Cheweyhead

Just wondering, how can anyone "hate" Jao?

spassvogel

napamatt

this is from the sanctuary website
www.sanctuarylodges.com

"Chief's Camp is a luxury bush camp situated on Chief's Island in the exclusive Mombo Concession of the Moremi Game Reserve in Botswana."

Rack in peak season 1450US$ - Huch....

SV

ShayTay

I've used David Anderson Safaris in Santa Barbara several times. He can book WS camps, or any mix you choose. He's been in the safari planning business for many years.

napamatt_2

SV

The vehicles still do not traverse the same areas, they bump up to each other but there is a definite boundary.

HariS

Sunny California,

You can easily book with agents in Botswana. Two come to mind, safari destinations and The Booking Company. Both are situated in Maun. Both know what they are doing and will do a good job.

Then there is Elusive Africa Safaris (I have personally booked a trip with them) and very happy with the service.

Mix and match is definitely the way to go! Those WS free extra night offers are only valid for certain months. No idea when you are going.

Will be keen to hear what you come up with in your research. Cybor talks about a huge differential in pricing and that definitely would be the way to go to check the various rates offered as there is no need to be fleeced!!!

LAleslie

Shaytay, how long ago did you use David Anderson Safaris? He got into a bit of trouble a while back, so I raise a red flag.
Here's the story, albeit an 8-year-old one:

http://tinyurl.com/czjamr

Just a head's up. Maybe he's gone legit.
Leslie

craig_beal

sunny_california,

looks like you have plenty to think about. several people came around to recomending the same people i recomended in the first place (ultimate africa, aac, etc).

premier tours was also mentioned on this thread. julian harrison is the owner and edits the south africa section for fodors or fromers.

you should definitely stick to one of these types of companies.

craig

craig_beal

sunny_ca,

misty poppers list is good but it did not include desert and delta or orient express. both operate camps in botswana as well.

craig

roadwarriorafrica

I got an email from SouthAfrica 365 stating:
Wilderness Safaris: An extra night in the wilderness... on us!

In our business we see many special deals and once-off offers. Every now and again, we see one so good that we simply have to share it with our clients.

Wilderness Safaris is the pinnacle of conservation through ecotourism in Southern Africa. They have been operating in Africa for the past 25 years and offer some of the most pristine wilderness reserves on our planet. Camps are offered in Botswana, Namibia, Malawi, South Africa, Zambia, Zimbabwe and the Seychelles, services are safe, authentic and insightful.

For all bookings greater than 7 nights made before the 28th of February 2009, we will compliment another night for free (T&C’s apply)

See the Wilderness Safaris website here (Please contact us for all further information and bookings, as these cannot be processed through Wilderness Safaris directly)

i contacted my TA who is in J'burg, and she got me this deal for June 2009.

PredatorBiologist

Add Footsteps in Africa to Misty Poppers and Craigs list of Botswana camp operators, it is one of the largest collections of independent camps and provides some of the best values in private concessions.

Also beware when you mix and match that some agents that are WS specialists do not provide the best pricing on the non-WS camps as part of the effort to encourage you to stay in all WS products and often they may just not be aware of the deals available because they are completely focused on one product line. Ask for some pricing transparency or you may well overpay when you mix and match.

spassvogel

PredatorBiologist

When you advise on "transparency": What you mean?

When I ask for a trip to be created based on my very precise demand I never get the price per venue let alone the rate per night. From any TA.
How you manage to get to that transparency?

Thank you for enlightening.

SV

cary999

My TA provides me with cost of each camp (rate per night) and the cost of each transportation to/from and between camps. What's the big secret anyway? With enough effort I could figure it out on my own or very close to it. My TA has it, just give it to me. If I don't like it I won't buy it, simple.

Maybe it's because my TA knows that I can find these costs. That the camps do publish details like transfer cost for between the airport and the camp. That I will ask GenAir about their air charter cost between two camps, etc. If you don't show your TA you care, then how are they to know you do? They may think you don't want to be bothered by the details, just the bottom line? Like most of the rich and famous

regards - tom

ShayTay

LALeslie, yes, that's an old story about David Anderson. In 1999/2000, David took on a partner in a bid to expand his business... bad move with the wrong person! As the article notes, he resigned from the LLC and started another business without that partner. I'm aware of this because some friends and I were right in the middle of planning a trip to southern Africa at the time. We ended up using a woman that had worked for David and who set up her own company. This was done with David's blessing, so that our deposit didn't disappear into the partner's pockets.

David has been in the safari planning business since 1985 and is certainly "legit". He even had his own crew in Kenya for a while. He has been working on his "Focus on Africa" and "Focus on Planet Earth" projects for the past few years. I went to Zambia in 2003 on a "Focus on Africa" safari and one of my photos was published in his book, "On Safari". He is now working on the second edition. I last booked a safari with him in 2006 (also southern Africa.) He also books private safaris not related to these projects. When I had lunch with him a couple of years ago, he was working on a safari for a family group of 20.

LAleslie

Yes, ShayTay, that was his side of the story. But it wasn't exactly a partnership. And many people got left in the lurch when Anderson did not transfer the deposit money to the service providers in Africa. Carlson Wagonlit, a huge operator who brought a large group to Anderson, had to make good on the trip. (To blithely blame this on Carlson Wagonlit, a huge established company, is a bit of a stretch IMO.) Anderson then filed for bankruptcy, and opened a business under a new name. It's a not-uncommon story in the travel business.
He may be back on solid ground now, I really don't know. But, as I said, skeptical eyebrows should be raised. At the least, people should check with California's Travel Consumer Restitution Corp. to see if he's registered or has any outstanding problems. In other words, do your homework.

HariS

My goodness!!! So, this kind of stuff happens more often than I imagined? This story that we are reading sounds like a soap opera straight out of Santa Barbara? Sorry, I don't know these people, so I won't judge them, but, this sounds similar to another fodors-made travel agency doesn't it?

I think what PB is trying to say above is, that certain agents favor certain operators and will sell the alternate options only at that price - which may make it a choice between the preferred operator and the alternate choice at the same price.

For example, the E gnu price listing when the rates were a little more varied in actual terms, but, they tried to project similar rates. I am talking about back in 2006 or 2007 something like that........

atravelynn

This is disturbing, even though it happened a while back.

Maybe their coffee-table catalogs back in about 2000 did them in. Those were works of art and weighed a ton.

I was in touch with David Anderson Safaris about 1999-2000 and had no idea of the problems.

I remember getting something that stated he was quitting the safari business to do more charitable work. My (naive) conclusion at the time was, "Wow he must really have been successful to be able to do only charitable work now." All these years later I learn that was a snow job.

Seeing the Focus projects reminds me that the various David Anderson safaris were all Focus on this and that. Focus on big cats or Focus on elephants.

On my 1st trip to Africa, I was running into people left and right who had booked with--I think it was--Flamingo Travel, a big agency. They arrived in Africa to find none of the properties they had booked had been. I saw bellowing irate guys and women in tears throughout my trip at various stops.

I learned from that to check directly with the properties before leaving home to make sure you were not duped.

I check in with the local properties sometimes, but not always when I use a repeat reputable agent.

If these people who had used Flamingo bought travel insurance, would they not be able to collect unless Flamingo was on the list?

wkwb42a

We just booked our trip to South Africa with Julian Harrison of Premier. He is originally from South Africa, and he is certainly very knowledgeable and professional. He is the co-author of Fodor's African Safari, which we just enjoyed reading. Our trip will be in April.

PredatorBiologist

Tom and Hari did further explain my thoughts correctly. I believe an agent should be able to tell you your prices for each lodge and for getting around --that way you know if you are paying published rack, or at what discount, or heaven forbid premium you might be paying. Hari hit my thought exactly right, sometimes if an agent has a preferred company when they mix in another operators property they might not give you the best price to diminish the value advantage of that camp and keep you into their preferred options. You can only know this if you ascertain what price each camp is coming at.

ShayTay

LAleslie, the LLC was a partnership. As your linked article states, Anderson did take on partners. In fact, the LLC was formed in July 1999. The article also states that he resigned from the LLC in November 1999. After that point in time, David was no longer affiliated with the LLC that bore his name. Some people may not have made a distinction between the two, however. It was the LLC that didn't transfer the funds and declared bankruptcy, not David. I know from my own experience that he did the best he could to protect his clients. In early 2000, the partner called me and angrily demanded to know where my money was. I told her that we didn't book anything through them and that she wouldn't be getting a check from me. My information doesn't come from David, but from others who were close to the situation. I assume that you have some connection to Anderson, LAleslie. Were you a client, too?

Atravelynn, his charitable work isn't a "snow job." I've met with him several times and know that he's serious about his focus on environmental and sustainability issues. He recently partnered with Richard Leakey on some lectures about these subjects as they relate to Africa. This was also the message of his two books. Heck, he even travels around Santa Barbara by bicycle and he's not a young man. Yes, he ties it to what he knows, the safari business and photography. You can read his Mission Statement on the Focus on Africa website. Can we help highlight these issues for people in our home countries by our African travels and photos? I certainly hope so! I know for a fact that several people I've traveled with to Africa have stepped up and helped out.

atravelynn

I'm glad there is real substance behind the charity work and I'm sure the recipients are glad too.

The shady partner you describe reminds me of a similar drama that played out on this forum, where partners had a falling out complete with finger pointing and frantic clients left in the lurch. Hopefully it all worked out for everyone who trusted these agents with their once-in-lifetime African safari that they had saved for over the years.

Since I am always honest in my business dealings and financial transactions, I just want the same on the other end and have no tolerance for a lack of integrity or for stealing my money. Needless to say, I am completely disgusted every time I turn on the news lately.