Skedaddle

OK - I know we don't have much time, so I am turning to all the experts on this forum for some assistance. I'm planning a trip in late May/early June (yes, I know, very soon). We have the international flights in and out of BKK. I must be in Phuket for 3 days toward the end of the trip for business. I also know that June is not the ideal time for this visit, but I didn't plan the conference . . .

Some background on us - my husband and I will be taking the trip. We are in our 40's and enjoy traveling a lot. We definitely want to work in several wats (husband big fan of Buddism) and ruins and possibly some museums. We also enjoy nature/animal kinds of experiences. We love to eat and I like to shop (husband tolerates shopping in other countries, but strangely not in US). We have traveled some in Asia (Japan, China, India), but never to Thailand. If necessary, we can arrange hotels/transport/tours/etc. on the fly, but I usually prefer to do it ahead of time to conserve my precious vacation time. We don't have to have private drivers/guides, but would consider it, if it makes a difference in either ability to see the sights or to understand what we are seeing. On the other hand, we do have to have rooms with a/c and private bathrooms. Other trappings of luxury aren't necessary, but are always appreciated!

We're considering:
Day 1 - late night arrival in Bangkok
Day 2 - Bangkok
Day 3 - Bangkok
Day 4 - Sukhothai - fly from Bangkok, stay in old city of Sukhothai?
Day 5 - Sukthothai
Day 6 - Chang Mai - how best to get here? Bus?
Day 7 - Chang Mai - maybe a daytrip to Lampang for the elephant experience - is this feasible?
Day 8 - Chang Mai
Day 9 - Phuket - fly directly from Chang Mai or transfer in Bangkok
Day 10 - Phuket
Day 11 - Phuket
Day 12 - Bangkok - fly back from Phuket
Day 13 - Bangkok - possibly a daytrip to Ayuthaya
Day 14 - early flight back to US

Comments and advice on tenative itinerary appreciated.
Also, some specific questions:
1. Which area of town to stay in Bangkok? I'm not enamored with staying in a backbacker ghetto, but would like to be handy to the sights or one of the modes of public transport for easy access to the sights. We could easily stay in one area in the first part of the trip and another at the end for better access to things in different parts of the city.

2. Is visiting both Sukhothai and Ayuthaya advisable? They seem somewhat different, but I'm not sure. Sukhothai appealed to me because I've read that it is less visited and very peaceful - true? I've also read that you can rent bikes and pedal around the ruins. Is this reasonable to do? Sometimes heat saps my will to live (yes, I know Thailand in June, but again I didn't plan it that way).

3. Elephant experience. These seem expensive for Thailand. Are they worth it? Should we do a day-long thing or is a tour enough? We've ridden on elephants in India and it was interesting, but I'm not sure I need to do it again. Is there something more?

4. The main reason we are choosing Chiang Mai over Chiang Rai is that husband wants to see Wat Phrathat Doi Suthep, Wat Chiang Man, Wat Phra Singh, Wat Chedi Luang, Wat Ched Yot, Wiang Kum Kam, Wat U-Mong, and Wat Suan Dok. I think seeing a cave temple might be cool and would like to shop for some things that might be different from what is available in Bangkok/Phuket. Is this number of sights even feasible? Is this a situation in which we should hire a driver/guide? I've read about the Sat Walking Street and the Sun Walking Street markets. Are these good enough that I should make sure we are in Chiang Mai for one/both of them or are they more of a tacky tourist thing? Is Wiang Kum Kam going to be different from Sukhothai and Ayuthaya?

5. Lastly (for now), what constitutes appropriate business attire in Phuket? For this meeting here, I would probably wear a suit or separates (jacket/slacks). Not sure about formality of conferences in Thailand, in general, and at a beach resort area, in particular. I'm sure it will be hot, but often in the US, I need a jacket in meetings because of over-vigorous a/c. Is this the case in Thailand, too?

Wow - what a long post, I've made! Thanks in advance for any assistance you can provide.

Kathie

Ok, let me answer what I can.

Bangkok - I love to stay by the river and take the water taxis (more like a water bus - cheap public transport) to a number of the most famous wats. I'd recommend you stay by the river for one of your stays, then you can opt for a hotel next to a skytrain stop for the other stay. Give us a per night price range and we can help on hotels. I book ahead on the internet, look at www.sawasdee.com or www.agoda.com or www.asiarooms.com They all require prepayment, but all generally include tax and service (adds 17.7%) and typically breakfast (which is worth $16-20 pp per day).

If it were me - and it isn't - I'd opt for Sukhothai and skip Ayuthaya. You don't have a lot of time in Bangkok and there is so much to do and see.

Some people love elephants and wouldn't miss the Thai Elephant Conservation Center at Lamphang. Unless the idea thrills you, skip it. And don't get roped into going to an elephant show - something widely pushed by Chiang Mai travel agents. If you skip the elephants, you should be able to all or most of the wats your husband wants to see. You'll want to hire a car and driver for the day. If you have a taxi driver from the airport that you like, just negotiate a day rate. You really don't need a guide.

Personally, I find the night market and the weekend walking markets to be very touristy and to have little or nothing I'm interested in buying. My last trip to CM, I was looking specifically for northern Thai hilltribes crafts, but found more variety and better quality in Bangkok with one exception.

Appropriate business attire would be a blouse and slacks with a wrap, very light jacket or sweater for the frigid air conditioning.

Have a great time!

rhkkmk

phuket will be very casual as kathie suggests...

i also like river stays in bkk.... look at chatrium riverside as an alternative....i love the marriott resort and spa....the sroyal orchid sheraton is nice too...

personally i would find bicycles way to hot to ride in thailand. get an a/c car....you can hire a car and driver for less than a rental car usually..

i think a visit to Suk would out trump AY, which i found boring.

also doi sutep is nothing in comparison to the wats in bkk..

with limited time i also suggest a driver in bkk as they get you right to the sights and away easily, although they are not mandatory... i love www.tourwithtong.com.... she is fab... she can also take you to an elephant place and other sites outside of town...

choose only hotels with pools---you will need them...i often go to thailand in may/june and while it rains some in the late PM, you will find most days decent...

what is your daily hotel budget? that will help us steer you to appropiate places...

i have a bkk restaurant listing if you want it.... ask me at

[email protected] food is fantastic in thailand and truly international in bkk and phuket...

simpsonc510

Re: the trappings of luxury. You can certainly get it all in Bangkok, and for much cheaper than in NYC or SFO or London or Paris. If you just want clean, AC, near the skytrain, you can do in very nicely on a limited budget.

As a first-timer, I stayed along the river and thought it was magical. I've now made 23 trips to BKK since June of 2001 (I love that city!!!) I have moved away from the river and much closer to friends/eateries/shopping and such, in the Sukhumvit area of the city. Prices are more reasonable there, although you can still opt for lux at the Hyatt Erewan, the Intercontinental, the Four Seasons, the JW Marriott, and on and on. It's entirely up to you and your preferences.

You have come to a good place for information!

Carol

Skedaddle

OK - I'm into magical! Thanks so much for all the advice so far; I knew the Fodor's forum wouldn't let me down!
Generally, I spend $100-120/night for a hotel. However, it looks like some could be much less in Thailand. On the other hand, for something truely unique or special, we can spend more.
Regarding Sukhothai, is staying in the old town best? The new city doesn't seem to have much interesting going on there, but perhaps it is the only place to get a reasonable hotel and meals? I don't really trust the Lonely Planet series for hotel recs. The old city seems fairly small (1 km end-to-end?), but there are some out-lying sites. Are these interesting to visit? This seems where I'd need a wheeled transport, because otherwise, it would seem we could walk around.
Has anyone taken a bus between Sukhothai and Chiang Mai? The guidebook says it is 5.5 hours which seems ok, but not great, by bus. I assume the only other option is to get a driver. When I've used a driver previously, it is usually because I want to stop somewhere along the route for a visit. Is there anywhere notable along this way? Are these buses OK or is this something I'm really going to regret?
rhkkmk - thanks for the guide rec. I wasn't sure about getting one for Bangkok because of what I had read about traffic there making it really difficult to drive. So, I thought perhaps using public transport might be a time-saver. Any other thoughts on that?
Kathie - I do love elephants, but I'm not really interested in seeing an "elephant show" as you suggest. Do you know of a place that is really good to get up close, but is more than a ride?
Again, thanks so much! I'm beginning to believe I can pull this trip together!

Kathie

THe Thai Elephant Conservation Center will allow you to get up close with elephants. You can visit for a few hours, or for those who are really into it, they can take a mahout training course. If you want time with elephants, do it there, not anywhere close to Bangkok or in Phuket.

I'm one who doesn't favor a guide in Bangkok. I mostly use public transport, with an occasional taxi. If you stay by the river, you can take the water taxi to many of the wats along the river. Many/most sites of interest can be reached via public transport.

I've not been to Sukhothai but researched it for a possible trip this year. Here is the sawasdee page about hotels there: www.sawadee.com/hotels/sukhothai.html

The Heritage was the one that looked best to me, and a friend recommended it as well.

wittewit

Hi.

I lived in Bangkok for half a year and over a year in Chiang Mai.
What i can recommend for Bangkok is the bicycle trips one can book with a Dutch guy who runs this business for about 20 years. You will see and enjoy Bangkok in a way you will never forget.
http://www.covankessel.com/en/tourEN1.php
Wat Po is an interesting place because of the massage school you can find on the temple ground, this school is regarded as the best in Thailand. Do not enter the temple through the main gate but walk to the entrance on the opposite side where one can find the massage school, and enter there. Beware of the scams in and around the main temples in Bangkok. Friendly, well dressed and English speaking Thai prey on tourists visiting these sometimes over touristic places. Don't believe the "advice" they will give you for free and go on do your things all by yourself.
In Chiang Mai city there are way over three hundred Wat's to find and i can not recommend any in particular because of the temple fatigue i did develop over time in Thailand. Wat Chet Yod was around the corner where i lived and i liked the atmosphere, but there are more interesting temples to find in or around the city. One can get to Doi Suthep in two ways, rent a motorbike and drive up the mountain yourself or take a songthaew. The ride is nice and the scenery is beautiful. I went up the mountain by motorbike numerous times in the summer because it's cool up there. The road is of western quality up to the temple and beyond, but gets smaller and less maintained when you get at the summer palace of the King of Thailand which is further up the mountain. If you pass this summer retreat of the royal family and keep going you eventually end up in a small but interesting Hmong village, bring a light jacket because of the significant lower temperature up there. This village is reachable on a motorbike but one can get there also by a private rent songthaew. I never went to the elephant places but was invited by a friend to come along to "The flight of the gibbons". This is something i can recommend, you will "fly" from tree to tree through the lush forest in a harness while suspended on cables ( 300/400 mtr "flights"). But if you suffer from vertigo you better skip this one because some of the platforms are 40 to 45 meters above the forest floor. The village is one where i could spent my pension and the people who live there grow coffee in the wild. This coffee is the best i ever bought and priceless for coffee lovers. You can book the "flight" anywhere in Chiang Mai.

Best regards,

Erik Vingerhoets.

rhkkmk

the traffic is heavy in bkk but there are many ways to avoid it and drivers (non-taxi) often use alternative routes... sukhumvit is the main road to avoid as are certain parts of silom and sathorn... unfortunately, the skytrain does not really go near to the "sights", except the jim thompson house... river taxis on the other hand often go near to many sights...

spending 100-125 will get you a very nice place to stay, even some lux...

Skedaddle

Kathie - Thanks for the rec for Heritage in Sukhothai. It looks beautiful! Does it concern you that it seems to be sort of isolated? Do you think there would be issues of getting around, to the bus terminal, etc? Or would hotel staff just call you a taxi? We generally like to be in the middle of everything with good access to resturants, shopping, and so on. But we are only going to be there for two nights, so perhaps this isn't important.

Kathie

I would assume the hotel staff could get any transport you need.

LKJcreative

My son is married to a Thai so I've been fortunate to go to Thailand 4 times and stay with them. Here are some of my favorite things to do:

Elephant rides

The Grand Palace and Reclining Buddha

Jim Thompson House and Museum

Weekend Market, where there are 12,000 vendors. Lots of inexpensive items for sure as well as quality things for sale. I was just there a couple weeks ago and bought Bamboo coiled lacquer serving dishes that are exquisite......the market is very fun. Be sure to try the coconut ice cream and the best fried chicken I've ever had and sticky rice from vendors.

Floating Market Dumnoen was also a highlight of my last trip and is a couple hrs from Bangkok.

Cha Am beach days....also a couple hrs from Bangkok

Trying so many different foods in Bangkok....Thai, Arabian, German, French, Portuguese, Japanese, Mexican etc...it's a mecca for trying new foods.

With family in Bangkok, it's a treat to see everything from a local's perspective.

Skedaddle

OK, guys, I'm all booked on flights and hotels. We're at the Chatrium Riverside in Bangkok - thanks rhkkmk! Sounds like we will be able to access nearly everything, including the SkyTrain from the river. We're staying at the Heritage in Sukhothai - thanks Kathie! Then at the dusitD2 in Chiang Mai. Looks like it is well-located near the night market and the old city.

Thanks so much for your tips and assistance. Feeling relief and able to start getting excited about everything we will see and do!

I've just heard from the conference organizer that dress for the meeting will be "formal." Because my tiara is at the cleaners, I'm assuming they mean a suit or suit-like outfit. Other ideas?

Kathie

Have a wonderful time!

Hanuman

The rooms at the D2 is kind of strange - for deluxe you have an option of a room with a bath tub or a room with shower in the bathroom I would request a shower as the rooms are tiny. Located very near the night market but can get loud and congested at time.

Formal in Thailand, for men, is a suit.

Hanuman

I just read your the complete thread and have some comment for you.

Sukhothai - when you visit I highly recommend for you to visit Sri Satchanalai as well as the ruins there are in pretty good shape. About 1 hour from Sukhothai and on the way, via a smaller road, to Chiang Mai. Driving time from Sukhothai to Chiang Mai is around 5 hours and from Sri Satchanalai to Chiang Mai is around 4 hours.

Let us know if you need any more information.

rhkkmk

have fun....chinese rest. at chatrium is outrageous in price, skip it but the normal ground floor rest. is not bad... good breakfasts too...

tongue thai and harmonique restaurants are not far from you up the river and a block inland.

Skedaddle

Hanuman - So in this scenario (Sukhothai to Sri Satchanalai to Chiang Mai), we'd need to get a car and driver - is that correct? How long should we allow for the visit to Sri Satchanalai? Is a 1/2-day adequate?
rhkkmk - thanks for the rest. recs!

Hanuman

Skedaddle - yes get a car and driver and that would be the best choice. You should be able to arrange for a car from either your hotel in Sukhothai or a local travel agency once you're in the country. Perhaps a local guide with knowledge of both places to accompany you would be more educational as well. For Sri Satchanalai you can spend an hour or up to the whole day depending on your level of interest but I would say that 2 to 3 hours will be enough.

I have some pictures for both places which you might find interesting: http://khun-pook.smugmug.com/History...43014489_Jqk9Y