LAtoANYWHERE

So I made a kind of last minute decision last week to go and backpack through Europe for a couple months, starting mid-September 2012. This is my first time backpacking anywhere in the world and I plan to do the majority of the trip alone. The only place I have been to in Europe was Italy about three years ago for just under three weeks, but I saw a lot of it and do not plan to see it this trip as a result. I do not have any major agenda for this trip other than to take in the culture/history of each area visited, eat all the amazing foods, and having a good time all the way through it bringing back memories that will last forever. I am a 29 year old male from Los Angeles, just in case you needed to know.

Since deciding to go I have taken a large list of cities and whittled it down to what I think is a more manageable list and route through Europe. I chose major cities to help me plot the points as I progress through Europe, I plan to take day trips when in the more major cities where possible. Although I was hoping to stick to this route, I am open to suggestion. Here is my itinerary as follows:

September:
***Plan is to depart from LAX on 09/13***
Lisbon, Portugal: 14-17
Madrid, Spain: 17, 18
Barcelona, Spain: 18-21
San Sebastian, Spain/Biarritz, France: 21-24
Marseille, France: 24-26
Cannes/Monaco, France: 26,27
Geneva, Switzerland: 27-29
Interlaken, Switzerland: September 29 - October 2

October:
Munich, Germany: 2-5
Vienna, Austria: 5-7
Krakow, Poland: 7-9
Prague, Czech Republic: 9-11
Stuttgart, Germany (I might change this): 12-14
Cologne, Germany (I might change this): 14,15 (I should have a place to stay while here)
Brussels, Belgium: 15-17
Brugge, Belgium: 17,18
London, UK: 18-22 (I should have a place to stay while here)
Paris, France: 22-25 (I should have a place to stay while here)
Amsterdam, The Netherlands: 25-28
Copenhagen, Denmark: 28-30

November:
Berlin, Germany: October 30 - November 2

***Overlapping days would be travel days***

Questions:
1. Does this look like a reasonable timeline as plotted out?
2. What kind of budget am I looking at for this trip? I did some calculations and I figured $6000-7000 USD for airfare, hostels, food, everything.
3. Should I look into possibly doing part of the trip with Eurail and part with Euroline in order to save some money?
4. Is couchsurfing.com worth checking out? The idea of this is a bit worrisome but, I believe they have a reference/feedback system, which would alleviate some of my worries.

I know the trip may seem a bit rushed, but I don't mind keeping on the move. But, if you think it would be worth staying longer in certain areas I am willing to take this into account and adjust. Any help would be greatly appreciated. I am a novice when it comes to planning out a big trip like this and kind of jumped in head first. I'm sure there are multiple questions that I am overlooking, but I just can't think of them at this time. Thanks!

adrienne

You need to re-do your itinerary to include travel time. Example:

Lisbon, 9/15 - 15
Travel to Madrid - 9/16
Madrid - 9/17 + 1/2 day 9/18
Travel to Barcelona - afternoon of 9/18
Barcelona - 9/19, 9/20

etc.

That will give you a feel for how many days of sightseeing you'll have in each location. You can use the German train web site to see schedules and duration times.

bahn.de

You might also factor in some down time to relax and do laundry and chat with other travelers. You're on the go the entire 2 months.

Deduct your airfare and then divide the balance by 60 to get an average day's money. Check the price of hostel stays - they're generally about E25 per night. Food varies but I would plan on at least $50 per day.

Join the Thorn Tree forum on the Lonely Planet site. They cater to backpackers over there and you will get some good info.

november_moon

I agree - slow it down. 2 months on the go is a long time. There will be days when you need to take care of chores - laundry, go to the drug store, etc. There will be other days when you feel like lazing around - and with 2 months, you have the luxury of some lazy days, so go with it.

$50/day for food should be sufficient - that's about 40 euro. If you economize, you can get by with less than that. You probably won't eat restaurant meals the whole time - picnics, food stalls, gyros and shwarma, etc. will help you save some money.

nytraveler

You are trying to do way too much in too little time.

As noted above you have not allowed any time to get from one place to another - which will take from 1/2 to a full day depending on how you travel. If you are trying to live on a small budget - and stick to slower trains - many of these trips will take a full day - leaving you with only one day in each place.

Now, everyone has their own travel style - but I have been more than 90 times (perhaps 40% business and 60% vacation) since I went at the first time at 19. And IMHE if you really want to see anything you need 3 full days (4 nights) in larger cities and 2 full days (3 nights) in smaller ones. If you want to do day trips from a city then add a day.

What you have will be, honestly, a very time-consuming and expensive tour of the train stations of europe.

I can;t comment on your costs since this isn;t our price point. But my younger D, 19, went with two friends last summer and spent about $8000 in 5 weeks. This did not include shopping (of which she did little) and only student type nightlife (inexpensive wine or beer in a student pub or cafe - since hard liquor is extremely expensive). They did not stay in hostels but quite modest hotels - but in central locations and with AC (in europe many modest places to stay don't have AC).

For more advice on a really tight budget I would look at the Let's Go student guides and the Thorn Tree section of the Lonely Planet web site. And, however, much you plan on spending, make sure you have 50% more sitting in your checking account that you can access if necessary.

janisj

"<i>I know the trip may seem a bit rushed, but I don't mind keeping on the move.</i>"

That is a very common sentiment . . . but there is a difference between going to a lot of places and SEEING lots along the way, and this plan which is more traveling fast and barely seeing anything.

What may make you think you have more time in each city is the way you listed them. Let's look at just October w/the actual days on the ground:

Munich, Germany: 2-4
Vienna, Austria: 5-6
Krakow, Poland: 7-8
Prague, Czech Republic: 9-10
Stuttgart, Germany (I might change this): 11-13
Cologne, Germany (I might change this): 14
Brussels, Belgium: 15-16
Brugge, Belgium: 17
London, UK: 18-21
Paris, France: 22-24
Amsterdam, The Netherlands: 25-27
Copenhagen, Denmark: 28-29

That is <i>crazy making</i>! I'd try to cut at least 1/3 of the destinations (which would still be rushed)

LAtoANYWHERE

Firstly, I just want to thank all of you for all the effort put into your posts. I tried getting help on LP and the first person to respond was a bit of an ass, so I didn't go back.

I am going to take another look at my itinerary right now and see what I am willing to cut out and should have an update tomorrow morning to post. Thanks again.

Cowboy1968

While you can't foresee the weather, I would have started in the north and worked my way south. And followed the nicer weather esp. as you got to the end of October.
Copenhagen looks a bit odd travelwise. And it will probably be one of your priciest stays.
You can't compare the locations on a purely statistical basis. One day in Switzerland or Denmark will buy you two days in Lisbon or Krakow.
If you need to economize, but want to see the Alps, I'd skip Geneva and Interlaken and go from Cannes via Northern Italy/Dolomites/ South Tyrol and Austria to Munich.

oliveroliver

Hey! I agree with other posters that you might want to cut down on the number of places, it's nice to reserve an extra day for every fourth destination, in my opinion, just to relax.

Also, I'm sure you've given the route a thought, but IMO it would be far more economical to complete the route country by country rather than zig-zagging across the region. You can also save a lot more time.

In terms of train passes--Eurail, I find, somewhat forces you to keep the number of days that you stay in any one place down, because you're only allowed so many trips in so many days. If you plan out your itinerary early, buying tickets from the respective rail operators of each country to be much cheaper and you get to cover more destinations, with a reasonable amount of time in each. 3 months in advance is usually the rule--some places to start are SNCF.fr (don't go to the English website, it redirects you to an intermediary which charges you about 20% more compared to what's on offer on the French website, sneaky!), OEBB.at, BAHN.de, etcetera.

Ps. I ran away from LP too Sometimes they snarl and contribute nothing.

adrienne

LA - Please do also socialize your itinerary over at Thorn Tree. I think it will help you. So what if one person is an ass. You'd have to never leave your home not to run into asses. Ignore that person and persevere. You're going off on your own for the first time and need to learn how to shrug off things that bother you and keep going. You'll meet all types on the road (and in life).

Go to the library and pick up a couple of Let's Go guides. They're great - I still use them. Wonderful travel tips about what to do in different situations. Read the introduction, not just the sightseeing parts. The more prepared you are the better your trip.

PalenQ

3. Should I look into possibly doing part of the trip with Eurail and part with Euroline in order to save some money?>

I'd do one or the other to save money but with that far-reaching itinerary I'd strongly look at a 2-month Eurail Global Flexipass - Saverpass if traveling with others - the more days on a pass the cheaper per day they become. I find trains must more relaxing than stuffed full buses that often move thru the night.

Anyways for lots of great info on the fantastic European rail system and passes check out these fantastic IMO sources - www.budgeteuropetravel.com; www.ricksteves.com and www.seat61.com.

Overnight trains do link many cities and you can same time and money in a hotel by using them for long relocations.

ira

Hi LA,

Wouldn't you prefer to start North and head South as the weather gets colder?

adrienne

LOL LA probably doesn't realize there are seasons in other parts of the world!

Definitely work north to south.

PalenQ

"I know the trip may seem a bit rushed, but I don't mind keeping on the move.">

janis calls me daft too but I regularly do trips like this and yes it is a personal taste matter - I too like to keep on the move. Some forget that travel is not just seeing every darn museum and church in each city but travel is also traveling and moving between bases is actually as much fun for me as what I do in those bases.

Ah the voyage - the people watching fellow passengers. Give me more of that and less of fatiguing museums that many say I 'absolutely must see' but which quickly bore me' - each to their own OP and if you feel like moving a lot go for it.

That said I would cut days in Stuttgart and Cologne unless you have family in these rather uninspiring modern cities largely blitzed in WW2 - see the Cologne cathedral IMO and move down to the Rhine Gorge or Mosel Valleys for a few days - eliminating the Stuttgart stop - even if into car museums a day is enough there...for me - I know janis types would not be swatisfied with less than a week but...

jomagpie

I've been part of Couchsurfing since 2005 (female, 30yrs old). Such a great concept. Was in Spain last month, if it weren't for the CS people I met, my memories would be a lot different.

Feel free to email me at [email protected] if you have any questions about it.

Jo

LAtoANYWHERE

Alright so I have taken a little more time to look at my route and I have cut a few places so far, these being: Stuttgart, Cologne, Brugge, and Copenhagen. Stuttgart and Cologne were to meet up with friends, but it's not a big deal for me to cut those stops, especially if I need some more days to account for travel. I would have liked to go to Copenhagen, but as @cowboy1968 pointed out, it is a bit out there off the path.

I found out yesterday that I know a couple other people who will be traveling for a couple weeks through Europe as well while I am there. So I am going to try and work that into my trip as well.

@oliveroliver, I was looking into getting the Eurail Global Flexipass, but if it will be cheaper to try and organize within each country's train system, I will look into that. I know it will take a little more planning, but it has to be done.

@adrienne, I understand one rotten apple doesn't represent the bunch. But, what you are telling me is what I did, I shrugged it off and never went back. You are right though, it never hurts to get more insight.

@PalenQ, yeah I was leaning more towards the Global Flexipass, but it is a bit pricey. Which, is why I was gonna see if there may be a better transportation system I could use. Thanks for the links and info! As I stated above, I did decide to cut the cities you mentioned in your second post in order to add some more travel time. I couldn't have agreed more with your second post as far as the hustle of moving around, people watching, and going to big boring museums where only a small section might be interesting to me.

@ira and @adrienne, come on you think I wouldn't take some foresight to look into the weather? To me, I figured that it would be best to travel South to North because then I could hit up the coastal towns, while still catching the end of summer. I am born and raised in Southern California and I LOVE the beach, which is why I chose to start South. My question to you is, why would it be better to start North and travel South because of weather? I am completely open to reworking my route again, I was just curious. Is it because it gets colder as the year goes on?

Thank you everyone!

adrienne

LA - these are only suggestions. Many people never consider the weather when they plan trips. Many people never consider anything when they book a trip. Some people consider every nit picking thing. We don't know you and you said this is your first time backpacking. Just trying to be helpful.

I would go north to south because I hate hot weather and would never want to be in Portugal in mid September. I would never go to Portugal in October again.

Also October can get rainy and you'll be in the northern cities when the weather starts to turn. Bring rain gear and extra socks.

LAtoANYWHERE

@adrienne, no offense taken by any means on what you had posted earlier and I'm sorry if it seemed like I did take offense in my post. Ah, so that is just your personal preference because you are not a fan of the heat. This is quite the opposite of me, but I also enjoy both extremes of the weather, personally.

But is there any other major benefit to get to N Europe earlier? Besides beating the rain? I am open to switching things around.

I would like to keep myself as prepared as possible, but I know there is no way I will be able to account for every small thing while I am gone. Just trying to be somewhat prepared while still flying by the seat of my pants on the trip.

meadeparsons

My son and 2 friends did a very similar trip last year. They were gone for 4 months.
They used airbnb and stayed in hostels, both with great success. Airbnb may not be right for you as there were 3 of them splitting costs. They stayed in some wonderful hostels.
Two recommended websites are: www.famoushostels.com and www.hostelbookers.com.
They had no problems in any of their hostels and found the reviews spot-on.
Hostels can be quite nice and some even have single rooms if you like. The other thing they liked about hostels is that most of them offer a free city walking tour. Many also have a kitchen and all have laundry facilities.

They did not try couch-surfing but friends of their's did and said never again.

I would reconsider Vienna (they felt it was too pricey for their budgets) and Switzerland (expensive). You might want to consider Croatia.
Tip from my son: Get a sleep sack and take it for hostels beds. All of theirs had clean sheets but it's nice to use. Get a refillable water bottle.
Have a good time!

LAtoANYWHERE

@meadeparsons, thanks for the insight and the links! Haha on the couchsurfing.com tip, yeah I am a bit sketch on it so we will see. From my perusing of the internet I also came across the free walking tours of cities offered by the hostels, which I think is a nice idea.

I was trying to fit Croatia into my plan, but I would have to start there in order to get the good weather. It is still a potential destination, but a big maybe. I was in Hvar a few years ago when I went to Italy and it was absolutely beautiful and would love to see more of the country.

Curious, do you know how much your son and his friends budgeted for the entire trip, sans airfare? Did they get the Eurail Global Flexipass or figure it out on the fly? Thanks for the tip on the sleep sack and the water bottle.

adrienne

I think hostels are good since you'll meet other travelers in your age group. You might connect with some people to travel with for a few days, share stories, travel tips, a meal, etc.

There is no advantage of north to south or south to north except the weather. In some places things shut down or have limited schedules (such a ferries) but this doesn't apply to your itinerary. It can rain anytime. I went to Poland last fall (end of September, beginning of October) and the weather was wonderful, although cold at night but no rain. After the first week in October things were rainy for the last few days of my trip but not huge storm - just drizzles off and on. As a California boy you should be prepared for damp weather that makes it seem colder than it is and plan your wardrobe accordingly with clothes you can layer. Perhaps gloves and a neck scarf.