Let's start with getting yor priorities straight.

Before you even think about what you want in an apartment, you have to decide what city to go to.

My 1-2 go-tos would be Paris and London.

The group probably doesn't want to cling to each other during the day, so you need a city with diverse activitities and a good public transit system.

I like Paris as #1 because it has an excellent Metro system, and lots to see and do for all ages of the family. Everything from the greatest muesums in the world to great historical places, parks to run around in or just enjoying the world go by. I won't go into the monuments and structures in detail.

London is second because their tube system is not quite as good. It's less flexible and seems, to me, to be more expensive. The locals do speak English, but so do a majority of the Parisiens. There are lots of 'neat' places to go and see. There are theatres at night, pubs for that much needed pint, and some pretty good museums in their own right. For those that want to, day trips to Stonhenge, Bath or York. I've even been down to Brighton. Hotels are more expensive in London.

A distant third would be Amsterdam.

When all 12 of you can decide on a city, come back here and then ask those questions about apartments, etc...

BTW: you can get pizza just about everywhere except Antartica.

Locations depends on how much you enjoy or hate hot weather. I would choose a northern city because it's bound to be cooler.

I agree that you need a larger and diverse city since you won't be together all the time. And someplace that offers day trips within an hour.

I would choose Berlin because of location. If it were other than summer Paris would be my first choice, followed by Rome and then London.

Free advice is often not worth much. Since you are not that familiar with where you would like to go, you might want to consider working with a travel planner. It will save a lot of time and headaches, if not heartaches.

My personal first and second choices would be London and Paris - actually equal 1st and 2nd--both are amazing for families. But I notice you haven't included a UK tag, so maybe you aren't interested in London or have been there before.

I might rank London just barely ahead of Paris because all the museums are free and because of all the theatre options for evening diversions.

It is a very easy for a large group to enjoy all together and in 2's 3's and so on.

If you choose Paris, Paris Vacation Apartments has several apartments in the Palais Royal building. They are 2 and 3 bedroom.

Hi M,

>We are hoping to be able to make a trip to Europe next summer with our extended family (kids and grandkids) -- 12 people total ranging in age from 8 to 66. <

Do you really, really want to drag 10 other people off to a foreign land without the help of a tour director?

Why not invite them all up to a resort on a lake near a big city in the the US?

We took our kids and spouses (8 people) and had hotel rooms for each couple--to Paris.
I recommend a hotel--or perhaps an apartment hotel like Citadines--for the availablity of a concierge/desk for help making reservations, advice.
You don't say if you have travelled to Europe before--that will make a pretty big difference I think.
I recommend Paris because the transportation system is about as easy to figure out as anything.
I HIGHLY recommend hiring a tour guide like Michael Osman for multiple days for sightseeing and for museums. It will make your trip far more maximized--and "you" won't be in charge of the touring per se.
I think you need to be clear with everyone that everyone doesn't need to go everywhere together if they want to do something else on a particular day.
A friend just took her family and grands to paris and Provence for two weeks. I think there were 8 or 9. They planned their own trip--and used Michael in Paris.
All that said, that is a really large group--and Ira's suggestion might be right on. However, I also assume that in your family there is more than one "planner" (you) so have everyone join in on the planning and see how that goes.
How many families is this--adult to kid ratio--ages?

Thank you all for the helpful input! Let me clarify a few things. I should have mentioned that my husband and I have traveled extensively in Europe so any city we would choose would be one we have already spent time in ourselves.

Our group consists of one single, two 2-party families, one 3-party family, and one 4-party family. Three kids aged 7, 9 and 16.

Ira, I do like your idea to stay in the U.S. and have not ruled that out. (Everyone is our group finally has a passport so we were anxious to give them a taste of the world.) I also tend to think of Europe having much better public transportation. Did you have a particular U.S. city in mind? Canada might be a good idea too especially in the summer (I hadn't considered that before.)

I totally agree with you, Gretchen, that we need to provide lots of flexibility for sightseeing so that different groups can break off and do things on their own. Our one son and daughter-in-law are also world travelers, so they will be a big help. I like the Citadines/apartment hotel idea alot too -- thanks!

Paris is my favorite city so my first inclination was to go there. But Adrienne brings up an excellent point about the weather. Normally, we travel in the shoulder seasons, but for this trip, we don't want to take the kids out of school. Berlin is a very interesting choice -- hadn't thought of that and it has such an amazing mix of history and art. Thanks!

And janisj, thanks for the comment on London with its free museums. And of course, the language issue would be much easier.

In general terms for sightseeing, I am thinking about an introductory bus tour, a half-day with a tour guide (like a Michael in Paris), one day trip for the whole group to do together, and then plenty of time to explore.

So for right now, I am thinking (in alphabetical order LOL): Berlin, London, or Paris. Any other ideas? Or pros and cons for each?

You'll want a full day or more with Michael, I promise you. It will be the best money (and comparatively little) you spend. Don't do the bus tour--let Michael do it better.
If you are looking for a beach--the SC coast would have all you want, and could be sightseeing also. Possibly Charleston.

I think this is doable IF

People have either been to europe before or are fairly flexible in "how things are done"

If you prefer moderate weather I would go with London - but it's probably somewhat more expensive than Paris

If you don;t mind hot weather with no AC then Paris is a good option (Yes there are many Paris hotels with AC but if you want a family dining room you will need an apartment and almost no apartments have AC. Also - almost no apts have dining rooms good for more than 4 or 5 people - european apts are generally much smaller than in the US)

As for the issues of how to handle money, who coordinates going where, who is flexible and who will be a whiner - that is a function of the group - and can be just as much a problem with a group trip in the US as a group trip abroad - as long as you are going to a metro area with a solid tourist infrastructure (I wouldn't send you to a small town in the eastern european countryside).

I would poll your group on the conditions in each place (weather, language, major sights etc) and present a REALISTIC budget now. Don't do any further planning without getting each couple to agree in writing now to a minimum of $5000 for the trip - obviously more for famillies with kids. Give them a basic sample budget:

Air fare X per person
Hotel/Apt X per night per couple - or 2X per family (look at a couple of sample places in central locations)
$125/150 per day per person for food, local transit and sights
Shopping is extra

If they show any hesitation about the conditions or the costs - then drop the idea now and just plan your own trip. There's noting worse than doing all of the planning, coming to the point of paying and having people suddenly discover that they don't have or don;t want to spend this money. Except perhaps having them get there and discover that $20 won't get them a dinner with wine in a nice restaurant and that a tiny can of coke costs $3 or $4 - instead of $1.50 for a massive soda with free refills.

I haven't seen cost as a bogey man in this at all. Maybe I missed it. Maybe everyone is chipping in, etc. When we went with our adult children, we DID say to them (and particularly for one person)"not everyone needs to tour with Michael". THAT person turned out to be Michael's biggest fan, and we wanted him another day!!
SO, I'm not getting NYtraveler.
I will add that we stayed in a very modest hotel, and I didn't do my homework well. But a hotel is really not a bad idea--everyone has their privacy, and particularly the parents are in charge of the kids.
OP, there is a Citadines we visited one time that overlooks the Seine and from the room we visited, a view of Notre Dame--maybe quay des Grandes Augustines? They are not cheap, but it can offer some flexibility.
I LOVE family vacations. We have done them skiing, beaching, and in Europe. I wish I thought we could do one more to Paris--one never knows. Our 50th anniversary is coming up--we celebrated our 20th and 40th in Paris with our kids!!

I have some experience with family vacations like you are planning (grandparents-me,children,spouses, and grandchildren). What works best for us is a house, swimming pool, large outdoor area in the countryside.

For Europe I would recommend renting a house(villa, agriturismo) in Tuscany in the area of Pienza/Montepulciano-south of Florence, south of Siena.The area was developed for this type of tourism.It is perfect for kids- they can play safely outside. The adults can hang out outdoors.You will get a kitchen, your table for 12(and take out pizza) and as many bedrooms as you want. There are activities galore.Many sights within an hour away. A long day trip to Rome via train is possible.You would need multiple cars.Bus tours, guides, etc. can be aranged by tourist office in Pienza.
Some Agriturismos operate as B&Bs so you could go that route.
Another successful European family vacation would be a Mediterranean cruise, but this would probably be more $$$.

http://goitaly.about.com/gi/o.htm?zi=1/XJ&zTi=1&sdn=goitaly&cdn=travel&tm=24&f=10&su=p284.13.342.ip_p531.56.342.ip_&tt=33&bt=1&bts=1&zu=http%3A//www.photoshow.com/watch/ZV5km4jj

I'm sorry. It can be beautiful, AND very isolated, expensive (multiple cars), split up, etc. Why do I think this is an ad.

It depends on the make up of the group.

If you have small kids that may work - but many (most) teens would be bored stiff. They are much more likely to want cities, activities in the evenings, meeting local students in pubs and cafes etc. If we had buried my teen daughters in the countryside we would never have heard the end of it. (And I admit I would have been bored to death to.) Only makes sense if you are close (teen self-travel) to at least one sizable city - so they can have museums, shopping, major sights and nightlife.

I would consider Montreal. It's quite cosmopolitan; has lots of private B and B's that accommodate family groups; lots to do and inexpensive and reliable public transport . Plus you could all use your passports!

Really appreciate all the comments! I do think we need to be in a city -- the countryside has too many issues (like multiple rental cars and boredom for a 16-year-old).

The Mediterranean cruise is an interesting idea though -- if we could get an exceptionally good deal...

I like Montreal too -- European flavor but closer to home. Will add it to my short list.

This is all really helpful -- thanks!

We took our grandchildren to Tuscany with trips to Florence and Siena. They were not bored at all, walked to village, etc.

HI M,

Have you considered Copenhagen?

Everyone will love Tivoli.

There is much to do outside the city.

The weather will be cooler than farther south.

> Did you have a particular U.S. city in mind?<

Actually, I was thinking of a resort area. However, have you considered upstate New York and New England?

I think this kind of mass group family thing seems to work best only in an actual resort (where you can book multiple rooms and has some activities) or in a large villa-type house where you probably could find one for twelve. But the idea of doing this in a European city sounds complicated to me, although of course, you can book multiple rooms in a hotel (or the aparthotels such as Citadines, sure). But you are turning into a travel agent and you won't be able to book all those rooms yourself, so then you'll have to coodinate and get everyone to book simultaneously or something. I don't think hotels will reserve 5 rooms for one person who isn't authorized as a travel agent or something, it is too risky for them. So different people will have to reserve their own rooms.

Maybe you can find some villa-type large house in an area where you don't need a car, but does seem unlikely.

Personally, I don't think the weather is any more predictable in any location suggested, I sure don't think London vs. Paris makes any difference.

I would probably suggest Switzerland myself. They have an excellent public transportation system (the trains), and there are some cities with good ones, also. And I think there are some areas where you can rent large "villas" that are just outside a city not far where you might not need a car. But it is nice in summer and beautiful, and just a very easy and pleasant country to visit. I know some people say it is so expensive, but I stayed in one of the most expensive areas (Montreux) and didn't find it any more expensive than Paris or London. I think I've seen some villas for rent around Lac Leman, for example.

"(and find out how you managed it)"
We made meeting times for meals, excursions,other group activities, etc. You will need cell phones(or email devices) for communication, change of plans, which is very important. "The line at the eiffel tower is long and we will be an hour late for dinner". We woke up early and are out for a walk, will return at 9AM". "The kids had to eat now, we won't be back for breakfast."
Nothing worse than keeping the group waiting.

France is another good country for renting houses (Gites). Last year we rented a house in the Dordogne, an area full of family activities-caves, cave art, castles, Cro-Magnon man, gardens, markets,medieval towns,most beautiful picturesque villages, river activities(canoes, kayaks, boat rides), pilgrimage sites, cycling, abbeys,medieval rock shelters, and more foie gras than you can stand.Medieval Sarlat, near our house, had all kinds of night life, outdoor rock concerts and a very special Fete Nationale (Bastille Day)celebration.

Montreal European Flavour, huh? I guess it depends on where you come from, as a European it just looks like a NA city to me.

Managing the party is one thing and needs to be done wherever you go. However you can look at this a number of ways
1) Go to a city, rent a house in the city near public transport and visit around. This is easy in Paris or London, but you could also do Prague, Budapest, Florence. There are loads of places to do this in and I have done so in Florence and Rome.
2) Go to the country and take a country house (with pool, big kitchen and places to lounge), preferably with the odd staff (at least to arrange the odd posh meal) and to arrange day trips. Real opportunities exist in Mosel, Languedoc, Tuscany etc, Burgundy

Dugi describes the right sort of thing and certainly gites-de-france is a fantastic web site for these sort of things
2) Go to the

We use AT&T and, on our last trip to Europe, we bought a texting package.....much cheaper than calling.
We've done group trips to Paris several times and always found air conditioned apartments, sometimes 2 in one building. If that is what you choose, it is quite doable.

As nytraveler says, no city apartment has space for 12 to dine together. For a big family meal, you could either rent rooms in a hotel that has a separate private dining space, either associated with the hotel restaurant or caterable. Or plan a joint meal in a private dining room in a restaurant. Some hotels have rooms with kitchens.

When we travel with a group, everybody has to pay their share upfront at the time of their commitment. If somebody has to drop out, they lose their money if a replacement cannot be found. But this is more difficult when dealing with family members.

I agree a city offers many entertainment options. But it makes it harder to get everyone together. I think I prefer a big country villa with multiple rental cars. There you have more space, shared space, and you spend more time together as a group.

I'm sorry, but Christina is wrong again on something she hasn't done herself. I booked 5 hotel rooms for our family trip. I found a modest hotel, and everyone was a good sport about it--it was undergoing renovation, but the family who owned it was very nice and helpful to us. It only requires a credit card.
I think Montreal would be a poor subsitute, personally--like "I can't do this in Paris, so I'll just do this as a sub".
Swwitzerland is beautiful, but there is so much more to do IN Paris that is SO accessible with many many choices.
These are adult children with families. Everyone can be responsible for themselves and their belongings--it isn't a tour group where the "director" has to be the authority figure.
The one thing that will be necessary is dinner reservations when all are eating together. So advance planning is of teh essence there. We could, of course, walk into a Leon's mussel restaurant and such as that.
We picknicked on the Champs de Mars which was a good thing for a lunch. And we split up on days for ones that wanted to shop and others who wanted to do whatever. it doesn't need to be a lock step trip.