My husband wants to go to Vientianne or Angkor Wat next spring during an extended trip to Thailand. We are not tour oriented and wonder how safe either of these places would be to do on our own. We know the logistics - how to get there, etc. We were just wondering if anyone had gone to either place totally on their own - no group, no guide. In Laos, we believe we could navigate the city on our own, but for Angkor Wat, we would want a day guide. Does anyone have any recommendations about local guides or places to stay? Has anyone been to both places? Did you enjoy one more than the other? Thanks in advance for your replies.

It very much depends on what you are looking for: <BR>Angkor Wat - one of the worlds great historical sites <BR>Vientiane - Asia as it used to be some 30 or 40 years ago but without so many tourist specific attractions

Thank you Pas14. We want to do both and will eventually, but I was just looking for some specifics on HOW to go about it. I've read that traveling overland to Cambodia is not only dangerous but is a very long journey of which much is left unplanned until you reach the border and basically hitch a ride to Siem Reap. Vientianne on the other hand is just a quick hop from Nong Khai.

meg-- <BR> <BR>it's been 9 yrs since i was in vientiane, and at that time the only way u cd get into laos was w/ a govt-organized 'tour'. didn't come away w/ many striking images or memorable moments, but luang prabang blew me away. go there if u can. we flew from vientiane and found a town on the banks of the mekong almost swallowed by jungle, w/ old imperial structures, friendly people, wood fires at evening mealtimes scenting the air, and a bright red sky over the jungle at dusk. u can take boat rides up the mekong from there, to buddhist caves and other villages. i have one friend who went a few years after i did and had no trouble meeting and going around w/ locals on their motorbikes. <BR> <BR>as for angkor wat, i lived in ho chi minh city from 1996-2000, and while there was a daily bus to phnom penh, which some backpackers used before connecting to a bus partway to siem reap and then boarding boats across tonle sap the rest of the way, i always heard this route was fraught w/ various perils, the most common being hijacking (of both buses and boats). among travelers heading over from vn, the consensus was that the overland route was cheap but risky. one friend was on her way across tonle sap via boat when the engine failed, the boat was marooned for hours (this is a huge lake whose far shore u sometimes cannot see) and people next to her began praying. when i was in siem reap last yr, i recall that a tourist bus was hijacked in the vicinity. <BR> <BR>don't know any more recent info, but i wd strongly urge u to fly btwn ur destinations. after my first yr i never traveled overland, not only bc of the crime threat but also bc of road conditions and an aggressive, dangerous driving culture. <BR> <BR>in siem reap, there are many small budget hotels near the stung river, but these are also near brothels. if u want comfort, i'd suggest angkor village across the river, an enclosed resort w/ bungalows, a pool, and fixed-price dinners w/ menus printed in french. i didn't have a guide, just a car and driver, and a guidebook. it's very possible to get ard on ur own, but u need transportation since siem reap is a couple miles from angkor and the walk is a hot, exposed, dusty one; and bc the temples, bridges and pavilions of angkor are scattered over a very large area. hotels like angkor village can arrange for car and driver, but many backpackers seemed to find guys w/ motorbikes to take them ard the various angkor sites for the day. hope this helps.

I can't rave enough about Angkor. It is absolutely amazing - unbelievable. <BR> <BR>We flew in from Bangkok on a very short flight (1 hour or less), which is what I recommend you do. From what I underdstand, only hardcore backpackers on very tight budgets DON'T fly. <BR> <BR>It was absolutely safe, and we did the whole thing, from air tickets to hotels & etc. on our own. Upon arrival, we hired the motorcylcle "taxi" drivers for US $7 per day to drive us to and from the sites each day. I greatly prefered to be on our own each day at the temples, prefering solitude and reading from a guide book to having someone trailing along with us. There are still relatively few tourists, and if you get an early start in the mornings, you will frequently find yourselves the only people in your range of vision at some of the temples, which is an incredible experience. <BR> <BR>Hotels in Siam Riep range from really cheap hostels, to US $30 budget hotels with private rooms and aircon in the heart of the city (our choice), to US $100 hotels a bit like low-end Holiday Inns on the airport road, to the Grand Hotel for US $400 (worth it if you can afford it). <BR> <BR>You will NOT regret going to Angkor!

Hi Meg <BR> <BR>here my recommendation: <BR>Angkor / Siem Reap is a must. Try there the Angkor Village Hotel (must be the most charming one in Cambodia)The bungalows there are wooden-made. Fantastic restaurant. Excellent value. <BR>Luang Prabang: peaceful place on the Mekong river with many things to do. Try the Villa Santi Hotel - excellent <BR>Vientiane: big "village" - not so interesting as Luang Prabang <BR>2 years ago we travelled alone with no guides - it was safe all around <BR>At the entry of Angkor Wat there are many guides awaiting you if you really need one.... <BR>have a nice weekend <BR>Bruno <BR>

I agree with Bruno. I was in Thailand last summer and flew to Siem Reap (Angkor Wat) from Bangkok and Luang Prabang from Chiang Mai. A travel agent in Bangkok can book these flights. We only booked them two days before we left Bangkok. It is not worth it to try and book them before you get there. We traveled to both places on our own. We did not hire a guide but we did hire a driver for the three days we were there. He would drop us off at each of the temples and wait, then drive us to the next site. We could have hired him as a guide too. He was very good. We stayed at a small French hotel - La Noria Guesthouse - for $35 a night. It was air-conditioned and very comfortable. It had an excellent restaurant. I would highly recommend it. I would also call ahead for reservations or e-mail them ([email protected]). It was very popular. <BR>I would also recommend going to Luang Prabang. It is was a very pleasant excursion. We flew from Chaing Mai and styed for three nights. We stayed at a small (5-room) restored home caled the Auberge Calao. The rooms were immaculate and air conditioned - a must. Our room had a balcony with a view of the Mekong River. It was about $50 a night with breakfast. The town is very peaceful and had delicious food. Take a boat ride on the Mekong and just relax. It was one of my favorite desinations during my vacation.

Vientiane is perfectly safe. Just a big village. Nothing much to see in terms of attractions, but found the place immensely charming. Siem Reap might have a larger risk for theft etc, but wouldn't say it's outright dangerous... day guides (moto drivers at least) are required for the Angkor temples. Impossible to compare the two, as Angkor is stunning, whereas Vientiane's greatest attraction is a charming atmosphere.

Try the Sofitel Royal Angkor. It's beautiful with excellent service. Angelina Jolie stayed there when she filmed "The Tomb Raider".

Just a counterpoint about the Sofitel - it's on the road on the way to the temples, which makes it about 5 minutes past town. There isn't, therefore, much of the local life around to see. Staying at the Sofitel would mean a 10-minute walk or taxi/motorbike ride into town anytime you wanted to walk around & see the local life, shop, check out more restaurants, etc.<BR><BR>If I had been considering a hotel costing over $200 US per night (as the Sofitel does), I would NO QUESTION choose the Grand Hotel d'Angkor. This is a hotel with history and old world opulence, and is consistently voted one of the top hotels in the world (and is closer to the action than the Sofitel, being right on the edge of town instead of past it). <BR><BR>I just did a quick check, and doubles at the Sofitel start at $213, and at $250 for the Grand Hotel.

I just got back from a trip to Angkor Wat. We stayed in a guesthouse and hired an excellent guide and car with driver for our time there. See my post below titled "Just Back-Cambodia and Thailand-Overland Info" for all the details.

About the Grand Hotel D'Angkor--it is a very beautiful hotel, but it doesn't have the old-world opulence that Andrea refers to because it has been COMPLETELY refurbished. It now looks like one of the trendy boutique hotels of LA or NYC. The service at the hotel is adequate at best, with a sullen, unsmiling staff. Yes, it is comfortable, tastefully decorated, offers many amenities, but it certainly isn't one of the best hotels in the world. And it certainly isn't on par with the Oriental of Bangkok or the Pen of Hong Kong (I have stayed at both). <BR><BR>I didn't see the Sofitel, but my guide, Che, told me it is a 5-star hotel, as is the Pansy. These, besides the Grand, are the only 5-star hotels in Siem Riep.<BR><BR>I think I will be going to Vientianne in the near future because an old friend's daughter was in Laos and she said it was the most beautiful place she has ever seen and the architecture is amazing.<BR><BR>Later.

I defer to the above poster - I did not stay at either the Sofitel or Grand Hotel, so I'm just going on reputation & location.

Yes, it's easy to set up your own trip in Cambodia and in Laos. I was in Cambodia in December and am heading for Laos in November. <BR><BR>I loved Angkor (take a look at my photos at www.marlandc.com) and stayed at the Angkor Village Resort. (www.angkor-village.com) It is beautiful, with wooden bungalows arranged around water gardens. It even gas a small swimming pool, which we appreciated after long, hot days at the temples.

Just an hour ago I was standing in line at a grocery store near Rittenhouse Square and I picked up a copy of Travel +Leisure Mag while waiting to pay for my Diet Coke. What a coincidence because the Grand Hotel D'Angkor was ranked only #25 of all the hotels in Asia. It was nowhere near the top 100 hotels in the world. In fact, the Hotel d'Paris in Monte Carlo was ranked higher--which is THE snottiest hotel you can image. I wouldn't stay there if you gave me the Pricess Grace Suite gratis and all the Krug I could drink.

John G, I have to admit that I chuckled at your last response! I'm willing to stay at the Hotel d'Paris in Monte Carlo if they give me the Princess Grace Suite gratis, as long as they supply the Dom.<BR><BR>As you know, I'm no fan of the Grand Hotel D'Angkor, mostly because I feel the price is obscene for Cambodia. I did go have a couple of drinks in the Elephant Bar, and the service was fine, but formal. It lacked the warmth of the service I received elsewhere in Siem Reap. I had the sense there of being cut off from the local culture in a way that I didn't feel at Angkor Village. I am well aware that all of the hotels and guesthouses in Siem Reap are for the use of tourists, not locals, but the ambiance at the various places differed dramatically.

Katie, I have stayed at the Hotel de Paris in Monte, and if you aren't wearing a diamond-encrusted Patek Philippe and driving a Maserati, forget it; you will be sneered at. Who wants to pay $1000 a night to get attitude from a doorman???<BR><BR>Yes, the service at Grand Hotel D'Angkor is fine, but to justify $385 a night in Cambodia, it should be exceptional. And you have to remember I just came from the Oriental in Bangkok, which is consitantly rated the best in the world. Hard to live up to <BR><BR>But, you are correct when you say it would be criminal to stay in such luxurious surrounding in a place where people are so poor. I would have felt like the Empress Alexandria polishing my Faberge eggs in front of the starving Russian masses.

For anyone pulling this thread up to research Angkor Wat, I would like to recommend our favorite hotel there. It is called the Angkoriana Hotel and is on the road to the temples just past the Sofitel. www.angkorianahotel.com<BR><BR>A roomy double is about US$50 per night, breakfast included. The building is new, the room is comfortable with air con (thermostat actually works) and a small mini-bar fridge. In addition, a small basket of fresh fruit was put in our room daily. <BR><BR>You can use the front desk computer for internet access at a very low rate and get your laundry done very inexpensively, but there is no pool or in-hotel restaurant.<BR><BR>It is owned by Madame Sou Ny, who is a most charming and helpful host. She seems to know everyone in Siem Reap and was able to help us with all sorts of special requests. We have stayed with her twice and wouldn't think of staying elsewhere.<BR><BR>As for a car and driver, the going rate is $20 a day for an air-con car and driver. The driver will pick you up as early as you want and stay with you as late as you want, delivering you back to your hotel after dinner or whatever. They seem to feel that the rate is for 24 hours. <BR><BR>Most people seem to become quite fond of their driver after a couple of days and give him a healthy tip. In fact, almost everyone you talk to who has used a driver will be eager to recommend him to you. I think this is simply a testament to the friendliness and warmth and just-plain-niceness of the Cambodian people.

Meg,Go to Angkor!!!!<BR><BR>The first time I went on my own, and just hired a car/driver since renting is imposible for foreigners. I also try to do most things on my own, no tours, where ever we go; fell very safe there. Stayed at the Grand Hotel D'Angkor, and found the service there ridiculous and not particularly friendly for SEA standards.<BR><BR>Then just this Jan/Feb I went with my boyfriend, and we stayed at a guesthouse in the center of town, right by the old market, which was great, and now the name escapes me, but there are many like it. We went to the Sofitel to meet friends for drinks but do not recommend it because is at the edge of town - we like to walk around in the evenings talking to the locals, and the best local restaurants are by the river. The locals everywhere else where wonderful, though.<BR><BR>Enjoy!<BR>

Just to clear up a few points made by above posters. While land travel to Siem Reap may be long (takes about 11 hours from Bangkok) and strenuous it is by no means dangerous anymore. There have been no reports of robberies along the road in the last two years. Many people travel this route daily and not just backpackers. The reason is of course cost. Return airfare will cost you around 275US where the land route runs from 34-68 depending on the mode of transportation you deceide on.