Angela838

Hello Fodors Travelers!

Thank you in advance for your time! We would love to hear your thoughts on our tentative Japan itinerary plans. My husband and I are going to Japan for two weeks at the end of November.

We love enjoying food and drink wherever we travel and appreciate the local experience. We are both uncomfortable with touristy areas and want to avoid crowds when possible. Aside from that, we both enjoy jazz, and play Go and do crafts for fun.

We will be traveling with family the first five days of our 12-day trip, they love onsen and they have named Shirakawa-go as their preferred destination.

We’ve put together a possible itinerary and would really appreciate if you could take a look and provide any comments, feedback, or any additional recommendations!

**11/25 FRI: Arrival**

- Arrive at Narita at 1345
- Travel: Narita > Tokyo (NEX, 1 hr), Tokyo > Nagoya (JR shinkansen, 2 hrs)
- Arrive at Nagoya, join up with family
- Eat histumabushi for dinner

**11/26 SAT: Nagoya**

- Visit NVisit Nagoya Castle (close to opening time, 0900)
- Visit Satsuki and Mei’s House in the Expo 2005 Commemorative Park (close to opening time, 1000)
Eat miso katsu for lunch
Travel: Nagoya > Takayama (JR Hida limited, ~2.5 hrs)
Arrive at Takayama, check-in to onsen ryokan

**11/27 SUN: Takayama / Okuhida**
- Visit Asaichi Morning Markets (start at 0700)
- Visit Higashiyama Walking Course
- Visit Matsuri no Mori museum (start at 0900)
- Eat Hida beef, drink Hida beer / sake for lunch
- Travel: Takayama > Okuhida Shin-Hotaka (Nohi Bus, 1.5 hrs)
- Arrive at Okuhida, Shin-Hotaka
- Visit Shin-Hotaka Ropeway, ride full loop
- Sleep in onsen ryokan (likely Shin-Hotaka for the alps view)

**11/28 MON: Shirakawa-go**

- Travel: Okuhida Shin-Hotaka > Takayama (Nohi Bus, 1.5 hrs); Takayama > Shirakawa-go (Nohi bus, 50 mi
- Arrive at Shirakawa-go
- Visit Ogimachi
- Sleep in Gassho-Zukiri

**11/29 TUE: Osaka**

- Travel: Shirakawa-go > Kanazawa (Nohi bus, 1.5 hrs); Kanazawa > Osaka (JR limited express, 2.
- Bid farewell to family
- Visit Shinsaibashi
- Visit Dotonbori
- Visit Shinsekai
- Eat okonomiyaki, takoyaki, kushikage

**11/30 WED: Kyoto**

- Travel: Osaka > Kyoto (JR shinkansen, 15 min
- Visit Gion District (check out specialty shops)
- Visit Kyoto Handicraft Center
- Visit Higashiyama District
- Visit Kiyomizudera (fall leaves illumination)
- Visit Koudaiji (fall leaves illumination)

**12/01 THU: Arashiyama Day Trip**

- Travel: Kyoto > Arashiyama (JR, 20 mins)
- Rent bikes
- Visit Enrian Temple
- Eat yudofu kaiseki
- Visit Bamboo Groves
- Visit Monkey Park Iwatayama
- Travel: Arashiyama > Kyoto (JR, 20 mins)

**12/02 FRI: Kyoto**

- Visit Fushimi Inari Shrine
- Visit Nishiki Market
- Visit Kinkakuji Temple
- Eat parfaits at Cafe Karafuneya
- Visit Pontocho District (eat at restaurant by the river)

**12/03 SAT: Chichibu**

- Travel: Kyoto > Tokyo (JR shinkansen , 2.7 hrs); Tokyo > Chichibu (Red Arrow, 1.5 hrs); Chichibu > Onohara (local, 10 mins)
- Rent bikes
- Visit Chichibu Yomatsuri

**12/04 SUN: Tokyo (Western)**

- Travel: Onohara > Chichibu (local service, 10 mins); Chichibu > Tokyo (Red Arrow, 1.5 hrs)
- Visit Yoyogi Park
- Visit Shibuya (Tokyu Hands)
- Visit Shinjuku (Eat at Omoide Yokocho and/or Golden Gai)

**12/05 MON: Tokyo (outlying and Northern)**

- Visit Ghibli Museum
- Visit Asakusa District
- Visit Senso-ji Temple
- Visit Nakamise Street
- Visit Rikugien Gardens (evening light-up)
- Eat high end sushi

**12/06 TUE: Tokyo (Central)**

- Visit Tsukiji Market (just the outside with restaurants), eat sushi
- Visit Ginza (Itoya)
- Visit Akihabara
- Visit Yurakucho (Yurakucho Go Center, Eat casual izakaya dinner)

**12/07 WED: Day Trip (Open to suggestions)**

- Possible: Odaiba, Yokohama, Kawagoe

**12/08 THU: Depature**

- Ramen Street
- Depart from Narita

kja

Should be a great trip!

Noting from the start that we all travel with different priorities and interests, here are a few observations:

I gave Takayama 1.5 days and seriously regret that I did not give it more.

I gave Kanazawa 2 days and seriously regret that I did not give it more.

The Higashiyama district of Kyoto is extensive and has an incredible array of interesting temples and shrines and other places of interest (a park, a shopping district, etc.) IME, it takes AT LEAST two days to see a selection of its highlights – and even with 2 days, you will need to be selective! And that doesn't count anything else you list for this day! I think this day, in particular, would benefit from reconsideration. (FWIW, my one objection to japan-guide.com is that I think it's recommendations about possible allocations of time are way off -- about half! I've wondered if they refer to simply the WALKING time involved, not counting visiting anything, as those times would be more consistent with my experience.)

My recollection of the Bamboo Forest of Arashiyama was that it was on a fairly steep slope. Does it allow bikes, and are you prepared for a steep slope?

For 12/07: Have you considered Kamakura?

Hope these comments help!

Kavey

Takayama morning sightseeing seems very tight. As does the rest of that day, especially if you're moving on from there, doing sightseeing at the next place AND need to get to a ryokan in time for dinner - most ryokans serve dinner quite early and you can't be late and have them hold it. I'd double check the time requirements for your Shin-Hotaka ryokan.

Are you hoping to see anything in Kanazawa or is it just a transport routing? You'd need at least a full day in Kanazawa to see just some of the sights - Kenrokuen (one of Japan's top 3 gardens), the castle, the amazing fish/food market, the old tea districts, the samurai district, the modern art museum, and so on.

For me, Kyoto seems very tight too, though perhaps you're able to get around a lot more in a day than some of us, it feels very rushed though.

hawaiiantraveler

You have done the research and your schedules are in order but like the others I see every day as tight....very tight and looong days. 11/29 is a long day. Your days in Kyoto during fall foliage are just ticking off the sights. You can taxi to most spots on your list and maybe make all your spots in a day. If you are counting on public transportation ie buses then forget it. Buses are extremely crowded at that time of year and expect to miss one or two before you will be able to board one headed your direction.

I like the idea of renting bikes in Arashiyama as that will expedite your time between venues. You will have to leave your bikes at the bottom of the trail up to the monkey park.

12/2 you start at Fushimi Inari which is south of Kyoto then on to Nishiki Market in mid town Kyoto then on the Kinkakuji in Northwest Kyoto. Doable by bus/train but better by taxi if you want to speed your way along.

12/4 I like the Tokyu Hands in Shinjuku(bigger) a lot better than the one in Shibuya. The one in Shinjuku is also adjacent to a large mall in Times Square which also has great shopping and a fantastic food market in the basement floor....yum.

12/7 - out of the three I would definitely vote for Kawagoe. A very nice look at an old Edo era village and a nice day trip. The Kitain Temple is a nice place to visit there as is the main dori with the old warehouse style shops.


Looks like a nice trip, enjoy!

Aloha!

MinnBeef

I'll echo everyone's input that the days feel extremely jam packed. 3 full days for Kyoto is the absolute minimum, IMHO, but I don't believe for a second you'll see everything you have listed. I think the Arashiyama day is very doable but I think both other dates are unrealistic--especially 12/2. Fushimi Inari was my absolute top Kyoto highlight and even then, I probably walked only 3/4 of the way up. I'm betting I spent a total of 3-4 hours there. Kinkaku-ji is on the absolute other side of Kyoto (a very large city to begin with). I remember taking the bus from Hotel Mume in Hirashiyama to the temple complex and it took almost an hour to do. As a Type A personality myself, I appreciate the satisfaction of checking things off one's list but I feel like you're going to be exhausted for a week by the time you get home.

Is there a compelling reason for Osaka? Most travelers here have been less than enamored with it (I have not been). If not, consider converting the Osaka day to a 4th day in Kyoto to give yourself more time to see the aggressive list of sights you've noted. My plan for my follow up trip next spring is to go to Osaka one evening for Kyoto for the lights, conveyor-belt sushi, etc.

mrwunrfl

The previous posters have been very kind.

someotherguy

This itinerary is more regimented and hurried than most here would recommend, but it seems well researched and there's a logic to it. If that's the way the OP travels, then this itinerary could be OK for them.

A couple of anecdotes/observations:

I went to the Expo in 2005 and it was the single worst experience of my travel life: crowds and lines and more crowds and more lines and humidity and heat! And nothing of any interest to me. I escaped as soon as I could (I was taken there as a treat by the organizers of a meeting I was attending) and went to Takayama. I assume it's less crowded now and that you are Ghibli fans and actually want to see the house.

Gokayama is more attractive than Ogimachi, but harder to get to.

I think Osaka Castle is more interesting than Nagoya. Both are concrete reconstructions, but Osaka is Pre-WWII. Then in Nagoya there's the Atsuta Shrine. This is (said to be) the same architecture as the Ise shrines (which you are not allowed to see) and is pretty interesting. It also holds one of the 3 items of imperial regalia (not that anyone except the Emperor is going to see it).

I'm not sure if it is still there, but there was a building near Osaka castle that advertised "Restaurants of the World". This had 3 or floors of restaurants from all over. In more discreet banners it also claimed "Toilets of the World" and, indeed, each rest room had porcelain from a different country. Very instructive.

Kushikage should be kushiage, though I think in Osaka they also call it kushikatsu. I've eaten this in Tokyo and the key is to order a set course ("kousu") and don't look at the menu. I was enjoying it very much until the chef gave me a piece of paper indicating I'd been eating "chicken gizzard" and such. Reminded me of a restaurant in the food court of a department store in Seoul that proudly advertised "pigs intestines".

LuisJp

Great job! I couldn't find any big faults in your itinerary, as long as you wanted to visit the listed places only. It seems that your family in Japan have helped to work it out.

Some subtleties:

Any reasons to move to Onohara? There should be information centers in front of Seibu-Chichibu on Seibu Line and Chichibu on Chichibu Line. Onohara is out of the matsuri venue.
http://navi.city.chichibu.lg.jp/wp/w...utsu_omote.pdf

It is not a mistake, but Koudaiji seems to adopt Kodaiji for their name. There are no strict rules for the Latin representation in Japanese.
https://www.kodaiji.com/lightup-fall.html

But, the followings are wrong, or typos:
kushikage => Kushi-age or Kushi-katsu
Gassho-Zukiri => Gassho-Zukuri
histumabushi => Hitsu-mabushi

Just try Ten-musu while you are in Nagoya. Hitsumabushi, Misokatsu, and Tenmusu would the most famous 3 meals in Nagoya.

I vote for Yokohama, or Odaiba. Kawagoe is in the same direction as Chichibu. Your itinerary doesn't include sea, while Japan is an island country. You might be attracted by either of MM21, China Town, Cup Noodles Museum, Spring Valley Brewery, or Raumen Museum.
http://www.minatomirai21.com/
http://www.chinatown.or.jp/
http://www.cupnoodles-museum.jp/english/index.html
http://www.springvalleybrewery.jp/yokohama/
http://www.raumen.co.jp/

BigRuss

Hmm. Limiting to this part = seems really rushed.

<i>**11/30 WED: Kyoto**

- Travel: Osaka > Kyoto (JR shinkansen, 15 min
- Visit Gion District (check out specialty shops)
- Visit Kyoto Handicraft Center
- Visit Higashiyama District
- Visit Kiyomizudera (fall leaves illumination)
- Visit Koudaiji (fall leaves illumination)</i>

You'll be hauling around a decent sized area on one side of the Kamo River, which isn't too bad, but you're going to have to hustle to cover that amount of territory. Do NOT underestimate how long it takes to get to and from Kiyomizudera - maps are deceptive on this point.

<i>**12/01 THU: Arashiyama Day Trip**

- Travel: Kyoto > Arashiyama (JR, 20 mins)
- Rent bikes
- Visit Enrian Temple
- Eat yudofu kaiseki
- Visit Bamboo Groves
- Visit Monkey Park Iwatayama
- Travel: Arashiyama > Kyoto (JR, 20 mins)</i>

Arashiyama is part of Kyoto. It's not like you're going to another city. See below for additional suggestion.

<i>**12/02 FRI: Kyoto**

- Visit Fushimi Inari Shrine
- Visit Nishiki Market
- Visit Kinkakuji Temple
- Eat parfaits at Cafe Karafuneya
- Visit Pontocho District (eat at restaurant by the river)</i>

This is your worst day. The Inari Shrine is southeast of central Kyoto. Nishiki Market is north of Kyoto station. The Golden Pav (Kinkakuji) is way north of central Kyoto and west of it. So to do this right, you need to go to Inari, then all the way across the city and north to the temple, then back to Nishiki, and finally to Pontocho (because that's close to the market). That's going to suck because Inari and Kinkakuji will not connect without various train and bus transfers. And the Inari shrine has a lot of acreage to cover.

It might actually be easier to take a bus to Kinkakuji from the Arashiyama area (the bamboo forest and monkey park won't take that long) or visit it before Arashiyama on your 12-1 day. Ultimately, the Golden Pav is probably the single most overrated site in Kyoto, but at least the overfed fish are happy.

BigRuss

Oh yeah, your claim that "We are both uncomfortable with touristy areas and want to avoid crowds when possible" is totally incompatible with your Osaka itinerary, your desire to putter around Kinkakuji, your trip to Chichibu, and wandering around Shinjuku and Shibuya.

Just noting that.

Note also that by the time you reach Tokyo, the Tsukiji market will be no more - it's moving in early November.

LuisJp

There is Totoro's Forest between Tokyo and Chichibu. Kurosuke's house opens only on Tuesdays, Wednesdays, and Saturdays. Before Yomatsuri on 12/03, or on 12/07 (might be coupled with a tour to Kawagoe) would be a slot for visiting that, if you want.

http://www.totoro.or.jp/totorofund/index.html

LuisJp

Another coupling on 12/07 might be Odaiba and Monja-yaki on the Monja Street in Tsukishima.

On 12/04, after Shibuya, you could visit Gaien-Mae before Shinjuku, maybe walking around Omote-Sando and Aoyama. There would be Jingu Gaien Gikgo Festival, Icho Matsuri, which is quite famous for its Golden Road.
http://www.meijijingugaien.jp/event/ginkgo-festa.html