Dayle

Hi Fodorites,

I am finally adventuring somewhere other than bella Italia and I would love some advice. I feel a bit out of my comfort zone as far as distances and transportation modes go!

Rough plan:
Into Amsterdam, early am arrival
4 or 5 nts Amsterdam - see Van Gogh & Rijksmuseum (SP?), wander city, canal boat tour, Haarlem and windmills park

train to Cologne - brief sight see cathedral and pick up rental car

drive to Mosel River area
3 nts stay Beilstein - visit Burg Eltz, Cochem, bike, cruise

drive to Bacharach - 2 nts, see a bit of the Rhine

drive thru Black Forrest, stay? 1 nt

drive to Fussen / Reutte - visit castles 3 nts?

fly home from Munich or Frankfurt? Drop car at airport.

How/where to fit in Rothenburg?

Is this a reasonable plan? Some castles, some wine tasting, some churches, hiking, biking. No interest in Baden Baden although people say it's beautiful. Am I missing something?

Thanks so much for your advice!

Aramis

Given your other interests, if you want to fit in Rothenburg, skip the one day drive through the BF and head straight to Rothenburg from Bacharach.

Bacharach to Freudenstadt (BF) is 3 hours and Freudenstadt to Fussen is another 3 hours.

Bacharach to Rothenburg is 2.5 and Rothenburg to Fussen is 2:15.

If your main purpose for going to Fussen is to see the castles, you will not "need" 3 days. If you drop one of those and don't do the BF, then you have 2 nights for Rothenburg

Amsterdam 5
Beilstein 3
Bacharach 2
Rothenburg 2
Fussen 2


It's about 2 hours from either Fussen or Rothenburg to the Munich airport so you might consider one night in Fussen and then spending most of the next day there or elsewhere in the Bavarian Alps before driving late to a Munich airport area hotel.

Russ

"Am I missing something?"

Of course. You are circumnavigating southern Germany and mostly targeting only those destinations that are major stops for international tourists, the places with lots of space on the pages of glossy travel brochures. You're skipping everything else. I'd suggest SOME of that, but not ALL of that. Have some cake with your frosting.

"I feel a bit out of my comfort zone as far as distances and transportation modes go!"

That's understandable since you are racking up so many miles in a short period of time.

"Some castles, some wine tasting, some churches, hiking, biking."

You could do all of that just across the border from the Netherlands.

Outstanding churches: Aachen, Cologne, Mainz, Worms, Speyer
Biking: Rhine Valley, Mosel Valley, Nahe Valley (which meets the Rhine in Bingen.)
Hiking: Rheinsteig and Rheinburgenweg trails
Biking: The Mosel is tops.
Wine: Rhine and Mosel villages
Castles: Burg Eltz (nr. Moselkern), Marksburg (Braubach nr. Koblenz on the Rhine), Rheinfels (St. Goar on the Rhine)

You can find similar experiences in the smaller towns of northern Bavaria (Franconia) north of Rothenburg:

Wine villages Sommerhausen, Ochsenfurt, Marktbreit on the Main River: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VLUgpoQIFHI

And not far from the tourist horde in Rothenburg is Iphofen, a very desirable alternative:

http://www.stadtbild-deutschland.org...&threadID=2985

(The Füssen "castles" are really late-19th century palaces, not castles.)

9 days split between the Rhine/Mosel and Franconia would reduce your travel to a more manageable level and offer more feet-on-the-ground exposure to Germany (without as much heavy-handed tourism.)

Dayle

Aramis, Thanks for the approx drive times. It does help put things in perspective. I do love mountains (live in the Rocky Mtns), but not feeling a real need to do theBlack Forest so if it doesn't fit with this trip easily maybe I will skip it.

Russ I appreciate the suggestions for towns /sites lesser known to a first timer. I thinkthe first visit to any country can lean toward the better known places. Thenyou discover areas you would like to visit in the future. I do love to find less touristed places so I will research some of your suggestions.

This will probably be my only visit to Germany so I may cover more distance than recommended. Still working on priorities!

Any recommendations for wineries? How do you visit for tasting in Germany? Advance appointments or are some wineries open on a regular basis?

Thank you in advance

hetismij2

If you are staying in Beilstein then there are wineries right in the village. Along the Rhine I have also seen places just open for a tasting, though they do expect you to buy.
However since you are driving, and driving solo, it might not be a good idea to visit too many. Drink driving laws are strict and the blood alcohol limit is low.

I hope you have a lovely holiday. It seems to me you have allowed plenty of time to explore the areas you want to see.

Aramis

Solo?

Dayle; Rocky Mountain born and raised myself, but I think I'm on the other side of the border from you.

Enjoy your vacation even though some may feel you are "racking up so many miles" amongst the "tourist hordes".

Aramis

Here is a link to some of the major wine producers in the Upper Middle Rhine;


http://www.welterbe-mittelrheintal.d....php?id=43&L=3

The tourist office in Bacharach will be able to answer any of your scheduleing questions by email

[email protected]

Dayle

Aramis,

Thanks so much for the great links. They look very helpful and I will take some time with them!

My comment about "missing something" was in regard to Baden Baden, rather than my itinerary. Of course I missing much, most of the country, but it would take weeks and weeks to see most of Germany so I just have to choose what is most interesting to me - like most visitors from outside the EU.

hetismij2, thanks for the warning. I'm not a big drinker, I really do "taste" so I should be OK! I think one of the difficulties I will run into in Germany is that I don't care for beer! That could be a little hard to explain.....

I have heard of Iphofen near Rothenburg. It does look like a great alternative so will seriously consider staying there instead. Would it still be worthwhile to visit Rothenburg for a 1/2 day or just skip?

I'm thinking 3 nts in the Fussen area because I want to also take the tram up the Zugspitz.

Thanks for everyone's input, I feel like this is shaping up a bit now.

Please keep the comments and recommendations coming!

bilboburgler

Do not miss out the Kroller Muller museum and park.

The Mosel has bikes baths, trains and boats. I'd combo them, generally biking West to East is easier, there is also a high level walkway along much of the Mosel which is a fun way of seeing the area and "droping in" on vinyards.

http://www.mybikeguide.co.uk/Mosel_Guide.php for the bike riding etc, also some stuff on German wine tasting, but no link to the wine festivals website. The best is http://www.germany.travel/en/towns-c...festivals.html

Wine tasting
1) Go to festivals, rent a glass and buy as you go, wine tends to be the cheaper stuff. The biggest is in Bad Durkheim and runs 9am to 2 am for 2 weeks.
2) Go knock on a door (check with tourist info first), normally a small charge
3) Go to an ordinary bar and drink by the glass, check the older wines as they will be either lower priced or just the same as the young stuff
4) Go to the Straw-Bars (sorry forgotten the german name) lots in Mosel where the bar is run for a month by a local farmer with his wine, pay below bar prices and eat his food

Issues you will run into, grape variety tends towards the riesliing, pinot Gris, pinot blanc and then declines into the Mullar-Thurgau and Silvaner, trust the locals they often get the best out of some pretty manky grapes. You may also get wine that is still fermenting, which is sweet, cloudy and fizzy great fun with onion tart. Do look out for the sweety wines (wiki covers this well) and I find you want at least and Auslese or Spatlese quality level and dry to off dry to get a very high quality glass.

Mars123

If it's not on your radar, once you leave Cologne you could stop in Brühl and visit the Augustusburg and Falkenlust palaces before continuing onto the Mosel.

Dayle

Bilbo (I've always loved your name by the way!),

What great suggestions! This sounds really fun. The German wines do not lean toward my preferance (BIG reds), but I should find some to enjoy The Straw Bars sound great.

Mars, thanks. I will check those! So many things to see, so little time....

bilboburgler

Straußwirtschaft, was driving me crazy. Ohttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strausse

Big reds no-go in Germany though there are areas that claim light reds.

I grew up as a Bobo so only a little "l" was needed

Dayle

Topping for more input on my long interruped visit ......

This was the original plan, but I am leaning toward a little more time in NE and just visiting The Mosel, a bit of the Rhine and maybe.a couple of towns mentioned avove.

Will save the more southern part ps for a future trip of Austria Switzerland and Germany.