kcapuani

Can someone tell me what game reserves in South Africa allow hunting? I found through this forum that Klaserie, Timbavati and Thornybush all do. I do not want to see anything upsetting while in South Africa - Do most of them allow hunting and is there a certain hunting season?

I don't want to start a debate about the evils vs. the merits of hunting...

safarimama

here's a lively thread on that subject:

http://www.fodors.com/community/afri...wild-lions.cfm

and here's the second update (just published):
http://planyoursafari.com/blog/canne...unting-part-ii

tactile

Try not to confuse trophy hunting with canned hunting.
To make it clear, Timbavati should not be thought to conduct canned lion hunting.
But many reserves, lodges do undertake trophy, or permit hunting.
Canned hunting has nothing to justify it.Evil practice.
On the other hand ,trophy, or permit hunting has justification in many circumstances.A rogue elephant perhaps.Too many young male rhinos in a reserve where a mature male has has dominated the gene pool for too long.Whatever.(saddest thing I've seen is the 5th young male rhino gored to death by the old bull rhino)
So in researching your decision, don't take the above thread references without noting that they refer to canned hunting.
Many reserves will allow trophy or permit hunting from time to time.

kcapuani

Thank you - I had read the thread on Canned hunting vs Hunting of Wild Lions, but not the follow up.

I am against hunting in all of its forms - I work for my local SPCA so clearly I am an animal loving crazy person. My mother and I would like to avoid lodges that have any kind of hunting on their land. Is this possible? If it is an unrealistic expectation, which have the most strict practices?

Again, I don't wish to debate about hunting, I just want to make sure that we do not spend thousands of dollars on a safari only to see someone bringing back a trophy. Also, I realize I will see animals killing other animals on the trip. I'll probably find that upsetting too, but a lion's gotta eat...

sandi

Based on your earlier thread, if visiting at Sabi Sabi, it's most unlikely you'll come upon anyone hunting. And, on Reserves where there may be hunting (don't know what seasons/months this may happen), it would be at great distance from where any private camps are located.

kcapuani

Most likely we'll be going to Sabi Sands, but I have been looking at other reserves as well to perhaps spend a few nights. I have started to work with Go2Africa and I'm sure they can help steer me clear of what I wish to avoid.

Thank you!

pixelpower

IMHO...

Game Reserves, Nature Reserves and the likes (iow everything that is not a national park), are a patchwork of lodges, farms and private getaways.

Some of those lodges & farms may be about hunting, other will be the kind of place we are looking for. On their website it will be fairly obvious what their business is about, that's for sure.
And one other thing is for sure as well; if you are in a private concession offering regular safaris, then you will not be bothered by hunters. The owners of your concession will certainly not allow them on their land. You may "hear" them "next door" though.

Whether or not a certain "reserve" has hunting farms depends on the "reserve rules". However, I think no reserve should be dismissed in it's totality just for lacking any hunting-not-allowed rule. After all, we'd want to promote the non-hunting businesses in such reserve, would we not? It would certainly be a shame if the "good" businesses would die out in such reserve, just because there's some hunting business 50 miles further away in that same reserve.

I also think you should not look at these kind of things with a black & white view. There are many shades of gray. For instance, you may get the advice to choose a concession in Sabi Sands, because that reserve does not allow hunting at all. That's great advice, but I once heard a guide say that this reserve has a predator density that is kept artificially high by pumping in a lot of prey animals every year. He spoke of 500 buffalo, etc...
I don't know if this is the truth, and I actually don't care. I go there too! But if it IS true, even in part, then it would boil down to this: you'd be driving around happily in Sabi Sands looking at animals for which you know that they will not die from being hunted by man. But any animal you see may be far from happy, suffering stress levels that are too high and/or with a chance of survival that is as much sub-par as in any hunting concession.

B.regs,

J.

LAleslie

Good answer, pp. One of the things I found most illuminating on safari was the stress wild animals are constantly under just trying to survive. Whether the ones that are surrounded by an unnatural number of predators are less "happy" and under more stressw is impossible to judge in human terms, of course. But still, um, food for thought.

KayeN

Hi kcapuani
I am a very regular visit to the sabi sands, and I have never, ever heard of them bringing in buffalo. I do know that the Sabi Sands Reserve has brought in wildebeest in the past. They border Kruger National Park so to bring in large numbers of prey animals would be unnecessary.
I am in your shoes in that I love animals, do not want to see or hear anything regarding hunting of said animals. I have been to a reserve in Zimbabwe that had a hunting reserve next door and while I didn't see anything, I certainly heard gun shots during my stay.
I also like to see relaxed animals when gameviewing, and the sabi sands certainly has cats that are extremely relaxed. Occasionally you come across a nervous cat, but then they have usually come from Kruger and are quite new to vehicle traffic. If they remain to become territorial, then with proper gameviewing they will also become better and better with time in feeling more comfortable around vehicles. When a cat falls asleep within viewing distance of your vehicle, then I am assured that they see us as part of the surroundings. If an animal keeps moving away from a vehicle and the vehicle keeps following the animal, then not only do I know that the ranger is disrespectful to the animal, I know that the poor animal is nervous of our presence and we should move away.
Every day is life and death to these animals, so it is vital that your ranger puts an animal's general well being before our wishes, no matter how pushy the odd guest can be!
I am sure you will have a fabulous time so good luck with your planning!
Kind regards
Kaye