Marija

There's no getting around it, going on a cruise is expensive. We should compile a ballpark price list for different cruises so people can see what kind of money is involved and if they're still interested. I agree that a week is minimum and I too would prefer longer but probably not 20 days. We don't want to plan a short cruise trying to accommodate people who won't go anyway because they find it too expensive.

Kathie

Yes, the Jayarvarman looks great! Your cost comparison is helpful, Leslie. I like the idea of the upper Mekong cruise, but thought the prices were on the high side for what they appear to be offering. I also agree that a week long cruise is about right (though personally, I'm tempted by the Ganges).

Marija

Now that the ownership of the Ganges cruise has changed, perhaps they'll let Tangata on and he can be our canary.

Kathie

BTW, Andy, I expect mayhem will ensue with this group on any length of cruise.

dogster

Good morning from Saigon.

Kathie

Good morning. I trust you slept well.

indianapearl

gpanda: Who is a crackpot?

Shorter is better for me. Don't know what my upper limit is in confined quarters . . .

Lusting for India.

Why don't we decide on:

a) length of trip
b) destination
c) cost per day
d) best dates

We can prioritize later.

indianapearl

dogster: Your Saigon hotel in its original iteration looks like it was designed by Antonin Gaudi. Yes, no?

dogster

Almost indiana - what a wonderful structure it was in the old days, pure Art Deco - destroyed in the 1950's in a fit of hideous Vietnamese modernisation. Inside, however, it's still full of art-deco touches.

I'll attend to the final touches to Dogster's botox and embalming fluid facial and attend to the above chatter in a while.

I would, however, mention that there is a very good reason why the Upper Mekong has not, thus far, featured in the list of Great Places To Go: because it's boring as the proverbial bat-pooh.

The Luang Say cruise covers the same stretch of river. I've been on that. It's a lot of jungle dotted with 'authentic villages', long turned into retail opportunities for the locals. Don't think for an instant that it's adventure. Quite the reverse, it's an Apocalypse Now of hard-eyed villagers, thrusting crap at the visiting cretins. Watch those eyes turn to stainless steel when you don't buy.

The children have been turned into photo-opportunities, ready to turn into Lord of the Flies when you don't give them the obligatory 'One dollahhh' for those cute kiddy pics.

Remember, the 'fast' boat get you the entire distance in eight [very loud] hours. The only good thing about it is the big finish in Luang Prabang.

Now I'll have breakfast, having turned your dreams to stone.

marya_

A tall ca phe sua da sounds very good to me about now. And a hot bowl of pho. Not at the same time though.

You keep right on turning dreams to stone and we'll keep coming back here. Many of us are so sick of all the ginned-up touristic crap we run across when traveling that we find the straight story here most refreshing.

Bon appetit.

dogster

Thanks marya_. I settled for the freshest baguette, still warm from the oven, pate, a soft brie, strawberry yoghurt, dum sum, watermelon juice, fruits and more baguette. Oh, and an egg or two, newly thrown into a black frypan.

Inexplicably, a Japanese couple next to me settled for ham and pineapple, grilled to crispest leather, topped with a chocolate profiterole.

marya_

Well, that was a generous accounting, but now that you have our attention focused on your luxurious breakfast buffet, one detail remains out of focus. Which fruits? Dead serious inquiry. One of the joys of travel in SEA for some of us is the extravagant selection of fruits we don't normally get at home. Any mangosteeens this morning? Rambutans? Other luscious treats? Preferably without a side of profiteroles.

Warm Vietnamese baguettes and strong coffee almost turn one into an apologist for empire...

dogster

Now, back the fray.

Reading back thru the posts, it seems that a week is about right. The logical step is to find a place with a good beginning and a good end so that those with more time can add on juicy pre and post tour adventures, extending their adventure with, or without, like minded companions.

INDIA:
I suggest a close look at the Assam Bengal itineraries, particularly the Hoogli [ Kolkata to Farrakah]. From Farrakah one is stuck with a 5 hour train journey back to Kolkata however this can just as easily become a five hour journey north, heading to Darjeeling and Sikkim. Assam Bengal also extends to Patna, but a brief glimpse at their prices reveals an alarming increase in fares between Sept and Oct. So alarming that on principle, I object. http://assambengalnavigation.com/bengal_sche_winter.htm

As I've caused widespead concern at the Pandaw option, I can do nothing but go with the flow.

BURMA:
The Chindwin seems to be exciting various imaginations. This trip depends entirely on time of year and, as someone noted, Pandaw is booked out with elderly Brits, a floating horror that nobody deserves. The only real option here is to look closely at Pandaw 1947.

http://www.pandaw1947.com/index.php?...ises&Itemid=78

Again, it's do it in September - or don't do it at all.

UPPER MEKONG:
Well, I've said my piece.

Nobody, I note has commented much on the lower Mekong cruises, mostly, I guess, because you think you've already been here. More, obviously, to come. In 5 hours, I'm a passenger on Jayarvarman so I'll report. I'm in a writing mood, so, if things are easy, I'll do a 'Live From..' post.

BACK TO BURMA?

I might add that any Burma river cruise will be totally different from any land tours. If you've already been there, you could happily go again with no sense of repetition. Burma needs a couple of visits to actuallu SEE it. The first time one tends to see it thru a golden eye of one's own political assumtions. I certainly did. Trust me, nothing beats the sight of all those golden pagodas floating by.

Orient Express up to Bhamo is an option too, again, the dates are set in stone. No problems with comfort or food there.

If we are thinking about 2012, well, I dunno. That's too far ahead for me. Even 2011 is beyond my comprehension - I guess I was rather thinking of September - March 2010/11. But I know that my last minute method of travel is not the norm. I always think I might be dead next year/next month/tomorrow so I better do stuff while I can.

But all these cruises happen when the rivers are high. No, they can't change the dates, any more that I can schange the Mobnsoon.

dogster

Watermelon, sweeeet pineapple, tiny lady-finger bananas the size of a Vietnamese willy, rambutan, lychee and something odd I don't know the name of.

Not Empire, marya_, the French. Did they have an empire? Didn't they call it something else?

marya_

Uh...I did mean "empire" in the generic sense. I do think of the French colonial misadventures and resource plundering in Indochina as a form of empire building.

Gpanda

Given the participants, I would say that Fall 2011 is the earliest this could happen. That would be my choice. Next would be Spring 2012.

Just had a vision of the competition for the Omega Fodorite on the cruise. We're too bright to go for the usual Alpha nonsense. Figuratively, we'll all be trying to get to the back of the bus. Sort of a reverse Rosa Parks. RRP to the cogniscenti.

thursdaysd

"In the 19th and 20th centuries, the colonial empire of France was the second largest in the world behind the British Empire" - according to wiki. No doubt they called it L'Empire. And, of course, there was the Emperor Napolean...

MaryW

Dog - oh that fruit sound good!

Mekong around the 4000 islands I've done and while nice not a great adventure. The bit between LP and Vientiane is probably more interesting as there have been few boats available for this bit. For me Burma and India both sound wonderful and I'll be drooling over all your choices but realistically probably won't be able to come at the time of year it needs to be. So I'll just keep checking in on the off chance.

Have fun on the Jayarvaman and let us know how it is - might be able to do that another time. Don't disgrace yourself so much that no Fodorites are ever allowed on the boat again although growing old disgracefully is highly desirable.

marya_

RRP!

Yes, yes, agreed, Gpanda, that we'll all be dining below the salt or at least striving to.

dogster

Dear MaryW,

Hanuman [otherwise known as pookblabbermouth], is heading to your great metropolis of Margaret River in early August. The 4th I think. May I suggest a meet? I think you'd get on famously. I like him a lot, but he gets me drunk, so don't listen to me. As he doesn't know the value of money, make him pay for everything.

Smooch
Dogblabbermouth