Nickvein

Hi, out there.
I'm planning a trip to Italy with my wife to celebrate our 2nd wedding anniversary. The idea is to cover as much as we can, mixing romance, history, culture, good food, sightseeing (by car, by train, by boat), beach, water... tons of museums and history, but also time to relax. We're relatively young, at 30 both.
We're planning to stay for a month, so this is the itinerary I was thinking of. Please let me know what you think...

DAY 1: ROME
DAY 2: ROME
DAY 3: ROME
DAY 4: ROME
DAY 5: ROME – PISA – FLORENCE
DAY 6: FLORENCE
DAY 7: FLORENCE
DAY 8: FLORENCE
DAY 9: FLORENCE – BOLOGNA - MILAN
DAY 10: MILAN
DAY 11: MILAN – COMO
DAY 12: COMO – VERONA
DAY 13: VERONA – VENICE
DAY 14: VENICE
DAY 15: VENICE
DAY 16: VENICE
DAY 17: VENICE – RAVENNA – ASSISI – PERUGIA
DAY 18: PERUGIA – POMPEII – NAPLES
DAY 19: NAPLES
DAY 20: NAPLES – PALERMO (Overnight Boat/Cruise)
DAY 21: PALERMO
DAY 22: PALERMO – MARSALA – AGRIGENTO
DAY 23: AGRIGENTO – TAORMINA
DAY 24: TAORMINA – SORRENTO
DAY 25: SORRENTO – CAPRI – SORRENTO
DAY 26: SORRENTO – SARDINIA
DAY 27: SARDINIA
DAY 28: SARDINIA
DAY 29: SARDINIA
DAY 30: SARDINIA – SORRENTO – ROME

I think 4 nights stay each at Rome, Florence and Venice should be OK, right? Yes, you'll probably tell I should take Milan out, but I can't since we'll be visiting an old college friend of mine over there. Not sure if enought time in Naples / Sicily. The idea of Sardinia is just to relax / beach / water, etc, etc.

Please let me know what you think, and all your advice.
Thanks again.
Best,

Nicolas

alihutch

I'm biased, but one night in Como seems to be a short time.....Sardinia is lovely!

ssachida

I'd visit capri via a ferry from naples before heading to sicily. You can then go directly from Sicily (Trapani) to Sardinia and also go directly from Sardinia to Rome. You are only using Sorrento as a connections hub and you can avoid it entirely. The Taormina portion of your trip maybe a bit rushed. You'll only get one evening there ... another day or half day would be nice ... or skip it entirely and go from Agrigento to Trapani for your ferry to Sardinia.

So:
naples
naples to capri to naples
naples to palermo
palermo
palermo to agrigento
agrigento to marsala to trapani
trapani to sardinia
sardinia for a few days
sardnia to rome

zeppole

Hi Nickvein,

In general, you should pick fewer bases and do some of your one-nighters as day trips. For instance, you can day trip to Verona from Venice or Milan. Likewise, Ravenna from Venice. You can day trip to Perugia from Florence.

Your day 17 is just unworkable. You can't see all those things in one day.

I think Taormina is quite a haul from Agrigento. Are you stopping there on your way to a ferry back to the mainland? Also, do realize that the best preserved Greek temple in Italy is Paestum, just a bit south of Salerno and the Amalfi coast, reachable on the train line from Napoli. You might include Paestum in your Napoli stay, and eliminate Agrigento from Sicily. Another way to include Paestum would be to ferry to Salerno after Sicily, visit Paestum, then head to Capri.

Also, is there some reason you are returning to Sorrento from Sardegna instead of just ferrying back to Rome?

I would give some consideration to either flying open jaw into Venice and out Rome, or, if that's not possible, consider going directly to Venice from Rome by train, and working your way south.

Were you to extend the time you spend in bases, you could rent apartments in some locations and cut costs.

I would consider the following as day trips from bases:

Venice -- day trips to Verona and Ravenna
Rome -- day trip to Assisi (not the greatest way to do it, but might work for you.)
Milano -- day trip to Varenna/Bellagio for lunch on Lago di Como (also could do Verona from Milan)
Lago di Como -- day trip to Milan
Florence -- day trip to Perugia, Pisa
Naples -- day trip to Pompeii, Capri, Sorrento, Paestum
Palermo -- Marsala as a day trip

Can you get a ferry from Sicily to Sardegna? If so, I would bunch together all your time in the Napoli/Sorrento area to include Capri, and then just head straight to Sardegna from Sicily. If you do that, you might be able to give a little more time to Sicily. Right now you are really on a gallop.

There are lots of ways to skin this cat, but I think you'll have a cheaper, more relaxing trip if you don't have to haul your luggage through train stations so often, and right now, some of your overnights are too ambitious.

zeppole

PS: I also want to know how you plan to top this for your 3rd wedding anniversary.

mamcalice

I think you have a fabulous trip planned but, unfortunately, too little time to see all of the places you plan. You are spending far too little time in Sicily. You might eliminate Milan and travel from Florence to Lake Como, Bellagio and Verona on your way to Venice, thus saving a day or two for Sicily. I agree your day 17 won't allow you to do anything but pass through the locations. Have you considered an open-jaw flight into Rome and out of Venice, coverning the southern towns first and moving north? You may save a bit of travel time that way.

mamcalice

Sorry, I just realized you have to visit a friend in Milan so my suggestion to eliminate it won't work.

zeppole

One other thought, nickvein:

You should check to see if you can fly out of Sardegna to the US via Rome on a same-day ticket. The last US bound flight from Rome leaves after 1pm (last I looked), so a single-ticket that has you leaving Sardegna in the morning and connecting with a US bound flight will help stretch your time-budget.

You always run a slight risk that storms will cancel flights that morning and you'll miss the connection, so if you'll lose your job arriving back a day late, don't risk it. But otherwise, if it's available and affordable, I'd book it (on a single ticket, not a separate one.)

zeppole

Other Fodor's posters may show up to hoot at me for having so many afterthoughts, but mamcalice's post did make me think that perhaps you should eliminate Sicily from this trip, heartbreaking as that sounds. You are going to see so little there, it does seem to me the game is not worth the candle.

To me, a more enjoyable trip would look like this:

Fly into Venice, do northern part of itinerary (lakes and Milan, Verona and Ravenna)

Move on to Florence, and then spend an extended period in Umbria at an agriturismo, touring in a relaxed fashion with a car rental

Drive the car rental to Civitavecchia, get on a car ferry, go to Sardegna.

Tour Sardegna with car, get on a car ferry to Sorrento, drive to Salerno, see Paestum, drop off the car. Spend night.

Next morning take ferry to Positano for a few days, see Capri as a day trip.

Switch to Napoli for a few days and see Pompeii, etc.

Go to Rome -- fly home.


I would avoid flying out of Venice because of problems with early morning flights.

If I think of anything else, I'll let you know!

zeppole

Back again, nickvein, since I'm burning a midnight candle:

Rather than cut Sicily, I would reduce the time on the Amalfi coast to a drive-by, or ferry-by. I know it's not the orthodox view, but if you go to Sicliy, you really feel like to you went somewhere. The Amalfi is a "sight" but it's a sight than can easily be seen in a day, plus an overnight in Capril. But the Amalfi culture is a tourist culture, not as exciting as a native culture like Sicily or Sardegna. Keep Pompeii and Naples, since Pompeii is a knockout and important and Napoli is uniquely Italian, and not touristy in the slightest.

So my revised suggestion is:

Fly into Venice. Do northern Italy.

Head to Florence for a few days, then head to an agriturismo in Umbria, with a rental car.

After a few days in Umbria, drive to the Mediterranean, get on a car ferry to Sardegna.

After a few days tour of Sardegna, get on a car ferry to Sicily.

Leaving Sicily, ferry to Salerno. Use car to see Pompei and Paestum. Leave car in Salerno.

Take ferry from Salerno to Capri. One night in Capri.

Take ferry from Capri to Amalfi. Take bus along Amalfi drive, get to Napoli

See Napoli.

See Rome.

Fly home.

I think that's all I can say!

Nickvein

Hi, zeppole, thank you so much for taking the time to comment on my trip. Problem I see, is that I would end my trip in Rome, and we all know Rome includes so much walking and sightseeing. Our idea is to end the trip in relaxing Sardinia, beach, water, and NOT walking, museums, culture, history, etc, etc. But I also know I don't have enough time in Sicily... and I can't take Milan out, since I have my best friend there, and I need to meet his new wife! What would you suggest I take out then / change then? This is my latest itinerary...

DAY 1: ROME
DAY 2: ROME
DAY 3: ROME – VATICAN CITY (Day Tour) – ROME
DAY 4: ROME
DAY 5: ROME – PISA – FLORENCE
DAY 6: FLORENCE
DAY 7: FLORENCE – CINQUE TERRE (Day Tour) – FLORENCE
DAY 8: FLORENCE
DAY 9: FLORENCE – BOLOGNA - MILAN
DAY 10: MILAN
DAY 11: MILAN – COMO
DAY 12: COMO – VERONA
DAY 13: VERONA – VENICE
DAY 14: VENICE
DAY 15: VENICE – ISLANDS of MURANO-BURANO-TORCELLO (Day Tour) – VENICE
DAY 16: VENICE
DAY 17: VENICE – RAVENNA – ASSISI
DAY 18: ASSISI – PERUGIA
DAY 19: PERUGIA – POMPEII – NAPLES
DAY 20: NAPLES
DAY 21: NAPLES – PALERMO (Overnight ferry or cruise)
DAY 22: PALERMO
DAY 23: PALERMO – MARSALA – AGRIGENTO
DAY 24: AGRIGENTO – TAORMINA
DAY 25: TAORMINA – SORRENTO
DAY 26: SORRENTO – CAPRI (Day Tour) – SORRENTO
DAY 27: SORRENTO – SARDINIA
DAY 28: SARDINIA
DAY 29: SARDINIA – CORCEGA (Day Tour) – SARDINIA
DAY 30: SARDINIA
DAY 31: SARDINIA – ROME

Thanks again.
Best,
N

Nickvein

Hi, out there,
Do you think I should take COMO / Italian lakes OUT of the itinerary, and add, let's say, an extra day in Sicily? Since I'll be staying in Sardinia, and Sorrento, and many places with seaview, maybe the lakes is excessive? Let me know what you think. Yes, I know it's a lot of places, and probably I omit some day tours and partial visits along the way, but I'd like to cover as much as I can on this first trip to Iltay. Things I see here, maybe stay in Sicily is short, maybe Como is not ideal within the itinerary, Milan is a MUST since I have to visit my best friend and meet his newly wife, and I want to end in Sardinia, which is, not more walking, culture, museums and sightseeings, but just relax.

Another question. What if I take Ravenna OUT, and go directly from Venice to Assisi (a MUST for my wife and I) to stay for the night, and then, make Perugia a stop (NOT a stay) on my wife to Pompeii / Naples, or even take it OUT from the itinerary all together? For what I see, Assisi and Perugia can be combined on the same day, but Perugia doesn't seem that interesting. I may be wrong, that's why, I'd look forward to your comments. Thanks again. Best,


N

Scarlettdz9

Hey, N,
I am just planning my first trip to Italy myself (hence being on these boards), so I'm afraid that I can't give you advice on the actual trip. What I CAN tell you is that your wife is very blessed that you are taking her on a month's trip to Italy to celebrate your 2nd anniversary! Have a wonderful trip. And if you have an older brother, I want to meet him
Seriously, may this be the first of many memory-making trips for you both.

~Leslie
Oregon, USA

zeppole

Some observations:

If you start in Rome, I suggest you go directly to Venice after that, and work your way south.

Do Pisa as a day trip from Florence

Le Cinque Terre cannot be done as a day trip from Florence, so skip that and give the time to Sicily

Do Bellagio on Lago di Como as a daytrip from Milan if the weather is nice.

Get an apartment in Venice and do both Verona and Ravenna as a day trip from there.

It is almost pointless to try to see Perugia and Assisi in the same 24 hours. How about doing a day trip to Assisi from Florence (2 hours each way on the train).

See Capri as a day trip from Napoli.

Ferry into Catania, not Palermo, to begin Sicily trip in Taormina/Siracusa

Go to Sardegna directly from Sicily.

So something more like this:

DAY 1: ROME
DAY 2: ROME
DAY 3: ROME – VATICAN CITY (Day Tour) – ROME
DAY 4: ROME
DAY 5: ROME – VENICE
DAY 6: VENICE
DAY 7: VENICE – day trip Islands Murano-Burano-Torcello (Torcello is the best)
DAY 8: VENICE - day trip Ravenna
DAY 9: VENICE – stop 8 hours in VERONA on way to MILAN
DAY 10: MILAN
DAY 11: MILAN - day trip to BELLAGIO on Lago di Como
DAY 12: MILAN - FLORENCE
DAY 13: FLORENCE
DAY 14: FLORENCE – Day Trip Assisi
DAY 15: FLORENCE - day trip Pisa
DAY 16: FLORENCE -- NAPOLI
DAY 18: NAPOLI – day trip to Capri – return via the Amalfi Coast
DAY 19: NAPOLI - day trip to Pompeii --NAPOLI --CATANIA (Overnight ferry, leaves 11pm)
DAY 20: CATANIA -- TAORMINA -- SIRACUSA
DAY 21:: SIRACUSA
DAY 22: SIRACUSA -- AGRIGENTO
DAY 23: AGRIGENTO – MARSALA
DAY 24: MARSALA-PALERMO (drop car)
DAY 25: PALERMO
DAY 26: PALERMO – day trip to Monreale
DAY 27: PALERMO -- SARDEGNA
DAY 28: SARDEGNA
DAY 29: SARDINIA – CORCEGA (Day Tour) – SARDINIA
DAY 30: SARDINIA
DAY 31: SARDINIA – ROME

Were it me, just in terms of value of experience, I would drop Verona, and Pisa from the itinerary and give the time to Venice and Florence.

When you've isolated the number of days you can spend in Sicily, put up a separate thread asking about logistics for that part of the trip -- say from Napoli to Sicily to Sardegna. I'm unsure of drive times, ferry skeds, etc. But if you really want to see Taormina, I'd try to get to Catania as your first stop.

zeppole

By the way, that is still a killer schedule without a moment to do laundry, meaning you'll be hauling a lot of clothes. (My solution would be to get a hotel to do it enroute, and pay whatever it costs, no doubt a lot).

Whether it's your itinerary or mine, you will be thrusting yourself into the most touristy experiences of everywhere you, and there is almost nothing on your itinerary that isn't a mega-tourist destination. (You're beating the crowds to Sardegna by a year, perhaps.)

If that isn't the kind of experience you want for your trip, my pick would be to eliminate Venice from the trip, perhaps traveling to Milan via the Ligurian coast, but I would pick someplace less touristy than le Cinque Terre. (Camogli, Santa Margherita Ligure) for two nights.

zeppole

Nick, at the risk of seeming nutty again:

Was taking a walk, and what came back to mind was your remark about Perugia ("doesn't look all that interesting") and I realized that what seems to be governing your trip plans is either reading a guidebook and picking only the 4 star attractions to "see" Italy, or looking a bus tour brochures and using that as a barometer of what to fit into 30 days.

If you've never been to Italy, it can be hard to understand that Italy is not "dotted" with "must-see" 4 star sights separated by miles of nothing-intersting in between -- like Mt. Rushmore and the Rockies or Las Vegas and Disneyland. The most amazing part of Italy, for most people, is not seeing the artistic and historic sights but enjoying the Italian way of life of food, wine, conversation and small town neighborliness, even if that "small town" is a piazza in a bigger city.

You will miss all of that if you glue your nose to a guidebook or tour brochure and barrel into one city after another, only doing what the guidebook tells you is famous and historic.

If you "must see" the famous sights of Rome, Florence, Assisi and Venice on this trip, and you only want to give 8 or 9 of the 30 days to doing it, then consider buying a bus tour package for the first 9 days of your trip that includes those sights efficiently, and spare yourself the disorientation of trying do it all on your own. Use the remaining 20 days for the rest of your trip.

But if you would like to experience something of Italy that isn't a sightsee "top ten hits" marathon, I highly recommend you re-conceive this trip to be more about an anniversary celebration, giving yourselves time to enjoy together the sweetness of Italy -- and less about seeing mega-sights, back to back, wall to wall. If you have no pre-existing huge interest in Italian painting, architecture, and history, don't make the mistake of letting a guidebook lead you around by the nose all day long, all over Italy.

It appears to me that the only "givens" of your trip are: your friend in Milan, your wife's desire to see Assisi, beach time for the last week, and I'm assuming you've already purchased your tickets in and out of Rome. If you don't want a bus tour, consider:

Begin in Rome for 5 days
Go to Umbria for 5 days, staying in or on a farm near Spoleto, a beautiful hill town. If you don't have a car, you can take trains from Spoleto to visit beautiful and fascinating places like Assisi, Perugia and Orvieto, With a car, you can also explore tinier medieval towns plus the Piano Grande (filled with flowers in June!) or Gubbio. You can relax with long lunches.
From there you can move on to Florence, but stay 5 days and do a few day trips.
From there, either visit Venice or head straight to your friend in Milan and the lakes.
After visiting your friend, take a train to Genova, and a ferry to Sardegna.
Ferry to Rome, but I would return a day early in order see at Ostia Antica (near the ferry dock and airport) before flying home.

(If you skip Venice, you can spend more time on the lakes and include the Ligurian seaside, even visiting le Cinque Terre).

Come back next year or later -- even with kids -- to see Amalfi , Pompeii and Sicily. But if you stick with your present conception, you'll only see a theme-park-Italy where you wait on line to get into isolated attractions -- and feel almost nothing of the enjoyment of Italian life and see none of its lovely farms-- which is what most people take home with them as their favorite memory of Italy. Try not to miss it.

I've been looking for a way to make your original itinerary work logistically, because I know you are young and no doubt have the stamina. But in all honesty, so far you are planning a wildly expensive trip with the risk of many things going wrong or turning out miserably -- so I thought I better take it all back and suggest you start over again, or get on a bus!