John_and_Katie

On a previous thread we decided on spending most of our time in Italy when we go on our honeymoon the first week of November. We will be traveling from Chicago, so obviously we'll be burning a couple days with our arrival and departure. That said, is it feasible to spend ~2 days in Greece, ~4 days in Italy, and then ~2 days in Paris? Will we be very rushed getting from place to place?

abram

To me, that sounds like a sentence, not a vacation, and certainbly not a honeymoon. You'd waste too much time travelling from country to country, and each of those countries has so much to see that you'd miss most of it. I'd prefer to pick one country and spend the entire time there, staying in two or, at the most, three spots. If you want to move around that much, I'd suggest a Med cruise.

brotherleelove2004

Pick one country and stick with it. Italy has so much to offer, more than you can experience in such a short time. The idea of trying to visit 3 countries in the same time is ludicrous. 3 cities, mabye........

John_and_Katie

I agree that 3 entire countries would be ridiculous and impossible.

I was thinking a couple destinations in Greece, four days in Italy, and then the last two in Paris. Still not a good idea? Maybe eliminate Greece and do 6 or 7 in Italy and the final 2 in Paris?

zeppole

You can't do Greece unless you take the advice to do a cruise. Given that you are so attached to the idea of country hopping, you might think about it. At least you'd get some sleep after the wedding.

Yes, spending six or seven days in Italy in November is a lovely honeymoon plan, capped by two nights in Paris.

I think you'd have an easier time coming to grips with the advice people are giving you if you imagined a European couple planning a 10-day American honeymoon that took them to Washington DC, Dallas, and San Francisco in November.

janisj

You have less than 2 weeks - and that includes your travel. Pick ONE country. If it is Italy, you'll have about 10 days which is long enough to see maybe 3 cities tops or 2 cities and a a couple of days in a more rural area.

If it's France, you'd have enough time for 5 days in Paris and 5 days somewhere else.

Greece - maybe 2 days in Athens and the rest on islands and/or cruising.

dutyfree

Keep in mind how jet lagged you are going to be;tired from all the wedding preparation,etc.

Since we are both from Chicago-remember the famous movie filmed here called Planes, Trains and Automobiles with Steve Martin and John Candy? That would sum up your vacation/honeymoon I think.

Personally, I would pick ONE country and enjoy it TOGETHER without fighting about schedules and other stressful things.2 Days in Greece-not a chance. Because it is November I would pick Greece then Italy for the weather.Good Luck!

luvtotravel

Is there a specific place in Italy that is important to you? You could fly into Venice, then fly home with a stopover in Paris. Very doable. Greece in this mix is difficult as you need to go through Athens to access an island -- that is unless Athens is your goal. Even then, Greece is a bit out of the way.

You could fly into Venice, train to Lake Como, then fly from Milan to Paris. Or Venice, Tuscany, and Paris.

You have 8 days -- that's only 7 nights -- or is it 8 nights? I always think of nights because it's easier to think of hotel stays.

It would help to know what is of interest to you: monuments, ruins, food, shopping, relaxing, a sea view, museums, etc. Do you prefer busy cities or rural settings.

Have you traveled in Europe before? In any case, think about narrowing down your choices so you can enjoy the areas you visit, otherwise you will be spending too much time traveling, unpacking and repacking.

luvtotravel

I just noticed you said November. If you are thinking of the Greek islands, November is late in the season and many things will be closed. I've not traveled in November, but central or southern Italy might be nice, or the Italian/French Riviera. Paris is wonderful 12 months out of the year. I hope someone else can give you direction on where to visit in November.

ira

Hi J,

>is it feasible to spend ~2 days in Greece, ~4 days in Italy, and then ~2 days in Paris? Will we be very rushed getting from place to place?<

Is it possible? Yes.

Is it recommended? No.

Are you going on a honeymoon or an expedition?

With only 7 nights, you can have a very nice visit to

Paris or
Venice and Florence or
Rome or
the Greek Isles.

John_and_Katie

Thanks to all who have responded. We haven't book our flights or any accomodations yet, so the length of the trip is still undecided but will likely fall between 10-14 days, including travel days.

The analogy of a 10-day US honeymoon in DC, Dallas and SF is well taken.

That said, one respondent said that 7 days in Italy and 2 in Paris would be nice...is that the consensus or is it still too much?

I envision possibly flying in to Naples for 1 night/2days, working our way to Rome by rail for 2 nights/3days, then ending in Florence or Venice for 2 nights/3days. From there we could fly to Paris for the final 2 nights/3 days. After writing that it looks pretty hectic, but hopefully someone with experience can shed some light. We're

As for what we would like to experience, we both have never visited Italy, so a range of culture and scenery is preferred. We enjoy both cities and rural areas.

Thanks in advance for your patience of my ignorance regarding European travel...

cindyj

22 years ago we spent our honeymoon in England and Scotland - our first European trip. I was determined to see a lot. After the trip my husband began referring to me on vacation as "in hyper speed." We flew to London and immediately took the train to Edinborough. After 2 nights there we rented a car for 6 days. Drove to Inverness for a night, Skye for a night, ?? in the W of Scotland for a night, and then to York. We felt so crazed that we spent two nights in York and skipped our planned visit to southern England. Finished with 3 or 4 nights in London.

Although I remember the trip fondly, I do wish we had stayed put in fewer towns. Even though we did not leave for the trip until the day after the wedding, in the late afternoon, we were so exhausted in Edinborough that I think we slept for like 14 hours; sleeping right through a fire alarm test in the hotel!

So, that's my 2 cents. I still like to see a lot on my few European trips, but have come to a compromise and enjoy getting to know a town or village and taking in the local pup, cafe, winery, etc. Enjoy!!

cheryllj

<i>I envision possibly flying in to Naples for 1 night/2days, working our way to Rome by rail for 2 nights/3days, </i>

This is part of the problem with that plan: 1 night in Naples is ridiculous (why bother?), and 2 nights in Rome does not equal &quot;3 days,&quot; it is ONE FULL DAY of actual sightseeing. The other days are TRAVEL days.

The first day you will arrive at your hotel later than you expected, and by the time you've checked in, you'll be lucky to have time for dinner and a stroll around the immediate area. Day 2 is your ONE full day of sightseeing. Day 3, it's time to head to the next destination and you'll probably be leaving the hotel before 11 to make your train/flight. So you had one whole day in Rome. Whoopee.

You are vastly underestimating the amount of travel time from place to place, counting check-in and lines and packing/unpacking. A travel day is a travel day, not a sightseeing day. If you're lucky, you will fit in some sightseeing, but it won't be much.

Lexma90

It sounds like you still have an image of visiting several different countries in a relatively limited time period. I think most of us are suggesting that you not try to visit so many destinations in your time frame, whether or not they are entire countries.

Get a map of Europe, lay it out on a table, and look at the various possibilities you've considered, including 2 days in Greece, 4 days in Italy, 2 days in Paris (IMHO, that would be extremely rushed as well). Do the same thing with your idea of Naples-Rome-Florence/Venice-Paris. Note the distances in between.

Then use any airplane search engine you'd like, just to get an idea of flight times (Expedia, Orbitz, whatever). I.e., Athens to Rome, 1:15 hours, seems nice and short, yes, and Rome to Paris is only a little more than a 2-hour flight). Add the following times to that: You need to be at the airport 2 or so hours ahead of time (or less, if you want), plus travel time from your hotel to the airport. Plus packing your bags and checking out from the hotel. Once at your destination, getting your luggage (if you checked it), travel from airport to hotel, check in. Right there, at a guess, you've used up 5-7 hours of your day. The same would be true of train travel in Italy (those less time pre-departure is needed, obviously); you can use TrenItalia's website for train schedules, http://www.trenitalia.it/en/index.html.

Along with your map, take out a calendar showing your possible days. Using a pencil, block in what you might do with your days, and where you'd be each night. It will give you a better idea of how much time you'd have experiencing your trip, rather than transporting yourselves around.

Remember, also, that &quot;2 days&quot; really means less than two days. It's better to think of your trip in terms of nights - if you have two nights in Paris, for example, that may really mean, between travel here and there, that you only have 1 1/2 days in Paris. Which is NOT very much. (Connect this with my earlier comment that everytime you change locations, you lose 1/2 day, at least.) Another example, if you fly into Naples &amp; plan to spent 1 night/2 days there, because one &quot;day&quot; would be your arrival day, and the next &quot;day&quot; would be your departure day to your next destination, you would actually have less than 1 day in Naples (depending on what time your plane arrived in Naples).

Just as an example, here are the exact logistics of a 13-day trip we took several years ago, with our 10yo son. It worked for us, but others would have found this itinerary rushed. (DH and I had been to all of the destinations previously.):

Depart from our home airport at 10:50 am, connect in the U.S., and arrive 2 hours late the following morning at London Heathrow (at about 8 am, I think); long line through immigration, get to our hotel at about 10:30. Short nap for 2 of the group. We spent the rest of that day plus 3 more days in London (no day trips out of the city).

The following day we awoke early, packed up, took a cab to the train station, for a 9 am train to Paris (Eurostar, high-seed), arriving at 12:53. Picked up our rental car, drove out of the city and south to the Loire Valley (we ate a picnic lunch in the car). About 2 1/2 hours after picking up the car, we were at our country chateau outside of Amboise. We spent the rest of that day (it was about 4 pm when we arrived), plus 2 more entire days, in the French countryside.

The next morning, we took a 9:38 am train from nearby Tours (we left Amboise at about 8 am, because DH is a worrywart about missing trains, and we had to return the rental car). The train was (horrors) about 20 min. late, so we didn't arrive into the Paris train station until 11 am or so. Took a cab to our hotel and checked in, just in time for lunch.

The rest of that day, plus the following 3 full days, we spent in Paris. On our departure day, we had time for a leisurely breakfast and some shopping for food to take home, then headed off to the airport.

Obviously, not that you'd want to follow this itinerary to those locations, but see how much of our time, with 3 separate locations, was spent in getting from place to place (and in each, we knew pretty well where we were, and how to get to the next place). And with our two train trips, because me and our son are early risers, we took earlier departure times than some people would choose.

LLindaC

This is completely off the subject, but whatever you decide to do for your honeymoon...if you can schedule it a few days after the wedding you will be so much happier. Tie all the loose endsup...get rested, etc. We waited a week and it was the smartest thing we could have done.

nytraveler

No - it's not feasible. It's silly.

You'll spend way too much time running around from place to place and very little time actually seeing or doing anything.

A couple of points to remember:

In November not only is it chilly and liable to be rainy but the days are very short and many sights are open fewer hours than in the summer.

Also, seas tend to be rough and the ferries that are left (many fewer than in summer) sometimes do not run at all.

Are youg oing to Grece to spend 1 day in Athens? (You certainly don't have time to do an islnd - or any reason to in November.)

For so few days on the ground I would pick either 1 city and some surroudings or 2 cities - no more.

I would probably do London and Paris - but if you prefer Paris and Rome also work. This will give you a taste of 2 major cities and 2 different cultures (to really see much of either one you need to spend at least a week IMHO).

Do you really want to spend your entire honeymoon in a series of airports, train stations, cabs to and fro hotels - and being in each place so little time you see only 1 or 2 things - nevermind relaxing at all?

Christina

&lt;&lt;Maybe eliminate Greece and do 6 or 7 in Italy and the final 2 in Paris?&gt;&gt;

This is the best of your ideas. Forget Greece, why go there in November for a day in Athens, and it is far away from the other places. Just don't try to run all over Italy in that 6-7 days. Maybe Rome and FLorence or Rome and Venice or something like that. If you really want to see Italy, I'd forget Paris.

ira

Hi J,

&gt; one respondent said that 7 days in Italy and 2 in Paris would be nice.....After writing that it looks pretty hectic, &lt;

Stop with the schlepping from city to city, already.

I would not recommend going from Italy to Paris for only 2 days.

Do keep in mind that each time you change cities you lose at least 1/2 day.

10-14 days is perfect for Venice, Florence and Rome (The Grand Tour), or Paris and another venue in France.

I strongly urge you to pick one country.

The other one will still be there on your next trip.

dmlove

I'm chiming in because I'm never short of opinions

It seems like Paris is very important to you. If I were to do this trip (understanding that it can be very cold in Paris in November), I would spend 3-4 days in Paris, a couple of days in the Loire Valley, with a side trip somewhere not too too far (Normandy? the Wine Road?).

I definitely would avoid any intra-Europe flights as all that getting to and from the airport will take up too much of your time.

If you can stand the thought of skipping Paris, easy, I'd do just Italy, but rather than Naples/Rome/Florence OR Venice, I'd do Rome (3 days), Florence (3 days), Venice (2 days), period. If you rent a car or take the train, you can visit some of the small towns in between.

With one day of flying there, one day of recovering from jet lag, and one day flying home, you have to (obviously) subtract 3 days from your trip. So your trip is actually 7-11 days. If you have 7, the above works. If you have 11, you can add perhaps one more stop.

zeppole

I've been a big naysayer on John-and-Katie's hopscotch honeymoon ideas, but I'm now puzzled as to why people think a vacation that embraces two different European cities has to be shot down at all costs.

Is the problem that the two cities are Roma and Paris?

I don't recall seeing these reactions when people said they were spending 2 days in Madrid and 5 in Rome, or 3 days in Rome and 3 in Athens.

I don't think John-and-Katie are going to be doing anything else but strolling in these cities and gawking. What they seem to want most is culture shock, to see why France is different from Italy.

In that regard, since they are midwesterners and indifferent to lousy weather, I'm beginning to think they should visit Rome, Berlin and Paris -- or Amsterdam, Vienna and Rome (with a day trip to Firenze).

But John-and-Katie, part of the resistance you are getting is nobody wants to aid you in taking what for 95 percent of Fodorites would be a really miserable trip.

You might try posting on some backpacker message boards, because that style of travel is all about just turning up in another country with your Railpass, being wide-eyed, and then hitting some place else. It may be what your looking for -- rather than the traditional honeymoon of a week in Paris, or 3 days in Venice plus a wood-beamed villa in a vineyard.