Hi Kavey, Rocco, Michael, Sundowner, and all. I've not been around much, some health issues, but now we're returning to Africa next year around end of May through June to Tanzania, Namibia and SA. My spouse has planned this as a special celebration and has his heart set on most of it. The number of stars means how certain he is that he wants this lodge or camp (*** means nothing else will do, etc.).

2 nights Ngorongoro crater lodge Tree camp ***
3 nights - Serengeti private mobile camp **
3 nights Grumeti river - either Sabora tented camp or Faru Faru river lodge
1 night dar es salaam (Kilimanjaro Kempinsky Hotel)
1 nt Windhoek (Hotel Heinitzburg)
3 nts Skeleton Coast Camp Namibia **
1 nt Joburg (International) ***
3 nts Rattrays at MalaMala ***
3 nts Phinda Vlei (or Rock) **

It's our second trip to Africa (first was Zambia (Royal Livingstone), Botswana (Stanley's/Mombo/Chiefs) and SA (Singita Boulders, Cape Grace). This one is averaging about $750 pp pn (1500 for two) *not* including any flights.

The inter-Africa air estimate is high now around $5000-$6560 total for two but is expected to come down when we book our air from the states to Africa (probably via Europe).

I read some past posts about the Grumeti properties. Any update on these? Has anyone been?

And the skeleton Coast Camp in June, how cold were the tents at night in June?

Anyone have comments on the non-starred choices? Appreciate any thoughts.

Clematis
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Hi Clematis,

Welcome back!!!

Looks like you have a wonderful itinerary planned. I was just at the Crater Lodge myself three months ago and both my wife and I absolutely loved it. If you do get there before June 01st, your rates should be substantially lower.

Given that you are already doing a CCA camp with Crater Lodge, it may be to your advantage to consider CCA's Tanzania Under Canvas option for your 3 night mobile safari. Another solid option would be Nomad (www.nomad-tanzania.com) as they also offer semi-permanent camps that pick up and go every two weeks to follow the Migration. I stayed with Nomad Tanzania and loved it. If you have a moment, have a look at my Tanzania photo album:

www.kodakgallery.com/rocco/tanzania

Just eyeballing your itinerary...wouldn't you be able to get from the Grumeti River to Joburg on the same day so you could then do Mala Mala and Phinda, and then getover to Windhoek the same night and finish with Skeleton Coast camp? (Just trying to kill a night of filler...alternately two nights in Joburg at a place like the Michelangelo Hotel in Sandton may be a nice way to use the extra night).

It is a lot of traveling but you should really see a lot. However, just to play devil's advocate, because I only see 2 stars listed by Namibia, I am wondering if you would not be better served with a little extra time at your other destinations?

Lake Manyara Tree Lodge is an amazing lodge even if the wildlife is not overwhelming.

Also, there are some nice options in Tarangire such as Swala (Sanctuary Lodges), Olivers Camp (Asilia) and Nomad has a new camp there, as well.

The good thing about your Phinda visit is that it is another CCA camp and this would lead to greater discounts from your tour operator as CCA passes on discounts for long stays.

Also, for your information, if you don't already know, Grumeti Reserves is now managed and marketed by Singita, bringing the best of Southern Africa to East Africa!

Of your non-starred destinations, I have only stayed at the Hotel Heinitzburg in Windhoek, and it has a nice location overlooking the city, is only a short walk to the city center, and has lots of "character," unlike the Kalahari Sands or Windhoek Country Club.

Its a very nice itinerary, but one minor recommendation -- Etosha is one of Africa's great parks and it would be a shame, in my opinion, to be so close and to skip it (Wilderness Safaris operates Ongave just outside Etosha, and while I prefer staying in the park, if you are looking for luxury, Ongava would fit the bill). Since you've already been to the Sabi Sands, maybe you can cut a day from Mala Mala and one from Phinda to add two days at Ongava. Namibia is a fantastic destination, but unlike Rocco's thought (to get some conversation going) of adding more and skipping Namibia, I would subtract a few nights from South Africa (where you have already been) and add some nights in Namibia.

In any event, it looks like a wonderful trip.

Michael

Hi Rocco and thanks. I will look at your photo album. It seems you've managed to get Scared to Death not to be so scared? Lots of African travel.

Good thought about getting right to Windhoek. It may be that the availability of Skeleton Coast was a problem. On the website, the current discount on CCA multiple stays does not include Phinda Vlei. We also need for it to be a WS camp. SO has his heart set on Namibia so one way or another it's probably there to stay.

The Sabora camp and Faru Faru (yes, Singita) are so new I don't know if anyone here has visited them.

Michael, what a good idea. I'm glad you brought it up. I take it we'd fly into Windhoek and then to the park?

We have to rethink our plan anyway as scheduling is a problem. I would like to see if we can work out your suggestion to add the park in Namibia. We wonder if chances for seeing migration in Tanzania is better or worse at mid-June vs early June?

1 nt Windhoek
3 nt Skeleton Coast Safari
End Skeleton Coast and fly to Windhoek and then to Johannesburg to overnight
Phinda x 3 nights
MalaMala x 3 nights
Johannesburg to Kenya/Tanzania x 1 night
Tanzania safari x 8 nights

I'm not sure if you'd need to fly to Ongava. Its only 5 hours (a short distance by Namibia standards) on excellent roads and Wilderness could arrange ground transport, which would save some money and save a flight. They would be able to arrange flight from Ongava to Skeleton Coast (that's a park I haven't visited, but I understand its a fly-in, unlike Ongava which can be reached by road).

Ongava allows walking safaris, and we approached white rhino on foot, which was thrilling. Etosha is also very diferent, very dry, with a lunar pan, and lots of animals gathered around the waterholes. Etosha is more heavily visited than the private concessions and you will see other vehicles, but its a large park, and there are private areas, but there is a lot of wildlife, including very large groups of zebra, impala, gemsbok, hartebeast, ostrich, giraffe.

Namibia is very different, and its at least worth researching to see if it holds enough appeal to add Etosha.

Michael

Rocco - wow, your photos! Shot 10 of that lizard - national geo quality!

Loved the lion kill and the shot of him looking down at it. Ditto lion in the tree - I felt the excitement of being there.
Is 126 a bush baby?

Shot 130 and 137 - wow. Now we of course will be there in a different time of the year. I'm wondering if we need to stay at a doge like the Grumeti River Camp or Sabora Plains or Faru Faru if we're also going to be doing a luxury mobile camp? Right now we have 3 days of each but maybe it's good to break it up with a firmer bed, etc. Also - do we need 2 nts at crater lodge if we're now flying up from Joburg?

Clematis,

Glad you liked the photos. The best gameviewing, by far, was in the Ndutu area of the Serengeti but that is largely because I correctly timed my visit to coincide with the Migration. This area is probably best visited in mid February to early April.

About your Crater Lodge question...I would definitely spend two nights at Crater Lodge...it is a fantastic experience. While there will be more vehicles than you are accustomed to in the Crater, the gameviewing is very good. Whatever you do, if you are planning on an overland safari, do not underestimate the driving distances...I found the transfers to be very draining and at least on the transfer days, you will not be getting in two game activities as you are spoiled with in Southern Africa.

Unless it is due to frequent flier miles, I do have some concern about you flying all the way down to Joburg if you are just going to turn around and fly right back up to Tanzania. In my opinion, you may be better off flying into Nairobi (USA - London - Nairobi on Kenya Airways) and then you will have a much easier start to your safari. Kenya Airways is a wonderful airline that I experienced for the first time (in economy class) on my most recent safari. It put other airlines like KLM and Delta to shame and was slightly better than SAA, in my opinion.

Rocco, my restriction is I have to have the fully flat seats for medical reasons. They're on Virgin and I have to check which other lines. Obviously this would be a ff upgrade. Since the new plan is to go from Namibia to SA to Tanzania, I guess I need an open jaw starting Jnb and ending at Nairobi? But if I'm on a ff upgrade from Virgin (sfo-jnb) I'll have to fly back down to JNB.

With all this flying though, I have to see if I would save more overall if I flew SAA into Africa. We might end up having a stopover in Europe for a few days.

The plan is that we might see some of the migration in mid-June in the Serengeti area around Grumeti River. Part of that will be mobile so we can move as needed.

the latest thoughts:

windhoek
Skeleton Coast Safari
maybe Etosha
Windhoek to jnb
Phina 2 nts
Malamala 3 nts
Jnb to Kenya/Tanzania
Tanzania safari x 8 nts (2 nts crater lodge/2 nts grumeti river camp/3 nts mobile camp)

Clematis,

Thanks for the clarification.

I don't know, but Phinda looks like a long way to go for only a couple nights. Maybe a second Sabi Sand lodge like Londolozi Tree on the high end or Simbambili (very luxurious but about $625 pppns) would make for a more comfortable visit. I really enjoyed my stay at Simbambili and had nearly non-stop leopard viewing, as well as seeing quite a few rhinos. We even tracked rhinos and a cheetah on foot with our armed guide.

I don't want to bore you but if you take a look at www.kodakgallery.com/rocco/2005_favorites , I believe this is the link to some of my photos from Simbambili including the chalet. Not far behind Singita, at all, in terms of luxury.

Rocco, how long will it take to fly from Mala Mala to Phinda? (btw, does the camp pay for the transfer?) On your album, there's 500 photos... any guess as to approximately where the Simbambili ones might be (love your photos but am pushed for time).

The itinerary is looking like it will start with Namibia and then SA and end with Tanzania. Etosha isn't going to fit, sadly.

Clematis: awesome trip in the works!

As I read the original itinerary I had the same thoughts as Michael. Namibia is a fantastic experience that is so different than the other areas you have been or are going to. Having spent the time and money to be in country it would be a shame to miss Etosha and the Ongava lodges are WS at its best. I was fortunate enough to stay at Little Ongava which was spectacular luxury. Tracking the white rhino on foot was definitely in my top 5 Africa moments.

You can fly between Ongava, Skeleton Coast Camp and Windhoek or as Michael pointed out drive the Ongava leg and fly the Skeleton Coast.

Clematis,

From Londolozi (which borders Mala Mala) to Phinda it is an 80 minute flight. The camp definitely does not pay for the transfer. It is a $600 per person sharing one way transfer. It is stuck somewhere in your grand total. (Always so much better when the tour operator provides a breakdown!)

For my Simbambili photos, they are spread within a couple albums.

www.kodakgallery.com/rocco/main/2005_favorites

(unfortunately the photos of Simbamili are all mixed up in this first photogallery, but most of the leopard shots are from Simbambili and all of the rhino shots are from Simbambili...no photos of the accomodations or camp in this album but a lot of nice wildlife shots).

http://www.kodakgallery.com/rocco/ma...__south_africa

The Simbambili photos begin in Row 17 on the third photo and the Simbambili wildlife photos extend until the very end.

So, what does your FINAL itinerary look like???

Ouch. $600 pp or $1200 for two of us to fly from Phinda to Mala Mala? I think you're right, it's too much, esp now that we're only there 2 nights. I looked at that part of the quote now - it's 1780 pp for JNB/Mala Mala/Phinda/JNB (scheduled flight JNB/Mala Mala and Phina/JNB and private charter Mala Mala/Phinda). She did suggest we may save by buying our tickets ourselves in conjunction with our overseas flights.

Also, like Scared, my spouse doesn't do well in small planes. (although neither of us does well on long drives.)

Windhoek
Skeleton Coast Safari
End Skeleton Coast and fly to Windhoek and then to Johannesburg to overnight

Phinda x 2 nights
MalaMala x 3 nights
Johannesburg to Kenya/Tanzania x 1 night

Tanzania safari x 8 nights (crater lodge treetops 2 nts/3 nts private camping and 3 nts either Grumeti River lodge (which is the same as Grumeti river Camp, yes?) or Sabora Plains or Faru Faru.

Pred - nice to hear from you! I would love to fit in Ongava and maybe if we took out Phinda entirely...Honestly the idea of a walk to white rhinos doesn't make my heart thump the way walking to gorillas would (another trip). I liked seeing them (rhinos) from the singita vehicle munching on trees and running like girly-girls when my husband unscrewed his squeaky lens.

Clematis,

I would propose that you simply transfer to Simbambili for a couple nights. You will be in low season and have excellent rates available.

Low season 2006 at Simbambili, for example, is only R3000 per person sharing. With the Rand currently at R7.059 to $1 you are looking at only $425 per person per night + whatever the 2007 rate increase is (perhaps another $50 per person per night?).

Phinda is definitely a camp that intrigues me, but perhaps it is best saved for when you have more than two nights?

Hi Clematis,

I can offer no comment on any part of your planned itinerary, other than to say, I absolutely loved Rattrays at MalaMala. To me, it is the very best of accomodation and the most sensational gameviewing! I will return there in January 2007 and even though I have a trip soon, having read the cyberdiary I am green with envy at what MalaMala guests are seeing there, which is around the time you shall be there next year.

I agree with your husband about Rattrays, nothing else would do!

Kind regards,
Kaye

Clematis,

I agree with Rocco. I am due to visit Phinda in August and the transfers to get to Phinda are not cheap (Fed Air).....if you are going to Phinda, i suggest atleast 3-4 nights minimum. I am doing 5 nights prior to my trip to Botswana. They just have so much to see and do around Phinda that two nights is'nt sufficient.

Hari

Kaye, thank you for your feedback on Rattrays. That one was my request. <s>

Hari, thanks too. My husband will not give up a night at Phinda and he wants to go even with the high transfer cost so we may have to be waitlisted to get our second night at the crater. I'm not clear what my options are if that night never opens up.</s>

Hi Clematis,

Sorry, great choice by you!

Kind regards,
Kaye

Clematis,

Hi! That makes me all the more excieted about my August trip.....can't wait to try Phinda.

Hari