I screwed up and accidentally made my reservation for the Sumiyoshi ryokan in Takayama a day off, and now they're full on the date we'll be there in early April. Any recommendations on a nice ryokan there? Our budget is anywhere from $125-$275 for two of us, but $200/night is ideal.

Another thought is to consider a different stop. We'll be coming (by train) from Hankone to Matsumoto (1 night), and then were going to go on to Takayama for 1 night. After that, it's down to Kyoto for several nights.

Should we consider Kamakura instead of Takayama? Stay two nights in Matsumoto and skip Takayama, going straight on to Kyoto? We love small towns, historic buildings, and mountain scenery.

Thanks for any help!

If you love small towns, historic buildings and mountain scenery then Shirakawa-go might be for you rather than Takayama. Takayama is a small city with a preserved historic district for tourists. Shirakawa-go is living history.

Of course, you didn't ask for alternatives...so here's a Takayama choice Seiryo ryokan...nicer than Sumiyoshi in my opinion. They show availablity for every day in April. http://www.ryokan-seiryu.co.jp/ is their website. I've phoned them before and on occasion they have an English speaker..but not always. You could certainly try e-mail, but phoning would give you an immediate reply. You can also book on-line if you can handle the Japanese.

Or, stay a night in Shirakawa-go at a minshuku. That can be arranged through the tourist info, but again, only in Japanese. 057 696 1751 from within Japan, from outside Japan, drop the zero and add + 81 country code

Or try Tanabe http://www.i-hida.net/tanabe/ they also show availability.

topping for Linda05

alan64, good luck. I had planned a day in Asakusa around a festival (Golden Dragon Dance) in mid-March. For months I had this itinerary planned to go to this festival on our first day in Tokyo. Then two weeks ago I looked at the calendar and my info and it turns out the thing is on March 18, not 14. It was so puzzling, where did I get the idea it was the 14th.

Two nights in Matsumoto would one or two too many. You could easily visit the castle and continue on in the same day.

You mentioned "small towns, historic buildings, and mountain scenery". I think that you ought to consider visiting the Kiso Valley. Take a look at the pdf that JNTO has. Go to http://www.jnto.go.jp/eng/RTG/PTG/index.html and in the Chubu section click on the "Kiso Valley" link.

Shirakawa-go has always sounded interesting, but getting there seems to be a challenge when we don't have spare days. As it is, if the bus from Matsumoto over the mountain through Kamikochi to Takayama isn't running yet, then it looks like a train trip goes quite a long way around. Add to that a transfer to a bus to Shirakawa-go and it sounds like too much travel.

Looking at a map, if that train ride to Takayama is in fact long and out-of-the-way, then we had the idea of traveling down the Kiso Valley (JR Chuo) route. Is there a particular town we should spend the night at? Does the train from Matsumoto stop at either Tsumago and Magome?

You are right about the bus over to Takayama and then on to Shirakawago. It would be a bit of travelling by bus and JR Pass won't help. Again, you are right about taking the train. An option that I didn't mention was going over the mountains via Kamikochi, sightsee in Takayama and then go on to Gero (south of Takayama towards Nagoya) where there is an onsen. Or just go on to Kyoto.

Yes to both of your questions. Read the link I gave you and also take a look at the Takayama & Shirakawago guide. That guide shows the transport network in the region. Also, you could plug in Matsumoto to Nakatsugawa into hyperdia to see the stops on that line. Elsewhere on the JNTO website you should be able to find good info about Kisoji. I am planning my first visit to that area (Kiso Valley) for May.

Also, you should search this forum for "Nakasendo" to find the trip report that Peter N-H did some time ago.

We're sold on Kiso-ji. The walk from Magmoe to Tsumago looks like something we'll really enjoy, and Tsumago itself sounds charming. We're more excited about this than Takayama, and the transportation will be much easier. Thanks!!!

That's great! Take notes, please, am looking forward to a report from your travels in that region.

btw, what is your route from Hakone to Matsumoto? Is that still your itinerary?

We'll be staying at the Shimosagaya Minshuku in Tsumago, and I'll be sure to report back once we're back in the States in mid-April.

I must admit I'm not very clear on our train routes. I'm used to European train systems where I can put in a start and finish location on a web site and get a detailed explaination of the route. Our plan in this case is when we get to Tokyo, to ask a tourist information area for info on the best way to get to each stop. I'll also be asking each hotel we're going to their advice on how to get there, as well as how to get to the next city on our itinerary.

Most of your rail route is pretty straightforward, except for that part (and one other section I can explain later). You could use a decent map showing JR lines. The JR Timetable (at least the older ones did) has a decent one, so you might try calling JR in N.Y. as emd has done.

For some reason I can't connect to hyperdia to see what route it maps out. If you were leaving from Tokyo then you would go to Shinjuku to catch a Limited Express to Matsumoto that goes via Hachioji and Shiojiri. There is a nice restaraunt in/near Hachioji that would be worth a visit. Somebody here recommended it to kuranosuke who reported on it recently. It is called Ukai Toriyama and looks wonderful:
http://www.ukai.co.jp/toriyama
I'm not sure, it may be a bit much but maybe not, but you might be able to visit there for lunch and still make it to Matsumoto in time to visit the castle and settle into your ryokan. Or lunch, ryokan, and Matsumoto-jo the next morning. It would not be very far out of your way to go from Hakone via Hachioji and Kofu and Shiojiri to Matsumoto.

Other route would be on the Kodama shinkansen to Shin-Fuji and then a JR line to Kofu to Shiojiri. Or to Toyohashi to Lida (through a valley roughly parallel to Kiso, I think) to Shiorjiri. Or to Nagoya then north through the Kiso Valley to Shiojiri which is least desirable, I think, since you would backtrack from there.

One easy way to get from place to place in Japan is to get a seat reservation (free with JR Pass) for your trip out of a city when you arrive there. If you wanted to go to Sendai on Sunday and Morioka on Monday, then you would get your reserved seat to Morioka when you arrive Sendai.

The people at the JR ticket office know railroad English and won't have trouble getting you the ticket you want. Ask to have your ticket printed in English. I would avoid asking the people at the hotel. They are going to give you an answer when you ask your question about the train, but the answer you get might not be for the question you asked and I would simply not trust it unless the person was actually looking at a JR map/timetable.

http://ekimae.itp.ne.jp/tra-bin/jrtrageng.cgi looks like a good place to find various train routes. Going from Hakone to Matsumoto, it recommends first getting to Odawara (short & easy), then taking the Kodama to Nagoya and transfering to a Winde-view Shinano line to Matsumoto. Although this route is longer in distance than some others, there's only the one transfer (not inc. Odawara) and the time isn't much longer than the other routes it maps out.

Although the (inexpensive) short trip to Odawara isn't on the JR rail pass, I think the Kodama and Shinano lines are.

Alan, I called the Japan Rail office in New York today. I spoke with John for half an hour. He was so helpful. I told him all of the places that I wanted to go to, and he suggested routes for some locations. He is also sending me the JR timetable. Overall, the conversation was very reassuring. You might consider giving a call over there.

Sounds like you have it figured out, alan64. I'll just mention again that the Shinano Limited Express from Nagoya to Matsumoto is going to be going through the Kiso Valley. You'll be returning that way when you leave Matsumoto for Magome and Tsumago (and on via Nagoya to Kyoto). (btw, the best way on that route would be by using a Hikari shinkansen from Odawara to Nagoya and you could do the trip in 3hr 49 min).

I checked hyperdia and you could do the trip in 3hr 14 min if you make two connections, first at Shin Yokohama and second at Hachioji. The Super Azusa Limited Express from Hachioji would travel to Kofu with the Fuji- Hakone- Izu National Park to the south and the Chichibu Tama Kai National Park to the north. After Kofu, the Chichibu T-K N.P. would be to the east and the Minami (Southern) Alps National Park would be to the west.

The Shin Yokohama station is smaller than Nagoya, so maybe a little easier. The change at Hachioji might be on the same platform but if not you could expect to have to climb a flight of stairs (a minor complication, IMO).

All the train travel from Odawara on that we have been talking about would use the JR Pass.