Voyage_B

My Husband and I are planning a trip to Southern Spain with a brief jaunt to Portugal this coming June for 2 weeks. Typically while vacationing, we like to mix fun sports-oriented activities with a bit of site seeing as well as beach going. We're not the type of travelers you're going to find in museums but we adore good wine, food and culture.

Thus far, we've selected the following cities to visit based on our interests:

SPAIN:
Seville - with a day trip to Cordova
Ronda - day trip ?
Granada - for the Alhambra
Tarifa - we plan to kiteboard for several days
Jerez de la frontera - to see the horse show for the day
Marabella - beaches/ relaxation ?

PORTUGAL:
Faro - Is this worth the trip?
Tavira - horseback riding tour (if we visit this area)

Here are my questions:

1. We have the option of flying into Seville or Malaga which would be preferable based on our interests and proposed itinerary?

2. Given that we have two weeks, how long would you stay in each city?

3. Would you eliminate any city (with the exception of Tarifa - kite-surfing is a must)

4. What route/ order would you visit each city knowing that a multi-destination flight is proving to be expensive? (I'm having trouble avoiding back-tracking)

5. We plan to rent a car, is this the best way to travel based on our itinerary?

6. Any other creative ideas? Suggestions welcome!!!

Thank you!
-B

dfourh

Faro itself is not that exciting, but Tavira is beautiful. In fact, a nice tour could include the pretty town square in Ayamonte on the border in Spain, the old fortress at Castro Marim, the tiny little whitewashed town of Cacela Velha perched over the ocean, and beautiful Tavira with it's lovely setting and many classic touches. If you go further the port town of Olhao has an interesting setting, before Faro. Of all these, Faro is probably the least memorable.

yorkshire

Can you get the same fare if you fly into Malaga and out of Sevilla (or vice versa?) (I have flown into Madrid and out of Sevilla and into Malaga and out of Jerez for the same as round trip in the past.)
Otherwise, try putting together loops with the train system for both options. I don't think a car is necessary at all. In fact, I would find it a great hindrance. Driving in cities is a pain, plus you have to limit yourself to hotels with parking and paying for parking. Bus and train connections are so convenient. Note I do recommend a car rental for one portion--and you could do a rental car day trip out of Ronda if you end up staying there as well.

I think Malaga round-trip works better--I can't see how to not backtrack with round-trip Sevilla. For example (my recommended # of days in parentheses (0-1 for day trips):
Malaga(1 *at start OR end of trip)
Ronda(1 at least)
Granada(2)
Cordoba(0-1)
Sevilla (3)
Jerez(0-1)
Rent a car and explore beaches (and inland towns) southeast of Cadiz to Tarifa (3?) (research towns with "de la frontera" in the name). See if you can drop the car in Algeciras and then take a train to Malaga (departure) (this requires a train change I think, so probably plan on last night in Malaga, and then depart Malaga immediately upon arrival for Ronda or Granada).
There is wiggle room for you to add the extra days as you see fit, but I don't see any way to include Portugal, and I think this would be an amazing 2-week visit to Andalucia.
http://www.andalucia.com/ is a great resource.

CathyM

I'd probably spend 5 nights in Sevilla and visit Cordoba and Jerez as daytrips. Both Cordoba and Jerez are great places to spend a couple of nights on their own but with only 2 weeks I don't think you have time for a 2 night stay in each and I personally hate 1-nighters. I'd budget a couple of nights for Granada and a couple for Ronda (assuming you have a car and want to explore the white villages). This only leaves 5 nights for Faro, Tavira, Tarifa and Marbella - which is very tight. It would make the trip much easier logistically if you dropped the Portugal piece and just focused on Spain. You could spend a couple of nights in Tarifa and then have 3 nights remaining. I'd probably then add a couple of nights for Malaga and then 1 night I'd probably add to one of the exisiting locations or for Marbella (although I've never visited there so I can't speak much to it) or make Jerez or Cordoba an overnight.

Voyage_B

Thank you for the helpful hints thus far - the comments are wonderful.

First, let's assume we decide to arrive and depart through Malaga. When we attempt to add Sevilla in the mix, air fare prices jump as well number of transfers - both undesirable!

It's also fair to assume we'd like to limit the number of hotels we're checking into. I'm not a huge fan of 1 night stops with the exception of arrival and departure day when it can be hard to avoid.

It sounds like the general consensus is to drop Portugal. Since we are really hoping to visit Tavira, is it possible to visit Ronda as a day trip or is this a must see area?

Finally, based on our two week time frame, is Malaga worth a visit or should we head right to Granada, Mirabella, or even Tarifa when we arrive in the morning?

Thanks again!
-B

CathyM

If you arrive and depart from Malaga that's still great - Sevilla is only 2 hours away by train and Granada easily accessible by bus. I think Malaga is a great place to spend a couple of days and even more - there are lots of potential daytrip possibilities you can do without a car (Antequera, Ronda, Nerja, etc....). Depending on the timing of your arriving/departing flights you could spent the time in Malaga and the beginning or tail end of the trip.

Regarding Ronda - If you don't want to rent a car you could visit Ronda as a daytrip from Sevilla or Malaga. If you want to rent a car then I'd rent a car from Granada to Sevilla exploring the white villages along the way for 2-3 days. Otherwise given your time I'd probably just visit as a daytrip and save the evenings for other places.

You may also enjoy a couple of nights in Cadiz. It's 2 hours by bus or train from Sevilla and is an easy base to visit the sherry triangle towns of Jerez, Sanlucar and El Puerto by public transportation.

kimhe

Málaga is a wonderful city with lots of genuine Andalusian atmosphere, great sights, cafés, tapas bars, restaurants, theaters etc. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/ci...-treasure.html

Have some typical Málaga wine from the barrels at Antigua Casa de Guardia from 1840. At Alameda Principal in the very center of town: http://www.antiguacasadeguardia.net/home.html

Loads of excellent tapas bars, but here are some suggestions in the center:

Both traditional and innovative Tapeo de Cervantes, gets raving reviews. http://www.tripadvisor.com/Restauran...Andalucia.html

Wonderful seafood tapas at authentic La Campana: http://11870.com/pro/la-campana-malaga

Traditional and no fuzz Cortijo de Pepe on Plaza Merced: http://www.globalcitybreak.co.uk/tra...-bar-in-malaga

Bodega El Pim-Pi is a must later at night for wine, a bite and the best atmosphere: http://www.bodegabarelpimpi.com/launch_eng.html

Casa Aranda is probably the best café I've ever been to. Coffee or chocolate con churros. An institution in town: http://www.tripadvisor.com/Restauran...Andalucia.html

Go just east of the city center to Pedregalejo for high quality and affordable seaside restaurants popular with locals. Here are also some nice beaches.

Just North of Málaga, you'll find the spectacular Torcal limestone rock formations. From up here you can see to Africa on a clear day. Drive to the top, several hiking routes of different length and difficulty. http://www.absoluteaxarquia.com/areas/eltorcal.html

josele

The problem with visiting Ronda as a daytrip is that you'll be there the same time crowds of tourists are. In the early morning before they arrive, and when they depart in the early evening, Ronda is a more charming place.
I can help you if you want with kitesurfing, my nephew lives there and he's vice-world campion Alex Pastor.

yorkshire

The number of one night stays just depends on when you rent a car and which places you want to see the most. I am not a fan on one night stays myself, but I do prefer them over long day trips. I'd suggest an overnight for Tavira if you make the trek, and your last night in Malaga. Other than that, you can probably split your time between Sevilla and Tarifa with Ronda or Granada thrown in.

"It sounds like the general consensus is to drop Portugal. Since we are really hoping to visit Tavira, is it possible to visit Ronda as a day trip or is this a must see area?"
Like josele said, Ronda is full of day trippers during the day. If you are not going to see the sunset and spend time hiking in the area (which was literally applauded on one of my experiences), then I would not overextend yourself to see the town.

"Finally, based on our two week time frame, is Malaga worth a visit or should we head right to Granada, Mirabella, or even Tarifa when we arrive in the morning?"
Since you will be flying out of Malaga, at least spend your last night there (the historic town is great but tiny), but to maximize your time, head north when you arrive. It is not far to Granada or Ronda.

I don't know Marbella either, so you should explore whether it is worth considering since there are nice beaches close to Tarifa.

yorkshire

I meant to say that the sunset (over the gorge) was applauded.

Egbert

Marbella is not a must see. The beaches are nicer from Tarifa to Cadiz. Is Ronda a must see? Not realy but it is a nice quiet town and the view from the gorge is pretty close to being a "must see". Renting a car is not necessary in Andalucia and quite a hassle in Seville and Granada. The one exception is the area around Ronda so if you do go there and want to see some of the smaller "white villages" like Grazalema, Zahara etc. That is the only part of your trip where a car is neccessary. I usually agree with Cathy's advice and this is no exception. The old part of Malaga and Cadiz are also great small cities with unique
Andalucian culture and atmosphere.

Voyage_B

Again thank you for the great advice!

It sounds like Malaga is a better place to visit than Marabella especially since we plan to spend several days in Tarifa for Kite-boarding/ Kite-surfing.

CathyM/ Egbert - I like your idea of renting a car in between Granada and Sevilla.

We will be bringing gear with us to Kitesurf and we want to have flexibility with our days. Given these two variables do you still recommend against a car for the entire two weeks?

Josele - Any advice on attractive kiting beaches from your nephew would be very helpful.

Thank you,
-B

CathyM

I would definately not want to have a car in Sevilla or Granada. It will just be a hassle trying to find parking, maneuvering a strange city and also paying for parking. You'll also find the train faster in many cases than driving (ie. Sevilla to Cordoba, Malaga to Sevilla).

How large is your kitesurfing equipment?

josele

I'll meet my nephew next monday, shall tell you then.

Voyage_B

The kite bag is the size of a large golf bag. We will have two carry-on bags for a total of three.

I'm confirming our flights this weekend and will jump back on next week with a revised itinerary based on your great suggestions.

Thanks, everyone!

MyriamC

Don't drop Portugal! It's a beautiful country, with lovely people. I didn't think that Faro was uninteresting. We have taken the city walk there and we liked it a lot. It has a lot of monuments in the historical centre.

We rent a penthouse in Cabanas de Tavira and usually head to Tavira in the late afternoon for a walk and for dinner. IMO Tavira is the most authentic town in Algarve with a rich historical past.

You might also want to drive to Serra de Monchique/Caldas de Monchique, a very scenic drive in the mountains.

SloJan2

I will be a contrarian too. I would skip Jerez and Marbella and add time to Portugal. The two countries have vastly different feels and the driving times between Faro and Seville is less than 2 hours. I would even think of skipping Cordoba. Spend the time in Seville, Granada and Ronda. Then drive to Portugal and visit Tavira, head west and see Silves, and stay in Lagos. Driving time from Seville to Lagos will be about 3 1/2 hours. Surf the coast at Aljezur. You can go diving also in the Central Algarve. The beaches of the Algarve far surpass the beaches of Spain. The wine is as good, the people are more relaxed. Spain is fabulous but a bit stress-y, PT is pure relaxation and comfort. You can also rent a villa in the central Algarve for not a lot of money in June.

There will not be hoardes of tourists either and it will be possible to find private beaches. Hiking is fab too.

Finally, rent a car.

SloJan2

Oops, a bit more. Check this out.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EbG4M--OlsU

It is possible to stay away from the fish and chip locales. Plus, there are wineries just a bit north that you can visit too.

Windsailing is huge too.

I always say Spain is for culture and Southern Portugal is for fun (relaxing and sports). A combo trip is the best.

josele

Voyage_B, you can contact my nephew Alex at www.alexpastor.es, he is in New Caledonia now (wow), but I spoke to him first, and he'll be waiting your mail, say you are Voyage_B from Fodor. I dont think you'll get better advice.

Voyage_B

Hi Everyone,

Thank you for the wonderful replies...Portugal is back in!

I've updated our itinerary based on your suggestions. I'd appreciate your feedback.

Things to keep in mind:
-We will be traveling in early June
-We'll be in Europe for 15 days/14 nights
-We plan to kitesurf in Tarifa
-We'd like a vacation that mixes beach time and sports with historic and cultural outings.
-You won't find us in Museums (on this trip, at least)
-We will rent a car for part or all of the vacation

Here's our new itinerary:
Arrive: Malaga

Tarifa - 4 nights
(Stop in Jerez de La Frontera on way to Sevilla)
Sevilla - 3 nights (with potential day trip to Cordoba)

Tavira,Portugal – 3 nights

Ronda – 1 night
Granada - 2 nights
Malaga – 1 night

Depart - Malaga

Question:

Since we are not fans of one night stays, should we eliminate Ronda and add the night to Portugal, Granada, or Sevilla?

Thank you!
-B