We are finalizing our itinerary for 4 nights/3 1/4 days visiting Angkor Wat in December. We would love the advice of Fodorites who've been -- is any of what we're thinking of doing too "touristy" rather than interesting? Does this plan sound "do-able?"

* Day one -- arrive in afternoon; sunset at Angkor Wat
* Day two -- Elephant ride at Angkor Thom, visit Elephant Terrace, Terrace of Leper King, Bayon Temple
* Day three -- Sunrise at Angkor Wat, visit Banteay Srei, Preah Kahn, Ta Som and East Melbon
* Day four -- Tonle Sap boat ride to see fishing villages, afternoon at Thommanon, Chao Say Tevoda, Ta Keo and Ta Prohm

Has anyone done a trip like this arranged as a package? If so, price range would be helpful to know as well as whether you booked through your hotel (we will be staying at Raffles Grand Hotel D'Angkor).

A thousand thanks for any input!

One other question -- is the Tonle Sap boat ride worth doing at all, or would that time be better spent visiting temples?

Hi. I've been to Siem Reap tiwce - first time for 4 days and second for 2 days. The first time I did the boat ride - while not a must I think we would have been "templed out" by 4 days of only the temples. However, this is personal and others on the forum may advise u to focus only on the temples - certainly the boat ride is nothing great and you could also use the time to seta more leisurely pace for the temples. IN terms of packages you have to book all components separately i.e. guide (who normally arranges driver too), hotel, etc. Guides and drivers work on $20 per head per day each - the driver may ask for extra if you do too many long drives. If you are planning this month you have left it late for booking - my guide is very good, I think mail id is [email protected] else pull up some of my earlier threads re Angkor Wat. Ponheary is also highly recoed on this forum. Are you visiting the temple of a thousand lingas? Very interesting. Also, do the hot air balloon ride - it is even featured in Time magazine this year - truly an awesome experience as gives you a great aerial view of Angkor Wat the main temple and perspective on size. If you would like to do this at sunrise ask Raffles to organize your tickets in advance as seats are limited and sell out fast.

Tonle Sap boat ride to see fishing villages is really going to see the poorest of the poor. Not a fishing village but a floating village as these people can only afford to live on a boat or raft. The lake in December when we were there was low so the smell was terrible...of course, the lake is the sewer. Seeing children wading in it was a sight I will never forget. The ride to the lake is not scenic and the causeway out to the boat landing was pothole ridden. If I had understood what I was going to see..I certainly would not have gone. Staring at people who cannot afford to live in better conditions is not an act of kindness.
The elephant ride at Angkor Thom is "touristy". When we were there mainly Japanese tourists were on the elephants. The walk up the hill is do-able and the walk down is quite nice.
We booked everything thru our hotel (the Raffles). Do eat at the extra charge restaurant at least one night. Very nice, but it gets booked up and we could only arrange one dinner there. Bring lots of film or room on your digital camera.

hobbes and Elainee - thank you so much for your advice. It sounds like the boat ride is something to cut out -- perhaps a good idea to build in some relaxation time instead. We will definitely look into the balloon ride -- sounds like a neat perspective. Indeed we are a bit late in booking a guide (we've had our hotel reservations, so we're okay on that front). Elainee - you mentioned that you booked everything via Raffles ... how was the guide that they arranged? Is he/she someone who you'd recommend we ask for? (Having a very well informed and nice guide seems critical to a good experience). One last question for you -- did either of you arrange a guide/driver for Phnom Penh if you were there before/after Siem Reap? If so, did you do it via the hotel (price range would be helpful to know). Thanks again for your great postings!

Have you purchased a good guidebook for the temples yet? I recommend Dawn Rooney's book, Angkor. It's good preparation for you, as it will help you decide which temples you especially want to see.

Most people use the traditional schedule to view the temples, up at dawn, view temples all morning, then back to the hotel for lunch, rest and a chance to cool off before going back out from about 3 pm until dusk. There are good reasons to use this (approximate) schedule, as it's VERY hot and humid. This will also mean that you'll be fresher and not so prone to getting templed out.

Just a couple of other notes: your schedule for day 2 is rather sparse. I expect you'll be visiting other temples in the area as well. When I was there, the morning elephant rides were from the area outside the gates of Angkor Thom to Bayon, a very short ride. The evening rides were up the hill outside the gates of Angkor Thom to the temple atop the hill (a longer and more interesting ride). The elephant rides are "touristy" but if you want to ride an elephant, do it!

Enjoy! Angkor is an incredible experience.

We used the hotel service to get a car and guide. The car driver was very nice, the guide...ok. We were also there the end of December and the hotel was very busy. Lots of guides for guests everyday. I don't think we got the best. The first day we had a young student and he was very good, but he was just a fill-in for the real guide. I would rather have had the student, but I really did not have any input to the selection. But since the guide and driver expect to be paid in US dollars, it was helpful to us to have the hotel pay them and put the fee plus a small extra charge on our bill which we paid by credit card. We did not have enough US money with us to pay all the stuff in Cambodia which required US dollars (extrance, exit?, temple fee,etc.)No ATMs here. FYI...when I had to made a phone call to US, I went to the phone company office (not far from Raffles) and called from there at reasonable price. From the hotel it would have cost a fortune.
Hobbes is correct.. the weather there is hot, hot, hot. We loved the pool! The guides expect to have a long time mid-day when the guidees use the hotel pool.
Do go to the artisan crafts center. Very nice quality and it seems to be trying to develop crafts-people.
We did not go to Phnom Penh.
Angkor Wat is really good. But do not expect the guides to be seriously knowledgeable. We heard all the guides give the same patter all around us at most sites. Buy a good book or just enjoy the art.

kathie----i'm in england...did you do a trip report yet...?? i don't want to miss it

bob

Elainee, we have a Tonle Sap boat ride included in our OAT itinerary for a post Vietnam extention to Cambodia which we will be taking at the very end of December, and your comments regarding conditions have given me pause. Folded into the morning of the boat ride would be a visit to a school which we'd like to do since we are teachers and also there would be a stop at the Killing Fields Memorial Temple. In your opinion--and we'd truly welcome all opinions, especially from any of you who've made this OAT trip-- are lake conditions so appalling that it would be worth forfeiting the school and the memorial in order not to have to experience the lake? And should we not do the lake trip, what suggestions have you for spending the morning other than visiting the temples? Thank you.

Everybody is different. Some people see the floating village as picturesque (sp?). We passed the school and if we had stopped there and brought school supplies to give to the school/children I would have felt that we had made a small contribution. They certainly could use everything. We noticed that even the "special" kids in school uniforms (on the mainland) had very short shool hours. Cambodia is the poorest country we have ever seen, and we have traveled thru Peru, Ecuador, Egypt, etc. No infrastructure left. Notice the wells built by the UN, and where the people get water when there are no wells. With the rather recent history in Cambodia, one should not ask too many questions about the past. Who do you think is middle-age and speaks English? Who survived? We did not think of this when we planned to stay at Raffles which certainly did not help the Cambodians, but we wanted to be comfortable and none of the other international hotels were any better in this regard. We did give money to the amputee bands which you will see. Cambodia is a lesson in the devistation of war. This hit me much harder than the beauty of the temples.

Thank you, Elainee, for your input. If we do stick to our itinerary and visit the school, we certainly will make a contribution in the form of a few supplies. If we would add a little money with that, do you think it would find its way back into the classroom, or do you think it would "disappear"?

There are loads of places you can stay in Siem Reap where your money does not go to an international chain. I loved where I stayed - en suite bathroom, fan (I loathe a/c unless it is really, really, hot - let's say above 35C). I was there in October so maybe by December the temps will have got up that high. Anyway - $10US a night.

If you want to see Tonle Sap don't take a boat ride take a journey and go to Batrey ai

yep same here I stayed in a $10 hotel that had more cable tv stations then my bkk apartment, a fridge, fan and bathroom.. pluss the place was spotless a bit too much I had too walk over the lady that was hand scrubbing the floor a couple of times a day.... the lights did go out though

Where did you guys stay for $10/night?

Well I could describe where it is easily but didn't think I could find the name being (a) not a diary keeper and (b) about to move house.

But you are in luck. The master travel box where I keep my maglite and travel plug and small bottles, etc. was on the top of the pile.

I stayed at Shadow of Angkor Guest House. It's on the road that runs alongside the river, just around the corner from the Old Market. There is a lovely eating house 3-4 doors down too.

[email protected].

Sorry, but taking a boat ride to Tonle Sap Lake and seeing the Vietnamese "boat village" was an unforgetable experience for me. One doesn't go to "stare" at the poor who live on boats. One goes to see another way of life. It has nothing to do with being "kind" or "unkind." If you look at the bas-reliefs at Bayon, you will see that these people have been living on boats for 500 years. Time has changed very little for them. One relief at Bayon depicted a mother combing out her daughter's hair. I saw the same exact "live" scene when I went down the Siem Riep River in a boat.

I really can't stand "tourists" who fly into a place to see "ruins," staying at "the best" hotels, only to skip the local culture because looking at "poverty" is too upsetting to them. These are the same people who mourn that there is no Louis Vuitton or Gucci to shop at whilst on holiday in the hinterlands.

Cheers,
John G.

I sort of agree, ThinG. But still don't much like taking a trip to "view". Much prefer to take a ride that gets me from A to B that is transport also for people who live in the villages. Don't you?

No, I don't agree, Miss Alice. I took the boat trip to see the local culture, which I am always interested in. That is one of the reasons I have travelled all over the world. I have always been more interested in people rather than "ruins" or museums. In my opinion, shutting your eyes to the poverty of the world is irresponsible.

Cheers,
John G.

ThinG - I think you have misunderstood. What I was saying is that I prefer to take a boat that is real public transport and will stop at villages because it has to - to pick people up - rather than a "viewing" boat that returns to whence it came.

My journey across the lake and along the river was the highlight of my trip to Cambodia, although I loved the temples too.

If you can't do that, then by all means take a trip - I agree it is good to see real life.

Ok lets have a show of hands- who among you gets up at dawn on vacation to see/do anything????

I have to get up at dawn each day to go to work- when on vacation - I sleep to a civilized hour!