Russ, it sounds like you are gathering good info to make your decisions about Bangkok. Bob and I both love Bangkok, but we have different feelings about public transport vs. a car and driver.

Your idea of going back to the hotel at mid-day for a swim is a good one - an done I know Bob will also endorse.

Try to get to the GP/EB at 8:30 when it opens. You might well find the temps not too terrible, depending on the weather in Bangkok. I've been there when it was "balmy" and when it was hot, hot hot.

The long "tour" is an individual tour. They start at any of the piers near the hotels - you can start one at the Central Pier, for instance. I have to admit it has been decades since I did one. No reason you can't just hire a long tail to go wherever you want to go. Just negotiate price before you get in.

Starting at Suan Pakkard, then going to Jim Thompson will put you there at lunchtime - good thought.

Klong tours can last an hour and up. I think the 1-hour ride will give you a glimpse of life along the canals. A longer tour might include a stop (as quick as you want it to be) at the King's Barge museum. It costs to go inside, but you can make up your mind about that as you arrive. Take a peek and see if it is of interest. There are some amazing barges on display. It doesn't take long to tour the place. We opted not to go inside when we did a klong tour a year ago April. I think we were on the long tail about 1.5 hours in all. Not really an organized "tour" by any means, just a casual ride. But always interesting! There are stands around Taksin pier where you can arrange pick up. Your hotel might also be able to arrange something for you at their own pier!

You might find this useful...

http://www.transitbangkok.com/

Click the blue bar at the top of the page on whatever method of transport you want, and you get detailed information.

As well as the temperature and humidity you'll also have air/traffic pollution to contend with, and how bad it is depends on where you are at the time.

Try and avoid using the Sky train during peak hours as the carriages are packed. The MRT [Underground] isn't quite so bad.

If you use the public ferry, then the orange flag is the best one, but also the busiest, so avoid it during peak hours. I assume that when Kathie mentions water taxi she really means public ferry.

Each of the Ferry Piers are numbered, and some are v.close to main sights [see link above]. If you fancy a relaxed lunch on a hotel terrace right on the river, then at Pier 13 is the Navalai River Resort...

http://www.navalai.com/facilities-aq...aurant&bar.php

...which is an area called Banglamphu, and older part of Bangkok, safe and well worth a wander round.

A trip on the orange flag ferry from Central Pier upstream to the terminus at Nonthaburi [takes an hour or so] is a lovely way to see Bangkok from the river. You could get a public bus back to the centre from Nonthaburi, and see areas of Bangkok that most tourists never see.

Getting back to your hotel for a mid-day break swim for a couple of hours is fine, but depending on where you are and where you're staying, and it's proximity to public transport it might take a couple of hours to get back.

Shangri-la will arrange a boat for you to come to their pier and tell the boatman what you want to do...

Susan pakkard is a short stop... Maybe 1/2 hour. Plan to have lunch at Jim thompson house---fab

Friday morning greetings from Tokyo to the OP, russ; glad you will be spending time in beloved Bangkok. (And thanks for your thoughtful Japan impressions. Have been in Tokyo since last Thursday for Easter / business meetings and will soon be enjoying another fast train ride to Kyoto for weekend sakura with long-time family friends. Monday, back home to Singapore out of Osaka. Love Japan this time of year.)

Well done on choosing the Shangri-La for your BKK lodging. Always enjoyed most satisfactory business travel stays at that property. You will be in rather close proximity to a special hotel I first encountered as youth ~ half-century back with my parents and siblings, the Mandarin Oriental. Time permitting, take in her public venues. Will be returning to the MO for some work-related receptions and meetings in May; wonderful times at that place.

Will also mention the Chon Thai restaurant, located within The Siam hotel. More info, including her shuttle boat schedule, at: thesiamhotel dot com/ We love that property for lodging and dining. (And a bit of a promotion as we are friends with some fine individuals who have been involved with The Siam from her earliest days.)

More thoughts later. Savour your planning, russ; happy for you. Early and warm weekend wishes to you and all from Tokyo and soon, Kyoto,

robert


... Singapore Airlines, You're a Great Way to Fly ...

I'm feeling very good about our projected itinerary now. I'm always open to changing things at the time as needed, but I like going in with a logical plan. Thanks again everyone for the great info.

I suppose since a few people have already broached the topic, if you have any favorite places to eat, please let me know. We like to try high-end, mid-priced and low-end options, just to get a varied experience, and prefer local cuisine (we can get French and Italian in LA). Bonus points to places that are already in the path of our proposed itinerary.

russ_in_LA: " I tend to be cold when other people are hot (born in LA, spend a lot of time in Palm Springs) so I might find it warm but not overwhelmingly oppressive in late November.

You'll probably be fine. I'm also from L.A. County and am not all that heat sensitive and November is not that bad as far as I'm concerned. I've been to Bangkok in Nov/Dec/Jan/last week in March/August and possibly early April and as far as I'm concerned the cool season was Nov/Dec/Jan. I remember once when I went in November and it was cooler, upon arrival into Bangkok, than it was when I left L.A., as I checked the temperature.

My two L.A. friends and I walked from Jim Thompson, on Surawong, to the Oriental Hotel, in late March and in the heat of the day and didn't pass out or anything. We basically walked all over the place. I wouldn't worry so much about the heat and especially in November and I take public transportation and walk long distances the majority of the time and have been fine.

Now if you want hell hot/Africa hot, then do Penang in January which is way hotter than what I've experienced in Bangkok. As far as I'm concerned it equals 'Africa Hot' as my best friend called it (LOL) as she was with me there in Jan 2016 for her first time in Penang and my second time. She has been to Bangkok a lot and at all times of the year and has been fine. She's from The Valley. Another friend is from San Francisco and was there when I was there in 2014/2015, in Dec/Jan and went out walking every day and hours on end and was fine and S.F. has much cooler weather than what we have in L.A.

Have fun. Enjoy. Your trip plans seem to be coming along nicely. Smiles.

Happy Travels!

le bealieu in the plaza anthanee hotel office bldg., just behind the hotel has a fab fixed priced luncheon.

we like harmonique near your hotel for simple thai.

we love Biscotti in the anantara siam formerly 4 seasons.

the new mall across sukhumvit from emporium has very nice restaurants as you wind down their walkway from the top floor.

a unique treat is Gaggan, modern intian

we love L'Opera on soi 39 ??? sukhumvit

siam kempenski has a fabulous sunday brunch

Do the Calypso Cabaret located at Asiatique. Very entertaining ladyboy show, classy for all ages.

If you visit on 14November2016, it is Loy Kratong Festival.
You can experience Loy Kratong culture at night time.

Thanks for the additional info everyone. Unfortunately, we arrive about a week after the Loy Kratong Festival. It would have been great to be there at that time.

All great advice above. One additional thing that we thoroughly enjoyed was our stroll through Lampini Park, an oasis of green away from chaotic Bangkok. It is best to go around sunrise or sunset to see the local people exercising in the park. I'm not sure with your busy schedule if you will have time to include this, but do consider if you have time as we had a lovely stroll there.

I did the morning tour with Bangkok food tours and thoroughly enjoyed it. They also do a night tour by tuk tuk that sounds like fun. I'm planning on doing both it and the Chinatown one if I get back there this year.

I also did the sunset bike riding tour with Spice Roads which was a great experience. Its only about 15 kms, fairly easy cycling and visits the flower market. You have a lot planned for a short time so this could be one best left for another trip.

I am working on integrating suggestions above into my evolving Bangkok plan, and have a few more questions. Just to recap, here is where I have landed as a rough itinerary:

Day 1 (Monday): Land 1:30pm - Flower Market/Wat Arun at night
Day 2 : River ferry to Grand Palace/Wat Phra Kaew/Wat Po/Wat Arun, lunch somewhere in there, (possibly insert additional wats here - seems unlikely), back to Shangri-la in afternoon for pool and rest, (early evening wander through interesting neighborhood?)
Day 3: BTS Skytrain to Suan Packard Museum/Jim Thompson House for tour and lunch, (possibly insert additional wats here - seems better than on day 2), back to Shangri-la for pool and rest, late pm Wat Tramit/Chinatown Food Tour 6 - 9pm
Day 4: Ferry to National Museum for 9am tour/Lunch/Royal Barge Museum/Thonburi Klong Tour (possible evening neighborhood wander)

Questions:

In one of the "insert additional wats here" sections, I'd like to work in some additional wats if possible, such as Wat Loha Prasat/Wat Saket/Wat SuThat, but they seem out of the way from the rest of my itinerary. Is there a logical place to add those in, and if so where? I was thinking maybe after Jim Thompson House, taking a canal boat down Klong Saen Saep to get there, but other suggestions welcome...as well as quickest way back to Shangri-la afterward (bus to Memorial Bridge, then ferry, perhaps?)

Given the locations we will be in at lunch time each day, any suggestions for lunch places on days 2 and 4? I don't want to only eat in hotel restaurants, but I also don't want to risk street food, especially so early in the trip.

In general, any suggestions for interesting areas in which to wander, given our itinerary? How about Phra Athit Road? Other ideas?

Regarding street food, if we do the Chinatown Food tour, is this the kind of street food that some people might regard as potentially unsafe? I realize there are no guarantees, but I'm inclined to do this tour given the recommendations above.

Any other relevant comments or suggestions appreciated. Thanks!

I ended up doing the tuk tuk night tour which was great. We ate at small crowded local restaurants with trips into the kitchens to see the food preparation. Even at midnight there were lots of locals tucking into Pad Thai at Thip Samai Pad Thai. The Chinatown one wasn't available the night I was in Bangkok.

As you say, there are no guarantees with food. I had been on the road for about three weeks in Bali and Lombok including trekking up Mount Rinjani so my stomach was probably acclimatised to spicy food. I loved the food and had no ill effects whatsoever. Its a bit what you feel comfortable with. My thinking is that if the restaurant/stall is crowded with locals then I'll risk it. Especially if you can see the food being cooked in front of you. I'm more suspicious of food that been sitting in food warmers for hours than freshly cooked Asian street food.

The merits/dangers of street food have been debated here endlessly. While I don't eat street food in Bangkok (I do in Penang and Singapore), I would feel relatively safe on one of these street food tours.

Do make sure you have the appropriate vaccines before you go: Hep A and typhoid are musts.

"quickest way back to Shangri-la" would be either the skytrain or the water taxi depending on where you are. A bus will take forever (the infamous Bangkok traffic). If you get stuck somewhere and don't know how to get back, take a taxi. Make sure you always have a hotel card with you to show the taxi driver and make sure they turn on the meter. If a driver doesn't turn on the meter after you ask (most will turn it on immediately) just get out of the taxi and take another one. In my couple of dozen trips to Bangkok since the mid-1980s, I have only had to get out of a tax once. Taxis are cheap - and air-conditioned. Note the tuck tucks are always more expensive than taxis and you have to breathe the diesel fumes. Also, tuk-tuk drivers are the ones most likely to tell you that places are closed and that they can take you to a "special government-sponsored gem sale" or to "a great tailor." Avoid those!!

I agree with silverwool about "food that been sitting in food warmers for hours" and avoid buffets. But the "eyeball test" - have you seen the food cooked right in front of you? is no assurance that it won't make you sick.

I posted lots of useful advice. For some strange reason those posts were removed. Very odd.

I've never had food poisoning from eating street food hundreds of times. Usually cook well thru and was purchased that morning for cooking.

Food in restaurants can sit around for days without being refrigerated properly or handled with care.

Be careful with seafood restaurants. Avoid the quiet ones with low turnover.

Street food is really just bbq food and you would have eaten bbq food before.