LiSquared

I'm taking my niece to Paris and London for her high school graduation. The highlight for her is a concert in Hyde Park in early July at the end of the trip. We are flying in and out of London, then I guess buying tickets to fly to Paris makes sense, and take the train back. Aside from that, I'm not quite sure what special (but not costly) things would be fun for a kinda cool, loves San Francisco, vintage/thrift shopping, people watching, eclectic music loving 18 year old on her first trip outside the US? Also, suggestions for where to stay - she's more interested in feeling Parisian and practicing her fairly decent French than in the tourist spots. Same questions for London. I got a hotel near Hyde Park for before and after the concert, but we've got about 7 days to spend in each country and money is an issue. And yes, I'm reading tour books, and trying to get her to read them too, but so far...it's just me planning. Thanks for any advice!

BigRuss

You need to talk in cognizable terms, not "costly" or "money is an issue." It's an issue for everyone who's not sitting on eight-figure personal wealth.

First, define your expectations for lodging based on price and location. There is a lot of variety for London. Consider a rental apartment there too. State your budget and you'll get actual suggestions.

Second, what is a "costly" thing to do? If it's listed on the www.daysoutguide.co.uk 2for1 offer list in and around London, it's less costly if you have a voucher to get two admissions for the price of one. Paris also has discounts available.

Third, the list of no-fee admission museums in London is as long as your arm. Go googling. And get her off her hindquarters and tell her to provide input. It's not your job to read her mind.

Fourth, how does buying tickets to fly to Paris from London make sense considering you have to get out of London to whichever airport (more transport costs) and then from one of the Parisian airports into Paris? Try Eurostaring each way.

You could also set your transatlantic flights into London and home from Paris if you haven't shelled for your tickets yet.

bilboburgler

fly or train, depends a bit where in London you are going from. London has 6 airports (London City is the most central) and one train point of interest. If you are arriving from USA and then flying onto Paris that day then you are right, other wise take the train both ways. You may find flying open jaw is cheaper (into London, out of Paris should be cheapest as it limits tax)

Stay in 5, 6 or 7th in 2 or 3 star local hotels will get you good deals and access to reasonable priced food (basically student area), you'll find the area north (across the Seine is good walking/shopping/people watching areas.

bilboburgler

BigRuss, sorry we were typing at the same time.

PalenQ

Take the Eurostar train - just about 2 hours city centre to city centre and you see some of rural England - lovely Kent and France to boot - flying will probably cost more and you see little. Go to www.eurostar.com - the official site of the Eurostar trains and book WAY early ASAP top snatch limited in number deep discounted ducats - do not just show up or you'll spend hundreds of dollars more perhaps of your precious money.

do at least one day trip into a more real England or France from your London and Paris bases - Oxford or Cambridge are about an hour from London by train (or bus) and are really nice and interesting - though you could go to Stonehenge and Salisbury or Bath or Stratford-on-Avon, etc easily by train.

In Paris I'd do a day trip to either Chartres to see the world-famous Gothic cathedral or to Reims to see that famous cathedral city and its more famous Champagne cellars and samples (18 is the legal imbibing age in both France and England).

For train info on Eurostar besides the official site check www.seat61.com - great info on discounted tickets and for general train info www.ricksteves.com and www.budgeteuropetravel.com (check the latter's free online European Planning & Rail Guide's chapters on Britain and France for more ideas of easy day trips from London by train).

Of course do the short trip to Versailles from Paris - by metro/RER right to near the palace's gates - a don't miss thing when in Paris IMO.

janisj

Flying to Paris makes no sense UNLESS you mean on your arrival day immediately after landing at Heathrow. So if that is what you meant - then yes - book a flight. Otherwise taking the train to Paris make more sense.

Have you already booked your flights? If not -- book open jaw in to London, then after your stay in London take the train to Paris, then fly home from Paris. That will save you schelpping back to London an extra time.

>> got a hotel near Hyde Park for before and after the concert,<<

Which hotel? 'Near Hyde Park' covers a VAST swath of central London and some of those areas are terrific - some not so much.

Plus really, there is no need to stay near the park just because of a concert there. There are 10 tube stations immediately surrounding Hyde Park/Kensington Gardens and several others within a reasonable walk - PLUS several bus lines. So you can literally stay in any part of central London and be convenient to the park.

>>but we've got about 7 days to spend in each country and money is an issue<<

I would book a flat in central London (anywhere - not necessarily near the park) and a hotel in Paris.

What is your actual budget?

nytraveler

Definitely fly open jaws if possible - it should not cost any more. If you already have tickets in and out of London definitely do the Eurostar city center to city center to avoid wasting a whole day foofing around at the airports.

Check out ticket prices I believe 90 days in advance - to get the lowest fares.

Your niece should get the Let's Go Student Guide to find out what her fellows recommend and - and also to find pubs/clubs where kids her age will hang out in the evening.

LiSquared

Thanks all. The tickets in and out of London are purchased, and we were planning to head directly to Paris. I had been reading earlier about the hints on train vs plane and as a result decided that plane one way and train the other might work best. But you all have pretty different opinions than the last thread. Incidentally, I tried for open jawed tickets but the fares were quite a bit higher. I am looking at apartments in both cities right now - the Hyde Park hotel was simply to make it easy on the night of the concert with the number of people likely to be moving around. But I appreciate the referral to the Let's Go Student Guide. PalenQ, great specific thoughts, I appreciate that. Big Russ, thanks for the link to days out guide. I wasn't really asking for a complete itinerary, but rather regions or things a teen might be interested in doing that I might not find through Google, tour books, etc. A little outside input in planning can be helpful. My total budget didn't seem a key point. Thanks again everyone.

janisj

>>My total budget didn't seem a key point.<<

it is about the 'key-est' point. No one can give any useful recommendation w/o knowing your budget. It isn't a state secret.

Re the Hyde Park area hotels -- 'Hyde Park' covers a HUGE area of central London and simply being near the park isn't necessarily a good thing. In fact, staying away from the park over the concert date is probably something to consider. If this is the Barclay's/Take That concert -- the crowds will be massive and staying in the immediate area could be problematic.

I'd stay somewhere along the Piccadilly Line or Circle line away from the Kens Gardens/Hyde Park area.

Jay_G

As other posters have helped with the logistics, here's a few ideas of what an 18 year old who has the interests you describe might like to do in London and Paris;

The old hands might say that Camden is a bit played out, but most 18 year olds will love it. Lots of vintage / thrift / unique shops in the area, lots of pubs playing all kinds of music (some of it could only be described as such in the loosest possible terms) and plenty of characters in the area that give an impression of London proper.

It would also be worth venturing a bit further east into Shoreditch / Hoxton if she likes San Francisco as there are lots of cafés and bars populated by bearded, tattooed folk and that's just the ladies (ba-dum tish) selling drinks and food in receptacles that weren't designed for that purpose.

Even though it's about as authentic as a nine-bob note, my younger relatives and friends visiting from abroad all love it as you see plenty of things you don't see in many other places. The area also offers plenty of Instagram worthy sights if your niece is into that

Jay_G

oops, hit submit too soon.

In Paris she may well like the Oberkampf area, which was once achingly cool and is still worth a visit for a less touristy, younger skewing experience. Here's a short area guide for the kind of things you'll see there;

http://www.timeout.com/paris/en/thin...mpf-area-guide

Also worth a visit are the 19th and 20th arrondissements which again eschew the chocolate boxy experience of more central areas and a full of character and the impression that you're genuinely discovering places that not everyone knows about. Here's a guide for this area;

http://assets0.mamashelter.com/syste...152.1409300505

If you want specific recommendations, just holler.

BigRuss

<<My total budget didn't seem a key point>>

Who asked for your total budget? You want lodging recs, state a nightly budget. If you want activity recs and are afraid of "costly" ones, state what costly means.

And if you're trying to get to Paris the day you land in London, then fly from the airport you're arriving into. You may find out that the "more expensive" open jaw itinerary is about the same when you account for the cost of the transport you need to add to your trip plan.

stokebailey

That lucky niece. Should be so fun for both of you.

We like to stay at the kind of inexpensive London hotels called "B&B Inns" on tripadvisor. The ones with a breakfast room, a more homey atmosphere and chance to get into conversations with other guests. If you stick to the best reviewed ones I doubt you can go wrong. The "basic" rooms with bath down the hall are expecially reasonably priced. We like Bloomsbury. Lots of fun pubs in that area.

My youngest is a student in London now, enjoys getting out to places in Camden, Islington. You both might enjoy the Blues Kitchen in Camden or Shoreditch for live music.

In Paris, Bastille area is fun. My other daughter enjoyed Sunday evening salsa dancing at Barrio Latino when she was studying there, still arranges to go back when she can. Does your niece like dancing or a particular kind of music?

Not sure when it starts, but every evening in the summer there's salsa and tango dance, and other fun activity, on the Quai St-Bernard, south of river and just east of Pont de Sully. You'll both enjoy a visit there to drink in the scene.

Lexma90

Re getting your 18yo niece to be involved in trip planning, I understand. My kids (now 20yo DS and 17yo DD, also graduating from H.S. this year, which will include Paris) don't really get into the trip planning - they say they're too busy. But also, I think they trust me and my ideas, and our experiences on prior trips, that I usually get it right, in terms of what they enjoy.

What also works for me is to narrow down possibilities, and when I have 5 minutes of DD's attention, say (for example), I know you like Napoleon, would you want to take a day trip to Fountainebleu, there's a museum with a lot of his stuff. And if I limit the websites, I can usually get her to look at a couple and say yes or no.

If this is your neice's first trip to Europe, you may find that the "touristy" sights are good options too - there are reasons that people visit touristy sights. I have given much advice to friends and family visiting Europe for the first time, including more out of the way spots, only to find out when they return home that while they had a great time, they didn't go to any of the little gems I pointed out. But that's ok, as long as they have a good time.

Your nieces will be legal to drink, so definitely stop at a pub or two (or three). I have never liked beer, but I really like the variety of hard ciders (now finally available in the US), and my new favorite summer drink, Pimms, with herbs. And of course, lots of cafe time with a glass of wine in Paris.

LiSquared

I just lost my reply, but mostly it was thank you to the recent responders - your tips are perfect, great information and ideas. Exactly what I was looking for. I really appreciate it and welcome other thoughts about unique things in the cities that I might not find through regular channels. Thank you so much JayG, strokebaily, lexma90 and back earlier PalenQ. Exactly what I needed, at least at this point in planning! Thanks again.

Lisquared

PalenQ

thank you - so often folks just seem to disappear and say nothing. Thanks for the thanx!