CuriousByNature2

My husband and I are newly weds and we are planning a trip to Italy this Fall. We definitely can use some help with expert travelers advice.

Before I list a rough draft of our itinerary for advice, I'd like to say that we are interested in seeing architecture, nature, coastline, food/culture, some museums and definitely famous piazzas. We'd like to travel the entire trip via train, buses and the occasional taxi cab. If possible, we'd like to avoid driving (renting car). Can I repeat? We Love food! Any advice where to eat is very very much appreciated.

Here we go! This is a draft overview of our itinerary. Please provide your expert advice on how to improve our travels, if it's realistic, can we avoid car rental?, anything we should alter to include additional places you think is amazing, anything we should exclude, anything worth mentioning to catch on the way, etc.

Sat, Sep 1: Arrive in Venice 7 PM, poke around a bit and have dinner
Sun, Sep2: Spend day in Venice, catch 6:30 PM mass at San Marco cathedral
Mon, Sep3: travel outer islands of Venice, spend evening in Venice
Tue, Sep 4: Train to Pisa (half day). Travel to Cinque Terre. Spend relaxing evening at Cinque Terre area.
Wed, Sep 5: Spend the day at Cinque Terre - sight see coast line. Stay the night.
Thur, Sep 6: Train to Florence. Spend the day and stay the night in Florence.
Fri, Sep 7: Take a day trip to Sienna (Tuscan hilltown). Travel back late evening to Florence.
Sat, Sep 8: Train to Capri. Spend relaxing evening in Capri.
Sun, Sep 9: Spend the day in Capri and another relaxing evening.
Mon, Sep 10: Ferry over to Amalfi coast. Either spend another night in Capri or train to Rome in evening.
Tue, Sep 11: Spend day and night in Rome.
Wed, Sep 12: Spend day and night in Rome.
Thur, Sep 13: Spend day and night in Rome.
Fri, Sep 14: LAST FULL DAY: Spend day and night in Rome.
Sat, Sep 15: Travel back to US

Any advice is appreciated. Thanks.

charnees

Your plan looks pretty good to me. It's a lot of moving from one hotel to another, but it's doable, I think. I would just say that le Cinque Terre and Amalfi/Capri are somewhat similar in that they are beautiful steep coastlines plunging into the sea, with pretty villages on the hills. So it's bit redundant. But if you want lots of coastline, then it's OK.

Jean

I don't think you have a good handle on how long it takes to get from place to place. Your plan "works," but you have little time in some of the places that have the most to see, like Venice, Florence and the Amalfi Coast area. Florence, in particular, stands out. You're only spending half a day in the city, but maybe that's enough for you.

LisaG

Curioous,

Your proposed itinerary involves ALOT of inter-Italy travel. This does not seem like too much of a vacation. All that moving (checking in/out) and training will eat up your days, not to mention the frustration that inevitably accompanies all that travel.

With 2 weeks on the ground, I would recommend something like:

Venice 3 nights
Florence 3 nights
Capri 3 nights
Rome 4 nights

You can take day trips from Venice, Florence, and Capri to see some of the other things you are interested in. For this trip I would recommend skipping Pisa and Cinque Terre.

You can definitely do the above without renting a car. But let me give you an example of how to budget your time. The Florence - Capri leg appears to be about 6 hours with connections. Add the taxi ride to the train station on both ends, the time it takes to get a ticket (often there are very long lines), and the checking in/out on both ends and this is a full-day of just travel on this leg. The train time itself is the only variable. All the other items will take about the same amount of time regardless of how long or short your train ride is.

And remember---the train will be delayed, or the taxi will be late, or the line for tickets will be long. All that stops being fun and novel after a few times.

That's why I would recommend that you cut down on the number of moves you make in this 2 weeks.

More time for eating!

Hope that's useful.

LisaG

Andrew

I enjoyed a second visit to Pisa last fall, but for the average tourist with little time, I'd say an hour or two as a stop off the train is plenty of time: see the Tower and the Field of Miracles and move on. You can take a bus directly between the Pisa Centrale train station and the Field. The Tower of Pisa is just one of those things tourists who visit Italy for the first time need to see...

Pisa is a likely change point on the train between the Cinque Terre and Florence, so you might consider doing your stop in Pisa then. The train from Venice to the Cinque Terre will require at least one change; the fast trains via Milan (one change) may be easiest even if you might find a slightly faster travel time with more changes via Florence and Pisa...

I love the Cinque Terre, but if you aren't going to hike there (you didn't mention that), I too would probably skip it and just do Amalfi, slow your pace down a little and spend a little more time at the other places.

msteacher

I would suggest that with the two days you have alotted to Siena/Florence, I would pick just one of those cities and stay there. They are both beautiful, but you are just setting foot in either one. Either spend both days on Florence (my preference), or go directly to Siena and spend both days there.

bobthenavigator

I would skip one of the coastal destinations. That Pisa/CT day is just not feasible. Give both Venice and Florence more time---only Rome has enogh time to be enjoyable.

nytraveler

Too much moving for me - I would try to do more as day trips.

And you need to do a lot of checking on Capri. If you are staying there you need to be sure to get back in time and IME the ferries shut down in the later afternoon - if you visit the mainland you MUST get back to Capri early - no having dinner on the mainland. When yuo have your hotel there have them help you with schedules of ferries from Naples or Sorrento.

Andrew

Silly suggestion: can you add a few more days? That would give you a little more breathing room...

crazyfortravel

Congratulations and welcome to Fodor's. I'm sure you will find a wealth of information here. I have used the Fodor's site extensively when planning our vacations.

I've been to Capri and Cinque Terre. They are both beautiful places. We went to Cinque Terre just before it was overrun by tourism. It was unique to experience the towns joined only by foot path and train. I understand the hiking trails may remain closed for some time due to the terrible tragedy last year (hurricane/flooding). They are rebuilding and open for tourism but forever changed. I know they need the tourism dollars right now but my inclination would be to skip Cinque Terre and add the extra time to Florence.

I'm not a big fan of Florence (to each his/her own). The extreme heat may have put a damper on our visit. I preferred Siena. In any case, I don't think part of a day will do it justice. There are some wonderful museums and galleries - The Uffizi, The Bargello and The Accademia. The duomo (climb the dome for the best view of it)and the Medici Villa at Castello for the gardens and fountains. You can't possibly do it justice in part of a day.

Capri is very romantic. We spent two nights there and three nights in Sorrento. I do think Sorrento makes a better base to see the Amalfi Coast. We did that same trip twice within a five year period...each time we saw something different. There are lovely towns like Ravello (town perched in a hill overlooking the Amafi Coast) that are less touristy and easily reached by bus. The island of Ischia is much less touristy than Capri and easily reached from Sorrento. If I had to pick one base...Capri or Sorrento...I would go with Sorrento to have better flexibility to see more of the area.

Good luck planning. I'm sure whatever you decide...you'll fall in love with Italy...especially the food and gelato!

ira

Hey CBN,

Have you looked at the train schedules?

Your "relaxing evenings" are more likely to be "drop from exhaustion".

Why both the CT and the AC on the same trip?

I would stay two more nights in Venice and one more on the CT, and keep the AC for another visit. You will go back.

Enjoy your visit.

mamcalice

Given the interests that you listed, you will have a difficult time visiting and enjoying many of your stops. I would definitely add a day or two to Florence (my favorite destination in Italy. I would, as suggested by many, choose either the AC or CT. As noted above, there is little chance that you will have "relaxing evenings" and also see the sights in your destinations. Too much moving around, too little time to appreciate the wonders of Italy.

Venice, Florence, the AC (or CT) and Rome can all be done by train; it will be a busy trip but you will be able to remember something besides the inside of trains and train stations.

kybourbon

>>>Tue, Sep 4: Train to Pisa (half day).<<<

Yes, it will eat up half a day just traveling from Venice to Pisa. You haven't considered the logistics of all this travel. Checking out of your hotel in Venice, catching a vaporetto to the train station in Venice, train to Florence, change trains for Pisa, stand in line to store luggage in Pisa (you can't drag it with you to visit the tower), bus to tower, bus back to train station, stand in line again to retrieve luggage, train to CT (another 1 1/2-2 hours on the train). You will have spent the entire day traveling and checking in and out of hotels.

I would drop one of your coastal areas and would stay on the Amalfi coast instead of Capri. Ferries to the island don't run late and if the sea is rough they can be cancelled.

Are your flights already booked?

CuriousByNature2

Thank you everyone for your helpful advice. Your suggestions are definitely accounted and I made the following adjustments. Can you review the revised itinerary and comment on travel logistics, transportation wisdom? We are really excited and want to book our flight this week. Any suggestions on booking flight?

Itinerary adjusted:

Sat, Sep 1: Arrive in Venice 7 PM, poke around a bit and have dinner
Sun, Sep 2: Spend day in Venice, catch 6:30 PM mass at San Marco cathedral. ***any advice catching this event?*** (stay in Venice)
Mon, Sep 3: Explore Venice some more (stay in Venice)
Tue, Sep 4: Explore Venice and catch a ride to the outer island for half a day. (Stay in Venice)
Wed, Sep 5: Train to Florence. Enjoy the last half of day in Florence. (stay in Florence)
Thur, Sep 6: Explore Florence. (stay in Florence)
Fri, Sep 7: Either take day trip to tuscan hilltowns or continue to explore more of Florence. (stay in Florence)
Sat, Sep 8: Train to Sorrento. Explore Amalfi Coast area. (stay in Sorrento)
Sun, Sep 9: Explore Amalfi Coast area. (stay in Sorrento)
Mon, Sep 10: Ferry over to Capri. Day trip in Capri. (stay in Sorrento)
Tue, Sep 11: Train to Rome. Spend day and night in Rome.
Wed, Sep 12: Spend day and night in Rome.
Thur, Sep 13: Spend day and night in Rome.
Fri, Sep 14: LAST FULL DAY: Spend day and night in Rome.
Sat, Sep 15: Travel back to US

Questions:

Should we stay on the outskirt of Venice to save money? If yes, is it safe to do so?

Any alternative flight plan that can be more cost effective than flying into Venice and leaving out of Rome?

Should we stay in hotels near the train station?

Any advice when we transfer between places?

Sassafrass

Venice is actually not big, so IMO, just about any place within Venice proper works. Just be sure you are in Venice, not Mestre, and I would not stay on the Lido or even Giudecca for a first visit. Personally, I like Dorsoduro area because it is quiet and away from the crowds of San Marco, but there are many good places. Look at one of your guide books that have maps of the cities. Rick Steves' Italy actually has nice ones in the front of the book.

One question: Do you not have any interest in seeing Pompeii? You could stop there on your way from Florence to Sorrento, or on your way from Sorrento to Rome.

With your current plan, open jaw into Venice and out of Rome is best. If you switched Rome with the AC (AC at the end of your trip rather than Rome), you could fly out of Naples. I would check on costs and compare. It might be a tad more money, but you wouldn't be back tracking to Rome from the AC. You might have a connection in Milan with some layover time, but again, compare a layover with time spent on the train back to Rome - might be a wash. I like the Naples airport - small, easy to navigate. Still, if your flight from Rome is direct, I would stick with that and the plan you have.

In most places other areas are nicer than near the train station, so you can usually do better than staying there. However, I've stayed near the station in all the major cities with no problems, just depends on what you find available. In Florence, nothing is really very far from the station, five or six blocks and you are right in the center. I don't find the station area as convenient in Rome, would rather be closer to major sights.

Almost envious of you - there is nothing like Italy the first time you go. I like taking friends so I can see it anew through their eyes. You have a great tirp worked out now.

crazyfortravel

Your plan looks much more managable and I think you'll enjoy the toned down pace.

I think you will find that flying into Venice and out of Rome will be more economical than flying out of Naples but it never hurts to compare all your options before booking your accommodations.

In Venice, we stayed in Dorsoduro at the Hotel Galleria http://www.hotelgalleria.it/. It was easy to find as it is a stone throw from the Accademia Bridge (this is something that can not be said of all hotels). We saw people dragging luggage all over Venice looking lost...trying to find their hotels. We took the #1 Vaporetto to Academia Bridge and voila! It was very convenient and our room overlooked the Grand Canal. The room was clean and comfortable. For the price, we thought it was great value. We would wake up to the smell of fresh baked goods every morning.

My sister has used this group of B&B's for a tour group in Florence. It is really good value http://www.johanna.it/rates.html

The area around the train station in Rome is rather seedy IMO although there are many inexpensive hotels near there. I'm not sure what your budget is but I can recommend a hotel near the Spanish Steps...http://www.hotelforte.com/eng/home.htm

We stayed at the Hotel Tirrenia in Sorrento both times we were there. We got an awesome price and it is a short walk into town...http://www.tirreniahotel.com/

CuriousByNature2

Thanks CRT. Great tips on hotel stay. We definitely can use hotel advice.

Does anyone have recommendations between purchasing a Eurail pass or just purchase individual short stop tickets at the train station?

Andrew

I would just buy train tickets as you go in Italy. Train tickets are pretty cheap, except for the Eurostar (fast) trains you'll probably take between Venice, Florence, and Rome. For other destinations, regional trains are cheap and work fine in my experience. Do some planning ahead of time to figure out the train connections and frequencies between towns though so you aren't caught flat footed when you get there when a train take much longer than you expected or has too many connections. Venice, Florence, Rome is super frequent and fast if you take the Eurostar, however. You'll probably take a train all the way from Florence to Naples, though - and have to connect to the Circumvesuviana from there to Sorrento (kind of a light rail train) - you buy tickets for that when you arrive in Naples. Just have that stuff figured out ahead of time.

Don't forget: if you ride regional trains in Italy, you MUST validate your ticket in a machine BEFORE you get on the train! Trains like the Eurostar with seat reservations on a specific day/time don't have to be validated.

I notice you deleted Siena as a specific day trip from Florence. I highly recommend you add that back. It's really a beautiful town. I stayed three nights in Florence with a day trip to Siena (half day actually) and found Siena a highlight of my trip for sure! The bus actually works better from Florence to Siena than the train, though.

Pisa is also a quick trip (by train) from Florence. Consider a quick few hour trip there as an option in Florence, depending on how much time you have. Siena is a much more appealing town than Pisa to most people, except Pisa has that icon the Tower...

Do stay on Venice and not in Mestre. Venice is very crowded during the day - almost like Disneyland in some parts, obnoxious - but is much nicer at night and in the morning. You miss most of that if you aren't staying on Venice. It's worth paying more to stay there. People who have been to Venice only during the day can wind up hating it and not understand why people love it - but it's truly magical at night/in the early morning before the crowds arrive. Look around and you can find some decent deals on apartments or B&Bs instead of hotels there. My first time in Venice, I wound up at a decent 1BR apartment for about $100/night (per person price - I was solo) in a good location. Two years later I stayed there again. Hotels nearby appeared to be smaller and more expensive. (The apartment has changed ownership since then so I can't recommend it anymore.)

Sometimes I do stay by the train station depending on the town; sometimes I don't. Location is important and you don't want to waste too much of your time trekking back and forth between your lodgings and the sites. It is also pretty fun to walk out of your hotel/B&B front door and be in a fun area instead of having to walk/taxi/bus to it, even though your initial walk from the train station was quick.

kmh7

I am also jealous of your plans. There really is nothing like the first time in Italy!! The only thing I have to add is this. I know you don't want to drive but the chianti wine road out of Florence is amazing!! It can only be experienced in the same when you can go at your own pace. There are so many wonderful small towns with the most wonderful food you will ever have. Some of our favorite moments have been discovering the beauty (and food) of this area. It is quite easy to pick up a car for just a day out of Florence and not scary at all to drive. You wouldn't regret it I promise!!

crazyfortravel

It has been my experience that you can get much better point to point fares and will save over a rail pass for travel in Italy. The Trenitalia sight has some great specials if you purchase online. You will need to buy your ticket Florence to Naples and Naples to Rome (Firenze to Napoli and Napoli to Roma) and then the local train (Circumvesuviana) from Naples to Sorrento is purchased separately. The website for the local trains is http://www.vesuviana.it/web/en