Suggestions for Planning Last Leg of a 26-Day Italy Trip
Sep 25th, 2011, 10:26 AM
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Suggestions for Planning Last Leg of a 26-Day Italy Trip
Our flight back to the U.S. is out of Bologna on May 15th. Since we have visited Bologna three times in the past, we are staying there only the night prior to departure.
Our travel day is May 6th, taking the train from Orbetello to Rome and then north. We have not visited any of the following cities that I've considered: Padova, Mantova, Verona, Vicenza, Parma, & Sirmione. Venezia is absolutely on our list, however, this would be our third visit. The Eurostar from Venezia to Bologna is quick: 1:23, and we can take day trips to other cities/towns from there. No car, just trains, taxi cabs, buses. I have the train schedules and routes written down linking all of these locations.
We love being around water, are physically in top condition (walk 4 miles every day) and no other health issues, but we do not want to be Billy Goats walking up-and-down lots of stairs. This is the end of the trip, and it should be relaxing.
I've done a lot of research and it comes down to this: there are pros and cons with every location. I've hit the proverbial "wall."
Our favorite locations in Italy that we keep returning to are: Sorrento, Stresa, Santa Margherita, Perugia, Bellagio, Lucca, Capri. In Belgium: Brugge.
Nothing on the web is giving me the kind of information that only comes from people who have been to these locations, and can offer first-hand advice.
Our travel day is May 6th, taking the train from Orbetello to Rome and then north. We have not visited any of the following cities that I've considered: Padova, Mantova, Verona, Vicenza, Parma, & Sirmione. Venezia is absolutely on our list, however, this would be our third visit. The Eurostar from Venezia to Bologna is quick: 1:23, and we can take day trips to other cities/towns from there. No car, just trains, taxi cabs, buses. I have the train schedules and routes written down linking all of these locations.
We love being around water, are physically in top condition (walk 4 miles every day) and no other health issues, but we do not want to be Billy Goats walking up-and-down lots of stairs. This is the end of the trip, and it should be relaxing.
I've done a lot of research and it comes down to this: there are pros and cons with every location. I've hit the proverbial "wall."
Our favorite locations in Italy that we keep returning to are: Sorrento, Stresa, Santa Margherita, Perugia, Bellagio, Lucca, Capri. In Belgium: Brugge.
Nothing on the web is giving me the kind of information that only comes from people who have been to these locations, and can offer first-hand advice.
Sep 25th, 2011, 10:32 AM
#2
ooh, Orbetello - have you been there before? I went to the language school there last May and i just loved it.
I can't help you with the rest of your trip, but if you want any tips about staying there, let me know.
I can't help you with the rest of your trip, but if you want any tips about staying there, let me know.
Sep 25th, 2011, 10:59 AM
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Hello Annhig,
No we have not been to Orbetello prior to this trip. We are staying on the island in Porto Santo Steffano at Hotel Torre di Cala Piccola for eight days.
If you think Orbetello is a place where we should spend some of our time, please tell me about it.
No we have not been to Orbetello prior to this trip. We are staying on the island in Porto Santo Steffano at Hotel Torre di Cala Piccola for eight days.
If you think Orbetello is a place where we should spend some of our time, please tell me about it.
Sep 25th, 2011, 11:46 AM
#5
well, the first thing to say is that i never got to the island you are staying on [very nice looking hotel, BTW] and I'm sure you'll have a wonderful time there, as the whole area is lovely.
Orbetello is the town at the other end of the middle causeway that leads to the island and therefore is surrounded by the lagoon with its numerous lovely beaches - worth a look and possibly a swim, even in May. The town itself is very pleasant and has several good restaurants - in fact it's hard to go wrong as virtually all of the customers are locals and they won't put up with poor food.
there are numerous Etruscan and Roman remains in the area, including a whole roman town [name forgotten, sorry] which is totally unguarded.
other students went on a trip to the island of giorgio beyond where you are staying which they liked a lot.
have a great trip!
Orbetello is the town at the other end of the middle causeway that leads to the island and therefore is surrounded by the lagoon with its numerous lovely beaches - worth a look and possibly a swim, even in May. The town itself is very pleasant and has several good restaurants - in fact it's hard to go wrong as virtually all of the customers are locals and they won't put up with poor food.
there are numerous Etruscan and Roman remains in the area, including a whole roman town [name forgotten, sorry] which is totally unguarded.
other students went on a trip to the island of giorgio beyond where you are staying which they liked a lot.
have a great trip!
Sep 25th, 2011, 12:41 PM
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Good information...by any chance do you remember names of any of the restaurants in Orbetello? I will research the ancient Roman town - sounds interesting.
Do you remember if there are cafes on the beaches for lunch or a light dinner?
Also, how did you enjoy taking Italian lessons? Did you have a good teacher - exciting stuff.
Do you remember if there are cafes on the beaches for lunch or a light dinner?
Also, how did you enjoy taking Italian lessons? Did you have a good teacher - exciting stuff.
Sep 25th, 2011, 02:01 PM
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Just so you know, Porto Santo Stefano is on the promontory that is the Monte Argentario. It is actually not an island. A bird's eye view makes that seem a bit overly technical, but it is considered part of the mainland (as opposed to isola Giglio.)
My reactions to Orbetello are much different than annhg's (I find it dreary), but then again, I seem to have an allergy to lagoons. I like to see water moving around. If you are bird watcher, however, it is a prime spot.
If you are looking for historic sights in that area, Tarquinia is really the prime destination, followed by Cerveteria. Both are reachable by train.
But back to your original question:
Padova is really the simplest in terms of overall logistics, both getting to and from. It is a lovely town, busier than Lucca but smaller than Bologna, and if for some reason you didn't like it, Venice, Vicenza and Verona are all in very easy reach.
Logistics aside, based your list of places that draw you back time and time again, it looks to me like either Sirmione or Mantova are your kind of places. Sirmione is about the size of Santa Margherita Ligure and you can also take a lot of boat rides from there. Mantova is about the size of Lucca, but it has much more spectacular interiors than Lucca -- palaces filled with giant frescoes -- and around its walls it has moats and lakes.
Mantova can get quite muggy as the warm weather starts to arrive in May, so perhaps that is something to consider, although mid-May will be just at the turning point, so you may still have mainly spring like weather. And Sirmione wouldn't be much fun if it was raining -- and it is the most complicated in terms of travel logistics.
Were you to stay in Verona, you could easily see both Sirmione and Mantova as day trips.
Anyway, I would eliminate Vicenza and Parma unless you are either determined lovers of Palladio or cheese and ham.
My reactions to Orbetello are much different than annhg's (I find it dreary), but then again, I seem to have an allergy to lagoons. I like to see water moving around. If you are bird watcher, however, it is a prime spot.
If you are looking for historic sights in that area, Tarquinia is really the prime destination, followed by Cerveteria. Both are reachable by train.
But back to your original question:
Padova is really the simplest in terms of overall logistics, both getting to and from. It is a lovely town, busier than Lucca but smaller than Bologna, and if for some reason you didn't like it, Venice, Vicenza and Verona are all in very easy reach.
Logistics aside, based your list of places that draw you back time and time again, it looks to me like either Sirmione or Mantova are your kind of places. Sirmione is about the size of Santa Margherita Ligure and you can also take a lot of boat rides from there. Mantova is about the size of Lucca, but it has much more spectacular interiors than Lucca -- palaces filled with giant frescoes -- and around its walls it has moats and lakes.
Mantova can get quite muggy as the warm weather starts to arrive in May, so perhaps that is something to consider, although mid-May will be just at the turning point, so you may still have mainly spring like weather. And Sirmione wouldn't be much fun if it was raining -- and it is the most complicated in terms of travel logistics.
Were you to stay in Verona, you could easily see both Sirmione and Mantova as day trips.
Anyway, I would eliminate Vicenza and Parma unless you are either determined lovers of Palladio or cheese and ham.
Sep 25th, 2011, 02:10 PM
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Sep 25th, 2011, 02:12 PM
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Sep 25th, 2011, 02:19 PM
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Sorry, I noticed one of my Mantova links didn't work
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mykaul/1335801383/
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...canal_2004.JPG
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mykaul/1335801383/
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...canal_2004.JPG
Sep 25th, 2011, 03:03 PM
#12
My reactions to Orbetello are much different than annhg's (I find it dreary),>>
well, i found it delightful - refreshingly lacking in anything resembling a tourist, apart from the odd language student.perhaps if I'd been there for a week doing nothing I might agree with zeppole but the lessons [4 hours every morning followed by excursions in the afternoon/evening, all in italian] were enough to keep me interested.
[you can click on my screen name to see my trip report if you are interested, I am kane!].
as for restaurants, there were several i liked - the best was the trattoria i pescatori, just outside the city walls, where you stand in line with a menu, order what you want and pay for it from the till, then get your seat and wait for your food. [you can always add to your order later on!] it's a co-operative run by the fishermen themselves and you'd never find it if you weren't shown where it is. there are others too - if you google-maps Orbetello and look for the via roma, the one next to the "terramare" [the name of the language school] was excellent, as was the trattoria la pergola further up the street.
good luck with your search for your last destination!
well, i found it delightful - refreshingly lacking in anything resembling a tourist, apart from the odd language student.perhaps if I'd been there for a week doing nothing I might agree with zeppole but the lessons [4 hours every morning followed by excursions in the afternoon/evening, all in italian] were enough to keep me interested.
[you can click on my screen name to see my trip report if you are interested, I am kane!].
as for restaurants, there were several i liked - the best was the trattoria i pescatori, just outside the city walls, where you stand in line with a menu, order what you want and pay for it from the till, then get your seat and wait for your food. [you can always add to your order later on!] it's a co-operative run by the fishermen themselves and you'd never find it if you weren't shown where it is. there are others too - if you google-maps Orbetello and look for the via roma, the one next to the "terramare" [the name of the language school] was excellent, as was the trattoria la pergola further up the street.
good luck with your search for your last destination!
Sep 25th, 2011, 04:04 PM
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Very helpful information about Orbetello,annhig.
zeppole, my, my you always have so much knowledge about Italy. I did not realize that Porto Santo Stefano on top of the mountain is not considered an island. Is it a small peninsula and actually an area of Orbetello?
Venice is a serious consideration. If we choose to stay there, I can think of lots of things to do that we didn't on previous visits. It would depend on a good room rate. I'll work on it tonight.
zeppole, my, my you always have so much knowledge about Italy. I did not realize that Porto Santo Stefano on top of the mountain is not considered an island. Is it a small peninsula and actually an area of Orbetello?
Venice is a serious consideration. If we choose to stay there, I can think of lots of things to do that we didn't on previous visits. It would depend on a good room rate. I'll work on it tonight.
Sep 26th, 2011, 05:15 AM
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i_am_kane,
There is always more about Italy I don't know than I do, and as that song sort of goes, don't know much about geography or the history of geography in particular.
I don't know how the locals refer to the area, but formally, the Argentario land mass is deemed a promontory, not a peninsula, although I'm not sure why, since the meaning of "peninsula" literally translates into "almost an island.". (Perhaps it is because the Argentario mass is more obviously one mountain?)
The Promontorio dell'Argentario, like the Promontorio di Portofino that is part of the landscape of Santa Margherita Ligure, is considered an extension of the mainland, not an island. (Why the landscape around Sorrento is called the Peninsula Sorrentina and not a promontorio, I don't know.)
I do know (from having been there) that Porto Santo Stefano is right at sea level, although some hotels and rental apartments in the town are higher up the mountainside, accessed by steep, winding roads.
Orbetello and Porto Santo Stefano are both in the province of Grossetto (named after an inland Tuscan city), all within the region of Tuscany.
I hope I got all that right.
Anyway, here are some nice pictures of Promontorio dell'Argentario, including Porto Santo Stefano and Orbetello.
http://www.giovannirinaldi.it/page/i...ario/index.htm
Enjoy your stay there. The fact that I wasn't drawn to Orbetello doesn't mean much, especially for your trip, since I'm not much drawn to Venice either. Different travelers like different things, and annhg is right to describe Orbetello as uncorrupted by mass tourism.
PS: annhg, I wasn't in Orbetello for a week in case you thought that, or perhaps your reference to a week long stay is the length of time I_am_kane is thinking of staying there. I couldn't tell.
There is always more about Italy I don't know than I do, and as that song sort of goes, don't know much about geography or the history of geography in particular.
I don't know how the locals refer to the area, but formally, the Argentario land mass is deemed a promontory, not a peninsula, although I'm not sure why, since the meaning of "peninsula" literally translates into "almost an island.". (Perhaps it is because the Argentario mass is more obviously one mountain?)
The Promontorio dell'Argentario, like the Promontorio di Portofino that is part of the landscape of Santa Margherita Ligure, is considered an extension of the mainland, not an island. (Why the landscape around Sorrento is called the Peninsula Sorrentina and not a promontorio, I don't know.)
I do know (from having been there) that Porto Santo Stefano is right at sea level, although some hotels and rental apartments in the town are higher up the mountainside, accessed by steep, winding roads.
Orbetello and Porto Santo Stefano are both in the province of Grossetto (named after an inland Tuscan city), all within the region of Tuscany.
I hope I got all that right.
Anyway, here are some nice pictures of Promontorio dell'Argentario, including Porto Santo Stefano and Orbetello.
http://www.giovannirinaldi.it/page/i...ario/index.htm
Enjoy your stay there. The fact that I wasn't drawn to Orbetello doesn't mean much, especially for your trip, since I'm not much drawn to Venice either. Different travelers like different things, and annhg is right to describe Orbetello as uncorrupted by mass tourism.
PS: annhg, I wasn't in Orbetello for a week in case you thought that, or perhaps your reference to a week long stay is the length of time I_am_kane is thinking of staying there. I couldn't tell.
Sep 26th, 2011, 08:18 AM
#16
annhig, I wasn't in Orbetello for a week in case you thought that, or perhaps your reference to a week long stay is the length of time I_am_kane is thinking of staying there. I couldn't tell.>>
well i can't answer for you zeppole, but re-reading what I wrote i thought that it was quite clear rom the context that i was talking about a hypothetical week doing nothing as opposed to the week i spent there doing a lot. apart from surmising from what you wrote that you'd been there, I have no idea whether it was for an hour, a day or a week, or what you did.
really, i was just trying to be helpful to the OP, as you have been.
I_am_kane - i like the idea of Venice as your final stop. A great contrast to your "island" and loads to do, with ample public transport. I've got a trip report for a week i spent there with the family as well, but no hotel recommendations as we stayed in an apartment.
have a great trip!
well i can't answer for you zeppole, but re-reading what I wrote i thought that it was quite clear rom the context that i was talking about a hypothetical week doing nothing as opposed to the week i spent there doing a lot. apart from surmising from what you wrote that you'd been there, I have no idea whether it was for an hour, a day or a week, or what you did.
really, i was just trying to be helpful to the OP, as you have been.
I_am_kane - i like the idea of Venice as your final stop. A great contrast to your "island" and loads to do, with ample public transport. I've got a trip report for a week i spent there with the family as well, but no hotel recommendations as we stayed in an apartment.
have a great trip!
Sep 26th, 2011, 12:52 PM
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annhig,
You have been very kind. I'm running into a few snags with Venice hotels/B&Bs. Ca'Turelli (Dorsodoro) only accepts Visa, no MC or Amex - good room rate w/breakfast 1,040 euro for 8 nights.
Hotel Al Piave (Pz. S.M./Rialto) also is 1,130 euro w/breakfast for 8 nights, but the booking system made a mistake by booking 8 nights (same room rate), which may be rectified soon.
Hotel Al Leon is another consideration (Pz. S. M.)at 1,160 euros.
The room rates in Venice have sky rocketed since we last stayed there in 2006.
I could kick myself because a couple of years ago someone posted on Fodors about a terrific small hotel (I think not too far from the railroad station), and I didn't make a note of it.
Maybe some other folks can offer suggestions for lodging in Venice.
You have been very kind. I'm running into a few snags with Venice hotels/B&Bs. Ca'Turelli (Dorsodoro) only accepts Visa, no MC or Amex - good room rate w/breakfast 1,040 euro for 8 nights.
Hotel Al Piave (Pz. S.M./Rialto) also is 1,130 euro w/breakfast for 8 nights, but the booking system made a mistake by booking 8 nights (same room rate), which may be rectified soon.
Hotel Al Leon is another consideration (Pz. S. M.)at 1,160 euros.
The room rates in Venice have sky rocketed since we last stayed there in 2006.
I could kick myself because a couple of years ago someone posted on Fodors about a terrific small hotel (I think not too far from the railroad station), and I didn't make a note of it.
Maybe some other folks can offer suggestions for lodging in Venice.
Sep 26th, 2011, 01:18 PM
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annhg, most often when people quote another poster's post as you did, what follows is taken to be a reaction to the quoted statement. It left me wondering if you thought my negative reaction to Orbetello, in contrast to your positive one, was based on different experiences, yours of having an interesting purpose to be there, while I didn't.
I was quite sure you were trying to help I_am_kane, and it does add perspective to his plans to know that being a language student in Orbetello may have enhanced your experience beyond what a simple tourist might have there. I only wanted to make sure that I_am_kane understood that my negative reaction was not based on being there for a week, like he might be. I don't know what it is like to spend a week there.
But it doesn't matter. He has now said he knows he will have a wonderful time, and he knows himself better than I do!
I was quite sure you were trying to help I_am_kane, and it does add perspective to his plans to know that being a language student in Orbetello may have enhanced your experience beyond what a simple tourist might have there. I only wanted to make sure that I_am_kane understood that my negative reaction was not based on being there for a week, like he might be. I don't know what it is like to spend a week there.
But it doesn't matter. He has now said he knows he will have a wonderful time, and he knows himself better than I do!
Sep 26th, 2011, 01:20 PM
#19
have you thought about an apartment in Venice?
not sure that it would be a great amount cheaper, but might be worth a try. you can always save by eating in once a day. vrbo.com is the main agency for owner rentals, or try slow travel for recommendations.
there are also a number of threads here about hotel/apartment recommendations in Venice.
not sure that it would be a great amount cheaper, but might be worth a try. you can always save by eating in once a day. vrbo.com is the main agency for owner rentals, or try slow travel for recommendations.
there are also a number of threads here about hotel/apartment recommendations in Venice.
Sep 26th, 2011, 01:54 PM
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zeppole, I am a woman...very definitely. So funny. I'm curious, do I write in the style of a man? Maybe it's all the years I worked in financial services. (Can you see the smile on my face?)
annhig, I appreciate you putting your thinking cap on for this part of the trip, but my husband and I prefer a hotel (with breakfast included) or a B&B.
I've been all over the Internet today (again), and not much luck. But, I have a few e-mails sent out to hotels and B&Bs - maybe I'll get responses by tomorrow.
annhig, I appreciate you putting your thinking cap on for this part of the trip, but my husband and I prefer a hotel (with breakfast included) or a B&B.
I've been all over the Internet today (again), and not much luck. But, I have a few e-mails sent out to hotels and B&Bs - maybe I'll get responses by tomorrow.
