cary999

Christo - re car hire/rental, we have three times picked up the car from Avis at JNB airport. And all three times driven to Kruger and after Kruger left the car with an Avis office in Hoedspruit. From Hoedspruit we go into the Timbavati, Kings Camp. Actually, an Avis agent drives in with us to camp and and takes the car back. We have never had an incident/problem doing this. The reason we choose Avis (over other SA companys) is because Avis is based in the USA and and should there be a problem of any kind we would like to deal with a "local" company for us.

The part that gives me the most difficulty is getting the right model of car. Many of today's econo-boxes set very low, small windows, very raked windscreen with large side pillars. For seeing game in Kruger you want a car just the opposite of all of this . You interested in more details, just ask.

As for Madikwe Reserve, I was there in May of 2007 for 5 nights at the Madikwe Hills Lodge. The Lodge itself was fantastic -but- game viewing was ok, just ok. So I'm not that enthused about Madikwe Reserve. However, other folks here have been.

regards - tom

Candace_c

Tom,

Do you know about M. T. Beds? If you can book close to your arrival date, you can get deals up to 1/2 off. They are very pleasant to talk to. If they don't have the very lodge you are looking at, they can suggest another of the same quality. (mtbeds.co.za)

Also, we visit SA for about 5 weeks twice a year and usually stay at Tomjachu Game and Nature Reserve just south of Nelspruit. It is significantly cheaper than safari lodges, has a 4 star grading, and can be done self-catering. No cats or elephants, but other animals and tons of birds. We just call MT Beds, leave for a couple of days to visit Kruger, Sabi Sands, or Phinda and then come back "home." They can also stow luggage if you want to leave and return later. 100% safe and reliable. (tomjachu.com)

Candace

cary999

Hi Candace, thanks, I have heard of M.T.Beds. Have you used them? If so, for what safari camps? Tomjachu looks nice (went to their web site) but I think I’d really miss big cats and eles.

Back to M.T.Beds, I have not heard from anyone that has used them. My main difficulty is deciding the trade offs involved doing it, in theory it sounds good. But there are a lot of unknowns without more real life details. I fly from USA California so flights cost $1,500-$2,000. (You in USA?). So I do not want to squander that cost (and the rigors of two days flying each way). My usual cost of safari camps, well last Sep 2009 I spent 8 nights at Kings Camp Timbavati and 5 nights at Kirkmans Kamp Sabi Sand and my cost was $4,300 (per person). Sure I’d like to save half of that, and then I’d likely spend it on another 10 days in safari camps (if half off) . But another associated significant cost could be transferring between camps. Charter flights (General Airways) is typically $350 (for 1 or 2 persons) for a short hop between reserves. So hopping between reserves could eat up savings quickly. Unless of course I stayed in the same reserve and the camps transferred me by vehicle. And probably could enjoy spending 20 nights in Sabi Sand camps

Anyway, am I overly concerned, has over analysis led to paralysis?
If you, or anyone, can give me some first hand experience using M.T. Beds, I sure would appreciate it. And of course since the real subject here are $$$, also their “before and after” prices using MT Beds.

regards - tom
ps - last Sep before Kings Camp and Kirkmans we spent 7 days in Kruger so total time in Africa was 20 days.

cary999

I did search here for MTBeds and for last three years found these three threads with MTBeds as topic subject-

http://www.fodors.com/community/afri...-mtbedscom.cfm

http://www.fodors.com/community/afri...-mtbedscom.cfm

http://www.fodors.com/community/afri...marchapril.cfm

But none of above had specific camp and $$$ examples.

Also, in searching within all subjects for replies I found this good example, which would be about 50% discount. Great deal, I would certainly go back to Kirkmans-
From Krugerlover on Jan 13,08
I used mtbeds to get accommadation at Kirkman's Kamp in December. Payed R1440-00 pppn and got 3 nights.

BTW, MTBeds web site lists 24 camp discounts for Sabi Sand, Timbavati and adjacent reserves-
http://www.mtbeds.co.za/hotels/sabi-...-reserves/0/25
Some at 50% off, some less, many say for “SA residents only”.
Using one camp as a test, Lion Sands River Lodge, for any combo of dates I put in for August MTBeds says there is availability. Really, not one day in August is the camp not full? I doubt that, so this would require additional emails or telephone calls.


Regards - tom

christabir

tom - we were going to try the mtbed thing last year. Book the flights 30-60 days out and then 30-14 days ahead try to get last minute availability. We chickened out three months before we went and booked a well-planned trip. If you are flexible and willing to give it a go, it sounds like it could save a bundle.

We are currently looking at a 17-20 day trip. I think we'll be able to do it for under $3000 pp plus air and car. Going to try Shindzela, Entabeni (husband is a golfer), Kruger, Tembe, Hilltop in Hluhluwe and Thanda. None are self catering, and I added in NP fees and game drives. Most include all meals. We also have a few one nighter hotels for transfer time. All are big five.

I know it doesn't answer your question, but you could really save a lot and still stay in high end camps with mtbeds. The number of camps surprised me, too. Oh to be a SA res - really great deals, and no airfare!

Question - how did you get the Avis rep to join you, and how did you get to next camp/airport? Renting an SUV is quite pricey for three weeks. Any suggestions?

wildwings

christabit, you could always emigrate to south africa
I know a few people who live here for 6 months of the year, and abroad the rest of the time

cary999

Thanks christabir. Twenty days for $300 is great rate, works out to $150 per day. As for MTBeds, I guess I look at it as are the $$ saving versus the unknowns worth it coming over from the USA? Also, I've heard that once you are "in country" you can get the SA resident deals.

Cars.
We have had Avis "collect" the car actually at two locations, Hoedspruit as I mentioned and also at Kruger Skukuza. Both locations have Avis offices. The fellow at Hoedspruit said he makes the trip into Timbavati about 3 times a week, so nothing new to them. (Hoedspruit has an airport, HDS) There is a charge for it, I think it was $20 and I also tip the agent. Ok, so, now we have turned in the car and are at Kings Camp. After Kings Camp they have a shuttle back to Hoedspruit airport (costs about $40 pp). Or, if your next camp is in Timbavati they will use a camp vehicle and drive you there. Or, if your next camp is in Sabi Sand you hope on a General Airways charter flight at the Kings Camp airstrip.

Car choice, yeh SUV size would be nice. Sep 2009 we had a Honda Jazz. It was not great, was low, had big raked windscreen with huge pillars but it did have an auto transmission. In 2007 we had a Subaru Forester which was good, sort of a mini SUV or wagon. But still its back passenger window did not go all the way down (typical today) which irritated my sister setting back there. A nice thing about Avis at JNB is that it is a huge operation and they have many many cars to choose from. But as you know Avis in SA is still a -lot- more expensive than Avis USA.

regards - tom

ArthurSA

Ton, there could always be an exception to the rule, in the end it could be simply "supply and demand" and negotiable. But "South African Residents only" usually means "Permanent Residency", which has a legal meaning and has to be verified by means of a S.A. Identity Document.

Although I have seen that requirement (the id doc) listed in the past, I happened to see it very recently on the SANparks website, as in "South African Citizens and Residents (with ID)".

ArthurSA

Oops, I obviously meant "Tom".

Celia

Christo, I think most of the car theft is of BMW's and other high-end luxury cars. There are gangs that make their living stealing these and taking them to Zim where they're exported. We do always keep our rental car locked, and we've never had problems. On our last two trips we've rented SUV's or trucks, and driven them in the game parks, small towns, and rural areas, and had no problems with theft or robbery.

We've always picked up our rental in Jo'burg, and dropped it off there or elsewhere, depending on the trip. In 2008 when we went to Kgalagadi Transfrontier Park, we rented a small car in Jo'burg, drove it to Upington where we traded it for a 4x4 which we used in the park, and then in Upington turned that in for another small car to use on the rest of the trip where we didn't need the height for game viewing.

If you like driving, South Africa's a great country to do it in. The scenery is wonderful and the roads are generally good.

Celia

christabir

tom - thanks for the car recs and info. Can you drive a sedan into Timbavati? I prefer a manual while on vacation (not for every day) so that's ok for us. I think it's going to add about $1000 pp, so our "cheap" safari will not be. Plus, add food at about half of the above and golf (for him) and horseback riding (for me) and it's still nuts.

ww - that's the plan!
Celia - great idea to exchange the car as needed. That could be doable at Richard's Bay for us.

cary999

MTBeds -
Why they would limit it to SA residents defies my logic. Maybe it is a requirement of the camp? Still, why? What does MTBeds bring to the process anyway? Bet they just call the camps and check on availability for you. Book it and take a commission. I can understand needing their help if I know nothing about camps. But since I do , why could I not just call the camps for the same rate deal? Either 2 weeks ahead or after I'm there at the airport.

About ID/fee for SANParks, yes the cost is more if not SA citizen. At Kruger you buy the Park fee at your first camp and every camp after checks that you have it. That SANParks has varying fees is logical to me, that a private business safari camp does, is not logical for me.

Driving to Timbavati - There is a "main" asphalt road that runs along inside the north edge of the Timbavati. Off of it are smooth gravel roads into the camps. So, sure, no problem driving any kind of car. The camps (and staff) have cars and vans they use to shuttle guest to/from Hoedspruit. Yep, car and other costs do add up like you say. I used to think that cruising was expensive at $200 pppn, but not any more .

regards - tom

ArthurSA

Tom, my assumption has always been that it is a requirement of the camp (or whatever), not MTBeds. I don't have any personal experience of that, but over the years I have seen many "direct" (not third party) print adverts that have that pricing difference. I think those adverts have even included Sun International, although that wasn't recently.

I'm not an advocate of the policy, I'm just the messenger. But as a S.A. citizen born and "bred" I'm also not going to join any crusade. ;-)

BTW, MTBeds is owned by Comair, the BA and Kulula operator. It was launched in 2000 and acquired by Comair in 2008.

cary999

Thanks ASA, I'm not upset with you nor the camps. It's their business to price and sell how they wish. It's just I don't follow their logic, but then again at least half of the whole world is not logical to me .

I'm really becoming more and more tempted to add a few days time to my next trip so I can fly into JNB and spend a full day shopping for bargain safari camps. Camps with room beginning the next day!!! No problem for me to "waste" a couple of days as long as doesn't cost a lot. But like I said above, big savings could be negated if several expensive camp transfer are required. FWIW, this has also been suggested to try at Maun for Botswana camps.

regards - tom

cary999

Just thought, if anyone is hesitant to talk about this here in public, suggest/discuss ideas, agent names in SA to work with, etc. my email is on my profile here.

regards - tom

kimssouthafrica

Change regions and look at Kwazulu Natal, we have some lovely luxurious lodges that will take you on game drives in to our Big Five National Park Hluhluwe/Mfolozi and there is so much else to do in this area, St Lucia Wetlands for boat cruises to see hippo and crocs in the wild, birding, Emdoneni Cheetah and wild cat sanctuary, and it is on the beautiful coastline of Kwazulu natal
www.kzn.org.za

Lodges to consider Thula Thula http://www.thulathula.com/
http://www.makakatana.co.za/gallery.htm, http://www.zulunyala.com/ and lots of other options

www.kimssouthafrica.blogspot.com