isabel

We are trying to plan a 10 day trip for next March. We fly into Tucson (arrive 11am) and depart from Las Vegas.

I think we want 2 nights Tucson (1 1/2 days Saguro National Park).
Drive to Sedona (3 1/2 hours) - stay 2 nights (so day and a half there).
Drive to Grand Canyon (3 hours) - 1 night or two?
Drive to Joshua Tree (almost 6 hours) - 1 night or two?
Drive to Death Valley (4 1/2 hours) - 2 nights so two half days and one whole day. We will drive to LV in the afternoon. Flight out is first thing the next morning.

We did a trip a few years ago which included Vegas and the north rim of the Grand Canyon (plus several Utah parks) so we don't need any time (other than the one evening) in Vegas, and don't think we want as much time as some people might at the Grand Canyon since we were there recently.

So - do the Saguro, Sedona and Death Valley stays look like the right amount of time?

Would you cut the six hour drive to Joshua Tree into two halves and if so where would you stop for the night? If not would one afternoon, night and the following morning be enough in Grand Canyon? That would give us one full day in Joshua Tree.

Suggestions?

Thanks

happytrailstoyou

In your understandable desire to cover a lot of territory, you will miss some rewarding gems,

There is a great deal to see in the Tucson area in addition to Saguaro National Park including Mt. Lemmon, Sabino Canyon, and the Desert Museum (most of which is outdoors).

Jerome could be included in your visit to Sedona.

The stretches of Route 66 that pass through Williams (classic) and Oatman (scenic) are particularly interesting.

If you have not visited the Valley of Fire, I suggest you check it out and drop Death Valley from your itinerary.

There is no place of particular interest to stay between the Grand Canyon and Joshua Tree NP, and there is no place to stay in the park unless you are camping.

HTtY

HappyTrvlr

Rather than spending all 1.5 days in Saguaro NP, spend that half day at Tucson's gem, Sabino Canyon. www.sabinocanyon.org excellent hiking but if you want, there is also a tram that takes you the length of the canyon.

WhereAreWe

1.5 days for Saguaro might be overkill, unless you are seeing both sections and doing a fair amount of hiking. I'd agree with the idea to spend time at the Arizona-Sonora Desert Museum and/or Sabino Canyon.

One night at the Grand Canyon is enough unless you are doing significant hiking below the rim. I would drive straight to Joshua Tree, no need to break it up.

Death Valley is huge, 2 nights is not really enough time but if that's all you have then make the most of it.

stumblingthrunature

Absolutely visit Sabino Canyon or Mount Lemmon while you are in Tucson! If you are up for a longer trek, the hike to Seven Falls is a great moderate difficulty hike at Sabino Canyon (about eight miles round trip). You can drive up to the village of Summerhaven on Mount Lemmon for some beautiful views, some nice day hiking trails, and there is a little restaurant that serves wonderful pie.

Walking up and down Fourth Avenue in Tucson is also fun--there's lots of quirky shops and some restaurants and bars. Since you're going in March it won't be hot!

bon_voyage

Consider driving through the Navajo reservation to the Hopi Cultural Center on Second Mesa on the Hopi reservation. It's been many years since I was there but the memory of the bleak yet haunting beauty of that area has stayed with me. The tour of the First Mesa Village of Walpi, http://www.experience hope.com/walpi-village.html, is fascinating.

I second the recommendation to check out cute little Jerome and also the drive through Oatman with its resident burros.

bon_voyage

That's experiencehopi.com.

isabel

Thanks for all your suggestions.

Sabino Canyon looks lovely, but why do I want to go there versus more time in Saguaro? I'm pretty set on 2 nights in Tucson so one and a half days. So I guess my choices are one day in each of the East and West parts of the park, or one day in the park and one day in the Sabino Canyon. What are pros and cons of each?


I don't think we have time to add in a detour to Hopi Center.

Jerome sounds interesting, we would do that from Sedona?

My main question now is if Joshua Tree is worth the extra driving. By my google/mapquest calculations it would add almost 400 miles and 7 hours to the trip (versus going straight from Grand Canyon to Death Valley). If anyone has been to both Joshua Tree and Death Valley can you tell me if what you see in Joshua Tree is different enough from Death Valley to warrant that amount of extra driving.

Thanks again.

happytrailstoyou

So I guess my choices are one day in each of the East and West parts of the park, or one day in the park and one day in the Sabino Canyon.

No. Actually Sabino Canyon and both parts of Saguaro National Park can be visited in the same day (unless you spend a day hiking in Sabino Canyon).

West of Tucson, our favorite drive (by far) is over Gates Pass.

Yes, you can visit Jerome from Sedona.

If you must choose between Death Valley and Joshua Tree, choose Death Valley because (1) it is a better fit for your itinerary, (2) it is iconic, and (3) it is unforgettable.

On your way to Death Valley you would do well to visit the Valley of Fire State Park, east of Las Vegas. (I was given this advice three times, and I was foolish enough to ignore it the first two times.)

HTtY

tomfuller

If you want to see Joshua trees without going into Joshua Tree NP, go to the Mojave National Preserve. There are many Joshua trees and some impressive volcanic sites.
You can get to Death Valley via Baker and Badwater.
Badwater is the lowest point in North America (-282 feet).
Outside LV I enjoyed both Valley of Fire and Red Rocks (west out Charleston).

isabel

OK, you talked me into Valley of the Fire. It looks amazing.

Now I just have to figure out how to arrange the itinerary. I'm dropping Joshua Tree.

Starts with:
Days 1 & 2 - One and a half days in Saguro (2 nights Tucson)
Days 3 & 4 - Drive to Sedona - one and a half days there (2 nights )
Day 5 - Drive to Grand Canyon - full afternoon, night

Now comes my problem starting on day 6 -
Option A)
drive 5 hr to Valley of Fire, would only have about 3 good hours of day light, night in North LV. That gives me two full and two almost full days in Death Valley.

Option B)
spend morning in GC, drive four and a half hours to North LV for the night, next day spend most of the day in Valley of Fire, drive to Furnace Creek. That gives me two and a half days in DV. It also means I'm not in Valley of Fire for a sunset. And actually two out of my ten nights I wouldn't be anywhere 'good' for sunset.

Option C) same as B but spend entire day in Valley of Fire, so a second night in N. Las Vegas, leave early the following morning for DV. That gives me only one full and two half days in DV.

Which option looks best?

Does Valley of Fire merit more than 3 hours?

Is three hours and a sunset better than most of a day but would need to leave before sunset?

Is a full day including a sunset in Valley of Fire worth loosing a whole day in Death Valley (would still leave one full and two half days in DV)

BTW, the last day, day 10, we plan to get to Vegas by late afternoon and are staying on the strip for the last night, flights out are morning of day 11. So those one or two nights in 'North Vegas" are at a motel easy to drive to but not near the strip.

WhereAreWe

Would it make sense to leave Valley of Fire until the very end - visit on the of day 10 and stay for sunset?

Otherwise I would say the same as before: Death Valley is huge and the more time you can allot to it the better. I would not lose a full day there to spend an entire day in Valley of Fire.

isabel

It won't work for us to leave Valley of Fire till the end cause my TC really wants to spend a few hours/evening in Vegas. We were there on our last southwest national parks trip 4 years ago but I got there 3 days before her and spent it in Vegas (so I've had my fill) but she got there the night before we left for the parks so would like to experience it a bit this time. But good suggestion otherwise.

I think you are right about eliminating option c cause not enough time in DV. Now just have to decide between the other two options. Thanks

tomfuller

Does this work for you? Leave South Rim Grand Canyon - arrive at Hoover Dam early afternoon. See the dam and the walkway on the high bridge. A couple miles west of the road down to the dam is a road that goes up the west side of Lake Meade. Eventually you come to Valley of Fire. Stay at VOF until sunset if conditions are good for pictures.
Leave VOF westbound to I-15 and go to either North LV or the Fremont Street Experience. I like the buffet upstairs at the Golden Nugget.
It's your choice whether to go to Death Valley or go to the Mojave National Preserve to see Joshua trees and some interesting geologic features such as Kelso Dunes.

isabel

Yeah, that's kind of what I'm thinking, although maybe without Hoover Dam. I've seen it (granted it was a long time ago, but I don't remember being all that impressed) and my SIL hasn't expressed an interest - I'm hesitant to add in anything additional as I'm concerned we won't have enough time to see what is already on the list.

So that means - most of one day/night/sunrise is enough for Grand Canyon (we were at the north rim for 3 days, four years ago)?

And - about three hours is "enough" for Valley of Fire?

If the answer is yes to those questions then that's what we'll do.

Have you been to the Lee Flat area of DV? I understand that's where the best Joshua Trees in DV are. Is it doable/worth doing in half a day or less ( in a regular car)?

janisj

I personally wouldn't try Lee Flat in a rental car (I've been in my own vehicle) - but it is up to you if you want to risk it.

The first part of the road is totally paved but (at least 5 years ago when I was there) it was pretty rough. The problem arises w/ the roads into the Joshua trees which are not paved (some dirt, mostly gravel) and most rental contracts prohibit driving on unpaved roads.

So if you had no problems -- you'd 'get away with it', but a flat tire or car trouble or anything -- and you'd be SOL.

HappyTrvlr

Ann, You ask why Sabino over Saguaro NP? Sabino Canyon is a deep canyon with beautiful views, saguaros growing on the cliffsides. We always take out of town guests there and never have taken any to Saguaro NPs. There are multiple hiking trails accessed from Sabino, rushing stream, etc. history, nature, amazing place. There is a tram that goes up the canyon but we prefer to hike in.
Also in Tucson, not far from the airport, the beginnings of the city, Mission San Xavier del Bac, the northern most mission in a chain that begins in Mexico. Present building is from 18th c., on the Tohono O'odham reservation, easy access. It was founded by Padre Kino in 17th c. The mission is known as The White Dove of the Desert and has a small museum too.
Your photography will capture amazing shots of both of these special Tucson gems.

clarkgriswold

You should be able to leave Valley of Fire mid-afternoon and find a good sunset half way to Furnace Creek in the REd Rock Canyon area, maybe Mountain Springs/ Spring Mountain Ranch area? Then spend the night in Pahrump and have a short drive to Furnace Creek in the morning.

isabel

I will definitely look into doing Sabino Canyon while in Tucson.

How does Red Rock Canyon compare to Valley of the Fire. The photos I've seen on line make Valley of the Fire look far more impressive, but is that really so? Would be nice to hear from people who've been to both.

I guess I'm going to just have to 'give up' the idea of seeing Joshua Trees on this trip. Just doesn't seem to fit.

But another question - a LOT of the places we're going seem to include unpaved roads. Many in Death Valley, some in Saguaro, etc. These are roads that are all talked about in major guidebooks with no mention that you can't take rental cars. Certainly many do mention roads on which you need a high clearance or four wheel drive vehicle, and we plan to avoid any of those. But the more 'mainstream' yet unpaved roads - are these really no go for rental cars? Seems like an awful lot of people touring the national parks do so in rental cars. Do most people really need to stay away from all unpaved roads?

janisj

"are these really no go for rental cars? Seems like an awful lot of people touring the national parks do so in rental cars. Do most people really need to stay away from all unpaved roads?"

Yes - rental cars are almost always precluded from driving off pavement. That doesn't mean lots of people don't do it anyway. Depends on how risk averse you are - you'd probably be fine, but if something does go wrong, it will be a very serious problem.

Plus - a very large % of visitors are in their own/private vehicles.

You just have to weigh the risk . . .