd been to Jamestown, Boston, born & raised outside of Philadelphia. In other words, I took my trek into our own history as far back as I could before I ever went to Europe in order to go even further back.<BR><BR>We also take a few trips around the US each year and have seen much of our country--Williamsburg probably 30 times, Yellowstone, New Jersey, New York City, Idaho, Texas,DisneyWorld more than once, most of New England many times, etc. We still plan to go to New Mexico, California, Arizona and a few other states. So, to answer your question, yes, there is passion, just not the same depth of anticipation each trip.<BR><BR>

I couldn't agree with you more. <BR><BR>But I'll take it one step further. And remember were talking about traveling too and not living. The US remains top on my places to live but is sliding down that list lately.<BR><BR>Take this simple test: where would you rather visit starting with these large Cities? Cleveland or Paris? Dallas or London? Any LARGE American city or Paris and London? How about these winners of “Small town American” awards and these small European Cities? Clarksville, Missouri or Eze France? Lanesboro, Minnesota, or St Gilgen? Or any SMALL city in Oklahoma, Texas, Iowa (Any South and Midwest city) Vs Portofino Italy? Would you spend $50 dollars more to go to Italy instead of Florida? All the above the US comes in a distant last place.<BR><BR>The US is Boring compared to most any other country. Architecturally the US lacks it. History we killed that off on the mainland, (What Indians?) Were close to killing the history of the Islands off too. For the most part, America’s tolerance of others, including foreigners is pathetic. Ever hear “Go home ###!” in the Ichiro rooting section at Safeco field? Well I have. I have yet to have trouble outside the US but have been mugged in Boise and Baltimore. Heck in Thailand a complete stranger lent me his motorcycle for the day! <BR><BR>What does America have? Sheer beauty if we can keep our hands off it. <BR><BR>I was spoiledly born in drabby Ohio (Ohio, my favorite Midwestern State next to Wisconsin, yet have NO desire to go back). Thankfully the parents took all 8 of us kids to Europe for a year. I remember the white snow there looked prettier than the black exhaust snow in Ohio. We also traveled the US in our Winnebago. We had to escape the Midwest as often as possible! Looking back we escaped to Florida of all places! <BR><BR>I have lived at least a year in the places that follow: Ohio, San Diego, San Jose, San Fran, The Big Island, Oahu, Baltimore, New York City, Naples Florida, and settled in beautiful Seattle. <BR><BR>I travel on a Gold Wing through out the US every summer. And for several reasons, I refuse to travel AGAIN in the South, IE TX… YUK! There is not one inch of the US I have not traveled except Alaska. I’m riding there this summer, partially because I’ll get travel in Canada. <BR><BR>Given a choice of US places to live or visit in order are San Fran, NYC, Seattle, Boston, and Portland. Sadly the Hawaiian Islands (lived there for 5 years) are no longer a proud and soothing place. Did we screw up their rich Royal history and culture or what? Yes us tourists (And golfers!) are to blame. <BR><BR>So any vacation other than he US is a thrill to plan. Put me on a plane or a boat and I’m gone. Heck a train to Canada will do. Even Vancouver tops any US city for peace, kindness and tranquility. Have you ever noticed that once you cross the border into Canada the people loose about 200 pounds? They look stylish healthy and fun. <BR><BR>The people of Europe, Thailand, any Island, etc have an inner peace to them. It comes with not having life served on a silver platter to them. Admit it, Americans are spoiled. And most people who travel understand this. So take me anywhere where the simple things in life are still appreciated. My next destinations are, The South of France in Feb, Alaska this summer and Afghanistan in late summer. <BR><BR>So am I a spoiled? Of course I am, I’m American and have been there and done America!<BR><BR><BR>

Leslie - I'm not sure if you are asking in terms of affordability or desire. I agree that Europe (after air) is more affordable - at least how I travel. I stay at guesthouses and often eat at street side vendors in Europe. This will generally set me and my wife back about 30-40 USD whereas we are fortunate to get by on 50-70 USD in the US (and that is generally for a hole in the wall).<BR>As far as desire - America is incredible! The national parks of southern Utah, the Pacific NW, NE, so much to see and do in the US. I usually travel about twice a year to US destinations and once a year overseas. Both are fascinating.

Leslie, I must admit I don't have the same passion as I once did. We try to do a National Park each year with the kids--really experiencing it with hiking, rafting, nature tours, etc.--but we've found as a family that we miss the challenge and excitement of taking on a different culture and language. <BR><BR>Like you, we're on the East Coast with some direct routes and travel to Europe has become easy for us. <BR><BR>Are other posters finding the same thing--we can't even imagine going back to Disney World, even though one of our children is still quite young. After a few trips to Europe, it just plain seems silly to take a Synthetic Vacation, USA style. We took seven trips to Disney over the years, and I don't remember a single one as being relaxing and enjoyable, whereas I feel that even the first day with jet lag in Paris can be nothing less than wonderful. If it's raining or if we're pooped, a few restful hours in a cafe watching Parisian life is still magical.

Good question Leslie,<BR>After 10 trips to Europe in the past 7 years and 21 trips overall, we will be spending 2 weeks in the Tetons and Yellowstone in late May. It hit me as we were sitting in the Dolomites and my wife commented about the similarity with the Tetons. I had to admit that I had never been---now is the time.

A much greater percentage of my travel would be international if I didn't have a child and had more vacation time. However, the former is something I wouldn't change for all the trips in the world, and the latter will have to wait until I get another job. In regards to cost, I find that I can spend a lot less on hotels in Europe. Airfare is generally less to travel domestically. Most of our domestic trips so far have been by car, however. If I were to decide between a two week trip by air to a U.S. destination where I needed to rent a car, I would have a hard time choosing it over an international destination. That is why I still haven't made it to many places out west yet. I take a lot of 2-day to one week vacations closer to home to take my daughter to the beach (she is not quite 3 yet) and to visit historic sites. Since I live in northern North Carolina, I am so close to many great historic sites in Virginia, Maryland, Pennsylvania, D.C, South Carolina, and of course my own state. I have been to only 17 states (soon to add an 18th) so far but also to 17 countries. So that kind of answers the question. My goals are to see all 50 states, 50 countries, and revisit many of my favorite countries several times each. I wonder which number I will reach first. If it comes down to Nebraska and Thailand, I know which will win.

Hi Leslie-interesting question. One of the big reasons we like traveling in Europe is the transportation system there. We really like being able to go by train and bus so easily. When I moved to D.C. three years ago, I gave up my car. (my husband still has his)That is not possible in the U.S. except in very limited areas and Amtrak is so expensive. Also, we lived in Colo. and Oregon for years and hiked and backpacked all over the mountains, but now I enjoy the European approach to hiking vacations where you can hike from village to village or hut to hut with a small pack and not have to camp out and carry a 50 lb. pack. I agree with the posters who said you can't beat the natural beauty of the U.S. But without car travel, it's a hard place to get around.

Thanks for the responses. They are getting better and better. I think what I was actually getting at is affordability and transportation for a single person. <BR><BR>It's much more affordable for me to go to Europe as a single person -- I don't have the expense of a car in Europe as the train systems are excellent, and the hotels in Europe rent rooms that accommodate singles, doubles and families (here in the US we have double occupancy rooms, and if it's not occupied by 2, then there is a surcharge for the single). In the US, in order to get from point A to B without a car, it's almost impossible. For example, if I wanted to go to the national parks in Utah, I would have to rent a car or else go on an organized tour. Amtrak doesn't go there. But, if I go with another person and share the cost of a car, then this trip becomes affordable. Similarly, if I go to Europe with another person, and share a room, the hotel does become more affordable. I'm not mentioning the cost of a car because I rarely if ever rent one, but that cost usually is cheaper in the US than in Europe.<BR><BR>I don't want to knock the charm of any destination in the US -- it's just that it's more expensive to get there on your own and more expensive to stay there. <BR><BR>Here's another example, when I was in Prague in November, my airfare from Boston to Prague was $389, and my hotel for 9 nights was $378. Granted, I do not plan my vacations during the high season. My trip to Budapest in the middle of March will cost me $403 for the airfare and $256 for the hotel. Where in the US could I go for less than $800 for 9 nights including hotel and air? By the way the roundtrip mileage for each of those destinations from Boston is about 7500 miles. I don't think it is possible for me get a reasonable airfare and stay in the heart of any major city in the US for that price.<BR><BR>I was in New York City in December for 3 nights. Now, I happened to have won that trip, which included the airfare, hotel, theatre tickets, a limousine (which was nice, but a cab would have sufficed), and that trip cost $450 each for the airline tickets (on the US Air shuttle) and $278 per night for the hotel at the Helmsley Park Lane. The tickets for the theatre were $100 for each seat. If I had to pay for that mini-vacation on my own, I never would have out-of-pocketed that money. I would have gone to New York, but would have shopped around and paid less.<BR><BR>Possibly I get more passionate about planning my trips when the price is affordable. And, possibly I need to do some bargain hunting here in the US.<BR><BR>Lastly, I find it interesting that some of you that mentioned trips in the US frequently said that they only lasted a few days. Is that because of the costs involved?

I'm not single, and my husband & I live in the West, so a trip to Europe is almost always more expensive to get there, and it takes us, really, a whole day to get there (mid-morning flight to the East coast or Chicago, then take the evening flight across the ocean to arrive the next morning).<BR><BR>During my childhood, my parents took our family on many long trips throughout the U.S. As a result, I've been to 48 of the states, and I have many, many wonderful memories and experiences to look back on.<BR><BR>However, as an adult, until we had kids, my husband & I focused on European trips. Now that we have kids, we take more U.S. trips. Definitely, we take shorter trips - we only have so much vacation time - plus one one-week trip in the U.S. each year. The shorter ones are shorter in the interest of time or money, or they're in conjunction with someone's business trip. We will continue to take those U.S. trips. There are a bunch of destinations in the U.S. that we can reach by car or via a $200/per person plane ticket for a nice long weekend.<BR><BR>I will say that both of us have more of a passion for European trips. One reason is that we love to experience the pace & feel of a different culture. Also, our interests are found more there than here - museums with world-class art, hundreds or thousands of years of history, cities where we don't need a car, and can walk to almost everything we want to see (or easily-accessible public transportation), and small towns where we can also walk around, people-watch, eat at a quiet outdoor cafe in the evening. That isn't available in too many U.S. towns or cities. (We're trying to visit all those that do fit our interests!)<BR><BR>U.S. does have much more beautiful geography, national parks and outdoor sights (and sites), and we have and will continue to visit those too (IMO, there's nothing in the world like Yellowstone Park). However, as we live in the mountains, when we want a change of pace from our every-day life, we tend to head to civilization, rather than away from it. When we lived in big cities, we tended to go to the wilderness or the mountains on vacation.

An interesting question, Leslie.<BR>As I think about our "serious" travels over the past 15 years, we first covered a good part of the Western half of the US--the Southwest, the Rockies, Yosemite and the Northwest. They were indeed a series of glorious memorable trips. It was only after pretty much covering what we wanted to see in the US that we started visiting Europe a few years ago. <BR>Why did we select the US first? I'm not sure, but it might have been pure economics, since we usually used FF miles, and you need few miles for domestic flights. In retrospect, however, I think we made a wise decision. Our trips out west were active ones--hiking, climbing, etc. And, frankly, now that we're older, I'm not sure we could today it the same way today! <BR>Did I have the same passion for our US travel as we have today for our European travel? A definite yes. Nothing we've seen in Europe, for example, can match the splendor the the Grand Tetons and Yosemite or the thrilling sight of Monument Valley at sunrise. But then, nothing in the US can match the passion we feel for Italy and the Italians nor the thrill of emerging from the railroad station in Venice and seeing the Grand Canal in all its glory!

An interesting thread, to say the least.<BR><BR>I think one of the key components here is that, in America, if one doesn't drive one is basically helpless. There are something like 15,000 train departures DAILY in England alone. <BR><BR>However, Amtrak here is outrageously expensive and totally unreliable + there are whole areas of the country that cannot be reached by rail (or commercial air, for that matter). Our bus system is basically a joke for many of the same reasons. Here, you rent a car or you're out of luck.<BR><BR>A friend of mine from England travels here in the States every couple of years or so (and loves it!) and always buys the Amrail Pass. He's been on trains that have arrived as much as SIXTEEN HOURS LATE and he figures the average is 3-4 hours behind schedule. Again, there are some places he simply can't get to because there are no connections.<BR><BR>Once I called Amtrack about taking a train from Wichita to Denver. First, there were NO TRAINS out of Wichita. The nearest was a little town called Newton, I think it was, and I was told that the trip to Denver (about 9 hours by car) would take 22 hours on AMTRACK because I would have to go to California (or Montana) first then double back on some podunk line into Denver! Amazing. And for this we taxpayers only have to shell out something like 1.2 million dollars a day to subsidize our "national" rail service.<BR><BR>In a nutshell, Americans seem to think of train travel as a thing of the past where as the Europeans, Japanees, etc. see it as one of the only viable (and in their cases affordable) mass transit system(s) of the future.<BR><BR>The saddest thing about travel to Europe to me is seeing BUDGET INN, McDONALDS, BURGER KING, WALMART, et.al, blighting the cities and towns, and I see it more and more each trip.<BR><BR>Sure, a country the size of the U.S.A. has a lot to see and do, but with each passing year it all becomes a bit more homogenized and car-oriented. <BR><BR>If one fell asleep riding as a passenger in a car on an Interstate and suddenly awoke upon approaching a major city, most of us would be hard pressed to say if we were coming into Chicago, Atlanta, Kansas City, or Boston.<BR><BR>I'm a die-hard patriot, but when it comes to travel give me just about anywhere in Europe over just about anywhere here at home.