DAL FF going down hill fast
Jul 29th, 2006, 04:48 PM
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DAL FF going down hill fast
I wonder if American Express understands how hard it is to redeem a DAL frequent flyer mile now? maybe they would quit sending me all those card offers if they did.
I called Delta today after working for hours trying to find 4 sky saver seats for next spring. They told me they had to do the same thing and that I would be very lucky to find any flights. Said to keep checking back to see if revenue management turns loose of more seats.
Why can't they at least tell you there are no flights instead of putting you through the very cumbersome process of entering potential dates??? Why sell you on a frequent flyer program all these years and then turn it into a customer service nightmare??
I called Delta today after working for hours trying to find 4 sky saver seats for next spring. They told me they had to do the same thing and that I would be very lucky to find any flights. Said to keep checking back to see if revenue management turns loose of more seats.
Why can't they at least tell you there are no flights instead of putting you through the very cumbersome process of entering potential dates??? Why sell you on a frequent flyer program all these years and then turn it into a customer service nightmare??
Jul 30th, 2006, 09:06 AM
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What dates are you looking for? Do you have any flexibility with your dates? Are you looking for 4 coach or business class seats? Do you all have to take the same flights or is it OK if you split up your party? Would a less than direct routing be acceptable to you? Say 2 or more connections?
Are you checking online? Have you called the Partner Awards desk at Delta? They can check award availability on Northwest, Continental, Air France, KLM, Czech, Alitalia to get you across the Atlantic. Once you find availability on a transatlantic flight, I find that it's easier to work backwards and get the domestic and intra-Europe connections you need.
The last set of award tickets I booked was in late April.
Are you checking online? Have you called the Partner Awards desk at Delta? They can check award availability on Northwest, Continental, Air France, KLM, Czech, Alitalia to get you across the Atlantic. Once you find availability on a transatlantic flight, I find that it's easier to work backwards and get the domestic and intra-Europe connections you need.
The last set of award tickets I booked was in late April.
Jul 30th, 2006, 09:13 AM
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I posted advice and suggestions on this thread for obtaining Skysaver awards to Europe - http://www.fodors.com/forums/threads...p;tid=34798922
Also check this thread on Flyertalk - http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showt...ferrerid=18562
Read through both of the above threads and if you're still having trouble getting the awards you need, I'd be glad to try and help further.
Also check this thread on Flyertalk - http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showt...ferrerid=18562
Read through both of the above threads and if you're still having trouble getting the awards you need, I'd be glad to try and help further.
Jul 30th, 2006, 11:14 AM
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Also, did you ask them to look for partner flights? DL is a member of the Skyteam alliance, and you can use your Skymiles for US-Europe flights on CO, NW, AF, KL, AZ, OK (CSA Czech) and SU (Aeroflot). One of more may have award fligths to Italy on the days you want.
Jul 30th, 2006, 04:57 PM
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Thanks for the tips. Looks like I got to jump through a lot of hoops. I trying to fly between 6/1/07 and 7/31/07 and I have yet to find one sky saver seat let alone four. I went to NWA and they have much easier selection process allowing me to search flights within 3 days either direction of my preferred date. I saw some there so I think I will call DAL partner rewards and ask them to help me get those.
Jul 31st, 2006, 05:42 AM
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Spoke to the international desk today and the partner award program.
I am now convinced that sky saver seats to Europe are almost non existent for summer 2007. I couldn’t find a single seat to Rome.
I was told the same thing by representative.
So when you get all those brochures talking about their frequent flyer program--don't believe them.
Being cash strapped they have essential cut their liability to frequent flyers in half.
You know last year after Katrina when flights were very limited out of Baton Rouge they canceled a leg of a trip I had booked to Charlotte with them because of “fuel conservation.” They did that less than 18 hours from my planned departure.
This is a company that is finding it very hard to live up to their obligations.
Maybe the good times in the industry now will give them enough cash to honor their committments to customers.
I am now convinced that sky saver seats to Europe are almost non existent for summer 2007. I couldn’t find a single seat to Rome.
I was told the same thing by representative.
So when you get all those brochures talking about their frequent flyer program--don't believe them.
Being cash strapped they have essential cut their liability to frequent flyers in half.
You know last year after Katrina when flights were very limited out of Baton Rouge they canceled a leg of a trip I had booked to Charlotte with them because of “fuel conservation.” They did that less than 18 hours from my planned departure.
This is a company that is finding it very hard to live up to their obligations.
Maybe the good times in the industry now will give them enough cash to honor their committments to customers.
Jul 31st, 2006, 12:07 PM
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You can make award reservations 331 days in advance, so it's too early for July but as of right now you can book through approx end of June.
Were the seats you found on nwa.com Perksaver? Were they flights operated by NW or KLM? If so, it's possible these award seats are available to Worldperks members but not to Skymiles members. What did the DL agent say when you asked about these flights?
Did you have the DL agent check all transatlantic partner flights? I asked earlier if a less direct routing is acceptable. If you're trying to get 4 awards with only one stop between MSY and FCO, I think it's going to be extremely difficult in high season as you're limited to connections in ATL or EWR.
The following is just one example of what's available if you'd consider 2 stops:
CO116 MSY-IAH 17:45-18:55
AF31 IAH-CDG 22:00-14:40
AF2104 CDG-FCO 16:15-18:20
The above flight combination should be available for 4 passengers in coach (I assume you wanted coach) on June 3rd. It may also be available on other dates. I started checking with June 1st and stopped at the first available date I found.
I found the above flights through the NW Japan site which is mentioned in both of the above threads that I linked to (instructions on how to use the site are within those threads).
There are over 100 possible transatlantic flights within Skyteam. I only had to check a few to come up with one possible example. Partner awards can check all of them for you.
If you're flexible with your routing and dates, there shouldn't be a reason why you can't get the awards you need.
Were the seats you found on nwa.com Perksaver? Were they flights operated by NW or KLM? If so, it's possible these award seats are available to Worldperks members but not to Skymiles members. What did the DL agent say when you asked about these flights?
Did you have the DL agent check all transatlantic partner flights? I asked earlier if a less direct routing is acceptable. If you're trying to get 4 awards with only one stop between MSY and FCO, I think it's going to be extremely difficult in high season as you're limited to connections in ATL or EWR.
The following is just one example of what's available if you'd consider 2 stops:
CO116 MSY-IAH 17:45-18:55
AF31 IAH-CDG 22:00-14:40
AF2104 CDG-FCO 16:15-18:20
The above flight combination should be available for 4 passengers in coach (I assume you wanted coach) on June 3rd. It may also be available on other dates. I started checking with June 1st and stopped at the first available date I found.
I found the above flights through the NW Japan site which is mentioned in both of the above threads that I linked to (instructions on how to use the site are within those threads).
There are over 100 possible transatlantic flights within Skyteam. I only had to check a few to come up with one possible example. Partner awards can check all of them for you.
If you're flexible with your routing and dates, there shouldn't be a reason why you can't get the awards you need.
Jul 31st, 2006, 09:01 PM
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Mikem100-just to let you know that Delta was the first airline into the New Orleans area after Katrina ferrying people out using all volunteers on their aircraft. They also had a thing on the newswire yesterday that they are using some of their planes to help get Americans out of Lebanon to Cyprus to help the state department out.I still think that Patty has been a plethora of info for you so hopefully that will help you out to get to Rome.I have enjoyed flying Southwest but still feel that comparing them to a major carrier that goes overseas is "apples versus oranges".As somebody said in a different post-more people have redeemed their miles on Delta than any other airline.
Aug 1st, 2006, 06:54 AM
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Patty, partner awards told me if I found award flights on a partner airline they may not be available to DAL. I told her of two combinations I found on NWA and she said that she had no flights on partner airlines. What's up with that? I will call and find out. Thanks for all your help.
Dutyfree, are you saying that a "major carrier" should not be expected to run their business in a proper manner? They should offer international awards and tout them in advertising if they can't deliver. As I have stated on another thread, DAL FF are not something free I won. They are trips I earned and they owe them to me a part of a business transaction. Do you see how much trouble Patty goes through to find a flight (ie visit the NW Japan site)??
Let's not go to DAL's behavior during Katrina. I am not here to bash Delta. It 's just a fact they are cash strapped--they are bankrupt. It is a fact they canceled a flight on me for fuel conservation. It is a fact they can't find me a sky saver trip to Rome for next summer. IT IS A FACT THEY CANCELED FLIGHTS LEAVING NEW ORLEANS BEFORE THE HURRICANE EVEN THOUGH THE AIRPORT WAS STILL OPERATING. It is a fact other carriers put additional equipment into MSY on the day before the storm so their customers would not be stranded. If there were the first airline back they certainly did not come with anything close to the pre Katrina seats they once offered.
If these facts reflect badly on Delta I am sorry.
I am going to continue to do everything Patty has suggested because I want these flights. If you think this cumbersome, stupid process is good customer service then you are welcome to all my future seats on DAL.
Dutyfree, are you saying that a "major carrier" should not be expected to run their business in a proper manner? They should offer international awards and tout them in advertising if they can't deliver. As I have stated on another thread, DAL FF are not something free I won. They are trips I earned and they owe them to me a part of a business transaction. Do you see how much trouble Patty goes through to find a flight (ie visit the NW Japan site)??
Let's not go to DAL's behavior during Katrina. I am not here to bash Delta. It 's just a fact they are cash strapped--they are bankrupt. It is a fact they canceled a flight on me for fuel conservation. It is a fact they can't find me a sky saver trip to Rome for next summer. IT IS A FACT THEY CANCELED FLIGHTS LEAVING NEW ORLEANS BEFORE THE HURRICANE EVEN THOUGH THE AIRPORT WAS STILL OPERATING. It is a fact other carriers put additional equipment into MSY on the day before the storm so their customers would not be stranded. If there were the first airline back they certainly did not come with anything close to the pre Katrina seats they once offered.
If these facts reflect badly on Delta I am sorry.
I am going to continue to do everything Patty has suggested because I want these flights. If you think this cumbersome, stupid process is good customer service then you are welcome to all my future seats on DAL.
Aug 1st, 2006, 08:09 AM
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A couple of links for dutyfree
http://www.ajc.com/blogs/content/sha..._ticketin.html
This is a piece published by SWA I found by Google that I include to illustrate the difference in attitude of the two companies toward customers. Read the customer letters from those in New Orleans on 8/28/2005.
http://www.ragan.com/Media/MediaMana...FeatureMag.pdf
I am not a SWA employee and I know you Delta people tire of being compared to SWA but most of us just want you to run your airline in an above board, proper manner. (I am not the mikem that posted on the AJC site either. I found that site with Google on Delta Frequent Flyer
flights.)
http://www.ajc.com/blogs/content/sha..._ticketin.html
This is a piece published by SWA I found by Google that I include to illustrate the difference in attitude of the two companies toward customers. Read the customer letters from those in New Orleans on 8/28/2005.
http://www.ragan.com/Media/MediaMana...FeatureMag.pdf
I am not a SWA employee and I know you Delta people tire of being compared to SWA but most of us just want you to run your airline in an above board, proper manner. (I am not the mikem that posted on the AJC site either. I found that site with Google on Delta Frequent Flyer
flights.)
Aug 1st, 2006, 08:22 AM
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Wouldn't it be nice if FF programs were required to _publish_ the number of award seats and upgrades available on each flight? I have dark suspicions that only one or two are available on some and NONE on a number of flights.
Aug 1st, 2006, 09:38 AM
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I fail to understand why the OP is so angry <b>at this time</b>. All airlines have been cutting back on FF award seats for years, so it's no news. Even SW's FF program has been made more restrictive in recent years.
If the OP doesn't like DL's response after Katrina, then maybe he should just switch airline. CO is the first to restore full schedule to MSY. So, maybe switch? But of course, CO FF awards come from the same pool as DL's, so it's not really going to help you on that front.
If the OP doesn't like DL's response after Katrina, then maybe he should just switch airline. CO is the first to restore full schedule to MSY. So, maybe switch? But of course, CO FF awards come from the same pool as DL's, so it's not really going to help you on that front.
Aug 1st, 2006, 09:48 AM
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"Patty, partner awards told me if I found award flights on a partner airline they may not be available to DAL."
That's correct which is why I asked if the seats you found were on NW/KL (and also if they were perksaver). This is how it generally works though there are always exceptions. Each carrier's website is designed to look for award seats available to that carrier's ff members. Each carrier may set aside award seats for their own members which may not be available to members of their partners so that an award seat found on Carrier A's website operated by Carrier A may or may not be available to members of Carrier B. However, an award seat found on Carrier A's website operated by Carrier C will generally be available to members of Carrier B. At least, that's how it usually works with Skyteam.
In my experience, I've never found an award seat on AF through the NW site that wasn't available to Skymiles members.
IIRC in the report that dutyfree referenced, award seats redeemed represented something like 9% of DL capacity last year. I happen to think 9% is very high (maybe you don't agree). However, that doesn't mean that one particular flight will have <b>any</b> award seats. Unfortunately, if that happens to be the flight that you want, that makes you unhappy.
That's correct which is why I asked if the seats you found were on NW/KL (and also if they were perksaver). This is how it generally works though there are always exceptions. Each carrier's website is designed to look for award seats available to that carrier's ff members. Each carrier may set aside award seats for their own members which may not be available to members of their partners so that an award seat found on Carrier A's website operated by Carrier A may or may not be available to members of Carrier B. However, an award seat found on Carrier A's website operated by Carrier C will generally be available to members of Carrier B. At least, that's how it usually works with Skyteam.
In my experience, I've never found an award seat on AF through the NW site that wasn't available to Skymiles members.
IIRC in the report that dutyfree referenced, award seats redeemed represented something like 9% of DL capacity last year. I happen to think 9% is very high (maybe you don't agree). However, that doesn't mean that one particular flight will have <b>any</b> award seats. Unfortunately, if that happens to be the flight that you want, that makes you unhappy.
Aug 1st, 2006, 10:29 AM
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Patty,
Thanks for the link with the tip on NWA Japan. Very useful. I'm researching flight schedules and award availability for a June trip to Greece. From the Midwest and East Coast, I'm not having much luck. However, I have a credit on Midwest Airlines and a vouchure on SWA which I could use to get to LAX or SFO non stop. I noitice on NWA Japan, that AF has business seats available from both LAX and SFO in June on many dates. Are you saying that if an AF award shows up on NWA Japan, then typically the award is available to SkyTeam members? I have not called the Delta International Awards desk as I'm not ready to book yet. I'm still researching my options.
Thanks,
Matt
Thanks for the link with the tip on NWA Japan. Very useful. I'm researching flight schedules and award availability for a June trip to Greece. From the Midwest and East Coast, I'm not having much luck. However, I have a credit on Midwest Airlines and a vouchure on SWA which I could use to get to LAX or SFO non stop. I noitice on NWA Japan, that AF has business seats available from both LAX and SFO in June on many dates. Are you saying that if an AF award shows up on NWA Japan, then typically the award is available to SkyTeam members? I have not called the Delta International Awards desk as I'm not ready to book yet. I'm still researching my options.
Thanks,
Matt
Aug 1st, 2006, 10:57 AM
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"Are you saying that if an AF award shows up on NWA Japan, then typically the award is available to SkyTeam members?"
Yes, that's what I've found to be the case. If you have a choice of AF flights, you may want to research the aircraft configurations on the Flying Blue forum over at Flyertalk.
Yes, that's what I've found to be the case. If you have a choice of AF flights, you may want to research the aircraft configurations on the Flying Blue forum over at Flyertalk.
