loveners

Hi Fodorites

I'm new to using the TrenItalia website and wanted to make sure I've got this right. I'm getting odd results and am not sure if it's me or that the timetable is genuinely a little odd.

Travel date 22 May
Depart: Lucca
Arrive: Manarola
Service: le frecce plus short regional train connection.

I can find departure times for:

6.17am
7.42am
3.30pm
3.59pm
9.30pm

But nothing in the sociable morning travel times. Ideally I was looking for a departure between 10am & 11.30am.

Is it me doing something wrong?

Also- does anyone know how many days in advance the mini fares display? I had read 120 days but that doesn't seem to be the case here.

Thanks for any help you can offer. Have a great day.

Loveners
(103 days to go...)

annhig

hi, loveners,

I think that you are putting in a date that is too far ahead. I tried 22/2/12 and 22/3/12, and got departures for 10.30, 13.30, and 14.30, with some Frecchiabianca trains on part of the route.

I wouldn't worry too much about mini-fares - the first class was only €18.

so don't panic!

ellenem

In any case, you should NOT buy your ticket for the regional train online because the refund policies for online purchases are very limited. Since regional train tickets do not have reserved seats nor discounts, just buy that ticket when you arrive in Italy.

kybourbon

>>>Service: le frecce plus short regional train connection.<<<

You need to use the regular Trenitalia link, not the Le Frecce link which only shows faster trains.
http://www.trenitalia.com/cms/v/inde...0080a3e90aRCRD

>>>Also- does anyone know how many days in advance the mini fares display?<<<

Mini fares don't exist for the slow R trains which you will have to take so likely won't show in a search as only a few fast trains on one part of your trip (you have to connect at Pisa/Viareggio/LaSpezia). I wouldn't book these tickets online. The only advantage would be a small discount for the Frecciabianca train. You would have to enter that portion of your itinerary separate on Trenitalia to be able to a select mini fare.

If you want all prices to show, enter a date within the next 7 days.

franco

The trains you were missing will be running at 8.42, 10.42, 1.30, and 1.59. It's not your fault, though; you're simply using the wrong website. The Trenitalia website, that is, which is an Italian website of course, and well, how to say it politely? Italy has given the world many wonderful things, Renaissance, baroque, opera, pasta, gelato, to name but a few... but the internet is certainly not among them. Italians are this planet's worst internet illiterates, and such is the quality of the Trenitalia website: it doesn't work, very simply.
When I need timetables for Italian trains, I use the website of the Austrian railway, www.oebb.at (available also in English). You can do research on every European train there, on a perfectly working website.

kybourbon

Trenitalia pulls up the same schedules for me as oebb. I don't think it's that Trenitalia wasn't working, I think the OP was using the Le Frecce link on Trenitalia.

franco

I believe you, kybourbon, though I can't imagine how you worked this miracle. These are the Trenitalia non-results: http://orario.trenitalia.com/b2c/npp...g_r=1&x=0&y=0;
and these the ÖBB results: http://fahrplan.oebb.at/bin/query.ex...fasScrollDir=2

A_Brit_In_Ischia

>>> and these the ÖBB results:

Dear customer,
your search results could not be stored internally. Please start a new search by clicking here.

Thank you.
.................................................. ...............................

Perhaps I can offer a more helpful view?

The last date for which Trenitalia have issued full details on that route is Sunday 6 May 2012 - which is slightly less "time ahead" than their maximum 4 month 'sales window' ever gets...

And here's what their two systems show for that SUNDAY - using the ordinary portal:
http://www.pbase.com/isolaverde/imag...34630/original

.... and the new all-singing, all dancing Le Frecce version:
http://www.pbase.com/isolaverde/imag...34629/original

Fetch your own 6 year old to check the second one if necessary, but it does appear to include Regional trains - even if they do only seem interested in selling tickets on journeys that also include a faster one - if one can judge by what's shown for the 13:42?

But May 6th sounds right for the date when Trenitalia will switch to their summer schedules - details of which generally leak out in stages.... first those for the fastest trains, with slower ones being slotted in around them!

So trust to an Austrian crystal ball reader if you will - I'm sure they would follow up and notify each and every customer if the times of post-7 May trains for which they'd bought 12 Euro tickets did eventually turn out to be different, aren't you?

Or perhaps wait, like the rest of us!

Peter

PS: For those able to use the Italian version of place names, this is now likely to be the easier place to research many - if not most - journeys, and could be worth bookmarking?

http://www.fsitaliane.it/cms/v/index...003f16f90aRCRD

franco

I'm sorry the results could not be displayed that way - when I checked before posting, they were still stored (presumably thanks to a temporary cookie, I didn't realize that). However, if you enter Lucca, Manarola, May 22nd and 9:00, you'll get the same results that I got; and Peter, now do the same search for one month later, June 22nd: you'll get the result that schedules have not yet been published. If, instead, you click on the single connections of the May result, you'll see for each train when Trenitalia is REALLY switching to the their summer schedule: in mid-June, not May (the Austrian website gives, for each train, which days exactly and in which period it's running; for instance, the 10.42 train, "runs not every day; runs 23. Jan until 8. Jun 2012 Mo - Fr; not 9., 25. Apr 2012, 1. May 2012"). In fact, the Trenitalia winter schedule is valid through June 12th; cf. (this time, the link will hopefully work) http://www.trenitalia.com/cms/v/inde...004016f90aRCRD, for those who read Italian.
That the Trenitalia website doesn't show any results for May is thus, precisely as I said, just a programmation problem, has absolutely nothing to do with summer or winter schedules, and bad advice like "May 6th sounds right for the date when Trenitalia will switch to their summer schedules" isn't improved the slightest bit by snide remarks like "Austrian crystal ball reader". Offering mere guesses like "May 6th seems right" instead of informations, that's what I call crystal ball reading.

Viajero2

...and WHY in God's name are you buying Italian rails tickets online? :-?

I don't get why people get so anxious about buying Italian trains tickets in advance when all it takes is getting to the station early enough to stand in line. Considering the many risk factors such as frequency of strikes, bad weather, change of plans, lost tickets, etc.... I think buying tickets in adavance is such an exercise in futility.

tarquin

I also don't understand the compulsion to buy tickets in advance, what if your plans change? There is no need to even stand in line, just use one of the automatic ticket machines in the front area of every train station. Click the Union Jack design ball for the English language option.

GAC

The primary reason to purchase Trenitalia for the FAST trains (Freccias, Intercity) in advance is to get one of the deep "MINI" fare discounts (which can yield discounts of UP TO 70% off the "base" fare). (There are no "MINI" fares for the unreserved regionale trains).

However, the "MINI" fares carry significant restrictions and penalties for changes or refunds.

Otherwise, there is USUALLY little reason to buy in advance (apart from convenience, which can turn into more trouble if one's travel plans change). It's usually best NOT to buy in advance, if one's travel plans are "fluid" OR if one is not interested in locking in one of the discounted "MINI" fares.

Bear in mind that fast trains run HOURLY or better on many popular routes such as Rome/Florence/Venice; Rome/Naples; Rome/Florence/Milan; and Milan/Verona/Venice. Between Rome/Florence/Bologna, trains run every 15-60 minutes apart.

There are indeed some days throughout the year when it's necessary/advisable to book in advance (around Christmas and New Year's, Easter, popular three-day weekends, some days in summer etc.), but ordinarily, advance bookings are not necessary (leaving aside the issue of getting a discounted "MINI" fare).

Many saavy travellers prefer the flexibility of not booking in advance. (Others prefer to save as much money as possible with the "MINI" fares).

kybourbon

>>>and WHY in God's name are you buying Italian rails tickets online?<<<<

To save half the cost although I wouldn't buy the OP's itinerary online. It really saves money on the AV trains and international trains.

>>>I don't get why people get so anxious about buying Italian trains tickets in advance when all it takes is getting to the station early enough to stand in line.<<<

I think people from countries where train travel isn't common are afraid the trains will be booked.

A_Brit_In_Ischia

It is indeed not until mid-June that the timetables change, and - living here - I have no excuse for not remembering that.

Still, for all of Austria's wonders, the OBB site seems reluctant to do the deal...

http://www.pbase.com/isolaverde/image/141038878

... unless one uses their no-language-choice 'ticket by email' option...

http://www.pbase.com/isolaverde/image/141038878

... but as that's beyond my grammar school German, I'll be sticking with Trenitalia's offerings - for both enquiries and purchases.

A question though, just what does "programmation" mean?

Peter

annhig

programmation = "software glitch or bug" i think.

i wish my italian were as good as franco's english!

loveners

Hi Everyone, thanks for all the help. We're traveling with our parents and have a fixed itinerary where we do know where we need to be going on certain dates.

I'm trying my best to make their respective pensions go as far as possible so was keen to snag some mini fares for them.

Am I missing something here? why wouldn't you book a mini fare if you knew May 22nd was your travel day to get from Lucca to Manarola and that your group would be generally leaving lodgings about 10am?? Please tell me if I'm missing something

Thanks again for your help.

loveners

Peter, can I ask how you knew that that the last day timetables was showing was for the 6th May?

Was it by just randomly trying dates until you ran out of timetables or is there a trick I'm missing here?

Zerlina

Because the regular fare for the only part you can buy a Mini fare for is only 10.50 Euro and your grand saving is only 1.50 Euro if you were taking it on May 6 (which you aren't). If your Lucca-Viareggio train is sufficiently late (not likely but possible) that you miss the connection, your ticket is null and void and you get no refund. Very occasionally, a Trenitalia employee can be persuaded to endorse the ticket for a later train, but do you want the hassle of trying to find and convince him/her?

annhig

ie you aren't saving enough to make it worthwhile running the risk of missing the train and thereby forfeiting the whole lot.

things that could stop you getting the train - traffic, the aged parents feeling a bit crook, you ditto, getting the platform wrong, a strike, someone forgetting something...

if the savings were huge it might be worth doing, but for €1.50?

GAC

Please note that connections FROM an unreserved regionale train (e.g. Lucca to Viareggio), TO a fast train (e.g. Freccia from Viareggio to La Spezia), where you hold a "MINI" fare ticket on the fast train, are EXTREMELY RISKY, because if you MISS the fast train (for which you hold the "MINI" fare ticket), you FORFEIT that ticket. Trenitalia staff do not have to accommodate you in this case (they MIGHT do so, but are NOT required). I confirmed this information in person with two different Trenitalia customer care agents. Even if you hold a "base" fare ticket for the SECOND train (and you MISS it because of a tardy arrival of the regionale train), you technically FORFEIT the "base" fare ticket if you MISS the fast train by more than one hour (here, the Trenitalia staff MIGHT be more inclined to accommodate you, since you hold a regular-fare ticket rather than a "MINI" fare ticket). This too was confirmed to me on the ground.

Bottom line ..... it's VERY risky to buy a "MINI" fare ticket when CONNECTING FROM an unreserved regionale train. Better not to do it.

What if you're connecting FROM another Trenitalia FAST train (TO a second Trenitalia FAST train with the "MINI" fare ticket), and have at least a 15-minute connection??? That's another story ..... but not your case.