indy_dad

I'd post a planned itinerary but I don't yet have one. I could use some help focusing in on a plan. For some reason, this trip has been difficult to get my arms around.

We are planning a week in Scotland next summer (first of June, bank holidays, Queen's Diamond Jubilee, etc.). Family of 4 (DD13, DS10) will be driving up from Derby (5-ish hours). Figure Saturdays for travel and 6 full days (7 nights) for sightseeing. Might try to squeeze in an extra day on top of that. We've been to Edinburgh and intend for this trip to be more rural.

Interests:
a) enjoying the scenery with some driving and short walks (3-5 miles)
b) intermixing history/learning along the way (castles, battlefields, monuments, etc)
c) a few good meals and perhaps a single whisky tour

That probably doesn't narrow things down too much. From what I've seen/read so far, here are some of the things that sound interesting and doable:

Stirling Castle / Wallace Monument / Bannockburn / Falkirk Wheel / Trossachs
Glencoe / Glenfidden / Jacobite Steam Train (route)
Loch Ness / Urquhart Castle / Culloden Battlefield / Cawdor Castle

Some things that sound interesting put probably aren't doable (tell me otherwise):
St. Andrews / East Neuk
Cairngorms
Islands (Mull, Skye)
Culzean (perhaps enroute though a touch out of the way)

Ideally we'd manage with 2-3 base camps. Any thoughts?

janisj

w/o Edinburgh, all that may be more doable than you think.

Stirling/Doune/Bannockburn/the Trossachs/Falkirk Wheel are all near-ish each other and doable from one base (Callander or similar)

Glencoe/Glenfinnan/train can be seen enroute to the Inverness area to base for Loch Ness/Urquhart Castle/Culloden/Clava Cairns/Cawdor

(Pretty sure you mean Glenfinnan - right? )

So Sat/Sun/Mon nights near Callander. Tues/Wed/Thurs nights near Inverness. Then you have Fri/Sat when you could either do St Andrews/Fife (you could also catch the Wheel during this bit), or Culzean/Ayrshire/the SW.

I'd skip the islands this trip.

Michael

We visited the East Neuk coast on a day's outing while staying just south of Stirling.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/mksfca/...ith/4409981554

janisj

Yes, Fife can be done as a day trip from Callander. But it would take the full day and there is so much to to see in the general Trossachs/Stirling area. To do it you'd probably want to add another night or two to have enough time to cover St Andrews/Fife from Callander.

If I was 'doing' Fife I'd want to plan on a boat trip to the Isle of May, and to do that you'd want to stay nearby.

http://www.isleofmayferry.com/

indy_dad

Thanks for responding, Janis and Michael.

Janis - not too often you advise to fit in a little more, is it? Would you recommend Callander and Inverness for the base towns?

I'll start working with this to lay out routes/timings/sites. Very helpful.

janisj

Callander and <i>near</i> Inverness would be perfect. Not <u>in</u> Inverness though. You'll have a car so no need to stay in the city itself which is mainly the commercial center for the north of Scotland. But somewhere in the triangle of Cawdor - Beauly/Black Isle - Loch Ness would be a good base. Lots of B&Bs in the area.

janisj

"<i>not too often you advise to fit in a little more, is it?</i>"

hey, I did say ditch the islands

tjhome1

Yes, definatly not in Inverness. Do try and fit some time in for Skye - we were so impressed with it on our trip in the summer - stunning scenery, great walks, history, distilleries and great restaurants - sounds like it would be perfect for you.

indy_dad

Okay, here's round 2 in a little more detail. Let me know what you think. Trying to limit the all day in the car days other than the first and last day but it is difficult. I've also tried to squeeze in an extra day.

Drive times are quoted from Google directly. Understand that those will generally be underestimated by 25% or more and do not account for stops.

1 Fri Drive Derby to Callander (5.5 hrs)
see Falkirk Wheel along the way.

2 Sat Callander
Stirling activities: Castle, Bannockburn, William Wallace, Doune?

3 Sun Callander
Trossachs activities: Ben A'an walk, Inchahome Priory, Doune Castle if not on previous day

4 Mon Drive to Ballachulish (2 hrs)
Inverary Castle, Cruarchen Power Station, A828, Glencoe?

5 Tues Drive Ballachulish to Culloden (2.5 hrs)
Glencoe?, Glenfinnan, Loch Ness Exhibition Centre, Urquhart Castle

6 Wed Culloden
Culloden: Battlefield, Clava Cairns, Cawdor Castle

7 Thurs Drive Culloden to St. Andrews (3 hrs)
Pitlochry? Blair Castle/Atholl?

8 Fri St. Andrews
St. Andrews / East Neuk / Isle of May

9 Sat Drive St. Andrews to Derby via Hadrian's Wall (6.5 hrs)

So that's 3 nights in Callendar, 1 near Ft. William, 2 near Inverness and 2 in St. Andrews.

Some questions comments:
a) decided it was going to be too much to see everything on day 4 and still make it up to the Inverness area hence the extra day in Ballachulish. Where should we stay? Is the A828 route up the coast "nice"?

b) day 6 Inverness to St. Andrews is quite a hall. Should we make a few stops? where? or just power on? Nice hike to take?

c) Doune Castle and Glencoe will slot on the previous day if time allows or the following day if not

d) which distillery tour should we pick up along the way?

e) I don't have a feel for how long some of the sites will take. Seems a little site heavy and walk light. Any other recommended walks/hikes along the way?

Thanks for your patience and help.

janisj

does google maps <i>really</i> list Culloden to St Andrews in 3 hours?? I haven't checked google - I generally use AA's site and it calculates 3hrs 40mins . . . And I'd think 4.5 hrs might be closer.

Your overall plan looks very good IMO.

a) I'd stay in Glencoe or Ballachulish. The A828 is very nice. But I might also consider skipping taking the inland route and stop at Balquhiddar and Killin/Falls of Dochart instead of Inveraray.

b) "<i> day 6 Inverness to St. Andrews</i>" Your plan lists that as day 7. That will be a very long day -- I'd maybe stop @Blair Castle and at Killiekrankie for a short hike. No need to stop in Pitlochry IMO. Press on to Fife.

d) Any distillery will do actually. Glenfiddich probably has the best visitor experience. But it is a bit off your route. Maybe Dallas Dhu or Dalwhinnie.

Most of your days are pretty doable and you'll find lots of local walks along the way so I'd just play it by ear . . .

indy_dad

Thanks again, Janis.

Yes, it was day 7 and I can tell by looking at it that it's going to be much longer than 3 hrs.

Given the holiday week and my preference for planning rather than winging it, I'll probably start looking at some places to stay.

Any recommendations? I'm hoping for around &pound;100 per night for a family room or 2 rooms but can go up a little if necessary.

janisj

oops - to clarify . . . I <i>meant</i> to post >>The A828 is very nice. But I might also consider skipping it and taking the inland route, stop at Balquhiddar and . . . <<

In Fife maybe look in Crail - this place is nice. http://www.caipliehouse.com/

besides being the most scenic of the fishing harbors, Crail is very convenient to both St Andrews and Anstruther (for the Isle of May). Depending on what the kids like you could also go here http://www.tsdc.co.uk/park.html

In Glencoe I'd always start by checking here first http://www.clachaig.com/

Callander has lots of B&Bs - just pick one that looks good to you (I always either rent cottages or a condo at Forest Hills for a weeks at a time so don't have a specific B&B/hotel recommendation). If nothing pans out in Callander, check for B&Bs in Aberfoyle.

I have a couple of ideas up near I'ness, but I'll have to search for them

sheila

If you're still looking my tuppenceworth would be that you're fine on Day 1 and day 2. A wee bit further east that you're suggesting is Dollar Glen which would make a good walk on day 2.

Another nice walk on Day 3 might be round Loch Katrine. You can hire bikes and cycle round. Or take the boat up and cycle back

I would try to pick up Inverary castle on the way to Ballachulish (maybe you mean that, anyway). I would then swing up Loch Awe to catch Cruachan, but I'd stay at Port Appin.

It does mean doubling back a wee bit next day, but not much.

It makes little sense to do Glencoe the next day; and anyway, it looks much better going towards the sea. There's a nice walk up the Lost Glen if you fancy it.

Day 5- because I like round trips, I'd cross the Corran Ferry and swing through Morven to Arisaig, then come back through Glenfinnan to Fort William up Loch Ness to Culloden. The options for walking are extensive.

From Culloden, do Fort George as well, and walk the Moray Firth beaches somewhere.

I think 3 hours Culloden to St Andrews is about right- 2 to Perth and 1 from there. (and viamichelin agrees with me). But many places to stop. Good walks at the hermitage at Dunkeld. Or walk up Birnam Hill through Birnam Wood that cam to Dunsinane in Macbeth? Don't bother with Pitlochry as such- 2 miles of shops- but the fish ladder can be fun.


The Isle of May might take pretty much all of your Fife day.

Distillery? hmmmm? Well, it's going to take at least a couple of hours and I think you're probably talking your Inverness to Fife day; so Dalwhinnie? Edradour? (Dallas Dhu is just a museum now)

indy_dad

Thanks, Sheila. I'll have to get out the big map again to see if I understand everything. Glad you came "back".

indy_dad

OK -- possible change of plans. The more I read, the more it sounds like we should try to see Skye. I'll sacrifice St. Andrews since I might be able to pick that up on a future Edinburgh visit.

Please comment on Plan B:

Days 1-3 same as above (Callandar/Stirling)

4 Drive to Mallaig (?)
Glencoe, Glenfinnan, other?

5 1st Ferry to Skye, Cuillin Hills hike?, stay in Portree

6 Skye (Trotternish Peninsula or other)

7 Drive to Culloden (Eilean Donan drive by, Loch Ness, Urquhart Castle)

8 Culloden: Battlefield, Clava Cairns, Cawdor Castle

9 Drive home via Hadrian's Wall (maybe)

Questions with this surround days 4/5. Should we stay in Mallaig as a stopover? Time to swing by Inverary Castle and/or Cruarchen on the way (Day 4)? Or power on to Skye? Seems a long way to make it to Portree though.

Definitely leaning this way. Interested in your thoughts. Thanks.

janisj

"<i>4 Drive to Mallaig (?)
Glencoe, Glenfinnan, other?

5 1st Ferry to Skye, Cuillin Hills hike?, stay in Portree</i>"

"<i>Should we stay in Mallaig as a stopover? </i>"

I wouldn't myself. There is really no reason to stay in Mallaig -- unless you just miss the last ferry of the day. You can easily make it on to Skye even w/ stops at Glencoe (eat lunch at the Clachaig inn) and Glenfinnan. I wouldn't try to squeeze in Inverary/Cruachen though.

I also probably would not stay in Portree. It is the only town of any size but it is a long way from many of the major sites on Skye (but it is close to the Trotternish which is major). Driving on Skye is slower than in many other parts of Scotland - and there are lots of single track roads. I'd try to stay at the Sligachan hotel which is sort of at the center of the isle and at the crossroads you'll use to get to most areas

sheila

The up side of your new plan is that the days are long and you could arrive late where you're meaning to stay. Me, it would it would take threat of world famine to get me to overnight in Mallaig. IF you want to stop, stop at the Hotel in Arisaig. You'll have light till about 9pm. The last ferry's at 6pm, so you choose where you spend those hours.

You have about 3 hours drive time Callander to Mallaig. You can't rationally do Cruchan, never mind Inverary without at least an hour more and a LOT of back tracking- or miss out Glencoe. Again, you need to choose.

Again, I'm with Janis; stay somewhere else. If I'm travelling, I usually syat at the Sligachan. If I'm staying over, the Eilean Iarmain. But there are lots of nice places not in Portree.

The Cuillin are a serious adventure. Don't do it unless you're really fit

indy_dad

OK. Thanks Janis and Sheila. Sounds like the recommendation for plan B would be to drive from Callander to Maillag via Glencoe and Glenfinnan and make sure I make to get there by 5:30 pm to get the last ferry.

I've got 30 miles (60-90 minutes?) to get to Sligachan from Armadale and plenty of daylight to do it. That will give 2 full days in Skye for activities. I'll take the bridge back over on my way to Inverness.

Is this a time where it would make sense to pre-book the ferry? (sounds like it)

That also has the benefit of cutting out 1 additional B&B stop but at the expense of Inverary and Cruchan. Sounds like a reasonable compromise.

I'll have 3 nights in Callander; 3 nights in Sligachan; and 2 nights near Inverness.

sheila

Yes. I only recommend that where one must be on a certain boat, or it's the last boat of the day. So, in this case, yes, book.

Do ask if there's anything else we can help wiith

janisj

sheila is right - definitely book the ferry. And you'll have hours of daylight left when you get to Skye. Sunset June 1st is about <u>10:00 PM</u> so you can get in quite a bit of scenery even if you go straight to the hotel to check in first. . .