bsuzan

Traveling mid-June. Flying into Cologne as a semi-central point and renting a car so need to end up where we started to return it and then visiting family in Dublin/Cork for a week afterward before returning to the U.S. I'm traveling with my husband (we're healthy, early 50's and energetic 10 y.o. daughter. Looking for a reasonable itinerary for the time and planning on Amsterdam and other stops in Netherlands possibly Bruges, northern France, Luxembourg, back to Cologne. Trying to see some diverse sights without taking on too much. Avoiding Brussels for security reasons. Looking for suggestions on a route, and hoping to keep the costs down, spending money where it's worth it.
Have been to the major european cities but first time for daughter to Europe.

Fussgaenger

"Looking for a reasonable itinerary for the time and planning on Amsterdam and other stops in Netherlands possibly Bruges, northern France, Luxembourg, back to Cologne."

This sounds like way too much moving around in places where there's way too much to see - in 8 days anyway. Day 1 will be adjustment after your flight (best not to drive.) Suggest you look into a tighter loop. What I suggest here also will be too much - you'll have to pick and choose.

From Cologne, "castle country" is just a short journey to the south:

http://www.welterbe-mittelrheintal.d...php?id=288&L=3

Then consider a visit to Trier (ancient Roman city) and the Mosel River on the way to Luxembourg:

Trier: http://www.trier-info.de/english/une...heritage-sites

Cochem: http://reisezieledeutschland.de/wp-c...b-Schiff-1.jpg

Bernkastel: http://en.bernkastel.de/fileadmin/_m...brunnen_02.JPG

Besides Luxembourg City, the Ardennes mountains in Luxembourg and Belgium have attractive towns, WW II sites, and good scenery.

Maastricht and Antwerp offer a nice look at Belgium and the Netherlands without too much travel time; Amsterdam? it's no place for a car. If you must go there, I would consider dropping the car in Germany (you don't have to return to Cologne - any German location works) and leave from there for Ireland.

bilboburgler

Fussgaenger nailed it, you need to be choosy. Trier and the Mosel is/are one of my favorite places in the world. Along the river there are bike paths and bike hire places, lots of steep river banks to climb, a castle or two, swimming pools, the odd kids "fake disney", summer luge etc etc.

Amsterdam is no place for a car (doubled).

bsuzan

We are flying out of Cologne airport so need to return there. Some good suggestions. Any favorites in Netherlands to visit? We could stay outside of Amsterdam and take mass transit into town to avoid problems with having a car. suggestions?

Whathello

Avoid Bruges too for security reasons, as it is also in Belgium.

Northern France has many links with Belgium and terrorists seem to have acquaintances on both sides of the border.

Cologne was considered a hellhole too with hordes of migrants raping thousands of women early this year.

Luxembourg maybe. Until IS realizes it is full of banks and want to blow up some.

bsuzan

Security issues are a concern. Considering back up routes e.g. Cologne -Prague-Berlin or perhaps south to Switzerland.

annhig

bsuzan - Whathello had his tongue in his cheek somewhat then- I think he is suggesting that as no-one knows where ISIS is going to try to strike next it's pretty pointless to plan your trip trying to avoid places they have already been.

going to Prague and/or Switzerland will take you even further away from Cologne than your current itinerary.

A better plan would have been to fly into Cologne and out of somewhere else but as you are already committed, Fussgaenger has some great ideas. and Germany is generally pretty reasonably priced so your money should go further there than some other places; Switzerland can be particularly expensive.

Whathello

Hi Annhig

I'm not interested in helping this particular OP.

The remark 'en passant' about security is so devoid of empathy that I have zero sympathy for OP.

He/she can go to antartica for all I care. Angry me ?
What about ?

annhig

Whathello - of course it may be that the OP simply failed to express herself very well, but I can understand some of your feelings. I was in London after some of the IRA bombs [including the one at the Old Bailey] and knew a barrister who had been badly injured [and permanently scarred] in the explosion. Though the bombing was a few years before I started, the daily searches, the constant vigilance, and the regular sight of my colleague made a big impression upon me.

Since that of course we've had many bombings and other incidents to deal with, and it never seems to get any easier, though with time the anger fades, at least for those of us not directly affected.

I sincerely hope that the people of Brussels are spared a repetition of these dreadful events and that your police manage to get a better handle on the problem.

Bon chance, mon ami!

Whathello

Merci Annhig !

bilboburgler

My favorite in the whole of the Netherlands are

Kroller-Muller museum and park

Zeeland, the whole islands area and the little towns of middlebourg and Vera, both way off the tourist trap route, maybe not for you and certainly hard to get to without a car. But you asked.


Bsuzan, I'll be on the continent at least 2 times this year with no worries about being hurt by Daesh. You are more likely to be hit by a car than hit by a bomb.

Guys, visitors to Europe have the right to have concerns (our job must be to put this sort of think in perspective (there is very little violence in Europe, which is why it hits the headlines and is being exploited at the moment by the Trump/FOX band wagon).

However, as we have just seen the poor Brit who died in Brussels managed to dodge the bomb at check-in only to get onto the train that blew up.

So having a dodging strategy can be wrong.

If you get involved in these things, "run, hide, tell"

If you don't then just carry on. Europe is great to visit.

Whathello, I've not taken the time to say how sorry I was at the Brussels bombing. As Ann says.

Whathello

thks Bilbo.

Fussgaenger

"Guys, visitors to Europe have the right to have concerns (our job must be to put this sort of think in perspective..."

First off, concerns about one's personal safety are no indication of disregard for the safety of European residents!

2.) Of course visitors have the right to think about their own safety. Why should questions like this upset anyone?

3.) The number of violent incidents is relatively small in Europe now but on the rise. Security agencies with vast amounts of intelligence cannot predict when or where attacks will occur and cannot accurately assess the danger in this place or the other. Fodorites are far less competent. It's delusional for us to weigh in authoritatively on the dangers they will face on future visits. We are only tossing out observations and feelings.

I would rank any safety feedback you get here as very low quality information by virtue of its source, bsuzan. You are your own best authority when it comes to travel risk assessment.

Aramis

>>>>>Whathello on Mar 26, 16 at 5:49pm
>>>>>Avoid Bruges too for security reasons, as it is also in Belgium.
>>>>>Northern France has many links with Belgium and terrorists seem to have >>>>>acquaintances on both sides of the border.
>>>>>Cologne was considered a hellhole too with hordes of migrants raping
>>>>>thousands of women early this year.
>>>>>Luxembourg maybe. Until IS realizes it is full of banks and want to blow up some.


>>>>>Whathello on Mar 26, 16 at 7:45pm
>>>>>Hi Annhig
>>>>>I'm not interested in helping this particular OP.
>>>>>The remark 'en passant' about security is so devoid of empathy that I have
>>>>>zero sympathy for OP.
>>>>>He/she can go to antartica for all I care. Angry me ?
>>>>>What about ?

Yeah, angry you.
Make sure you take it out on innocent travelers.

Whathello

one stone - two birds.

bsuzan

Thanks all -I went to Europe right after the 9/11 bombings so I understand that we can't stop living due to the threat of terrorist attack. Having my child with me makes me more cautious though. We aren't booking too many hotels ahead of time so we will be able to modify our itinerary as needed/desired.

bsuzan

bilboburgler can you tell me more about Middelburg?

bilboburgler

Middelburg, has a medievel centre and the famous town hall aquibuisers hall etc, I think they may even have the only remaining ram-ship in the canal "the Unicorn". The fortification canals are still in place.

So the place is rather like they have just rebuilt it after the Spanish left

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Middelburg

Many of the little towns around have canal fortifications but these are the best that were not destroyed by the floods of the 1950s

bsuzan

We've decided to head south instead for a more focused trip:
Cologne down the Rhine river (Koblenz) to Luxembourg city
Verdun/Nancy
Colmar to Basel
possibly interlaken
black forest Germany back to Cologne

Anyone know of a vegetarian or pastry cooking school along the way to try?

Recommended budget places to stay? I've learned that hotels here charge for each person so we're having to pay for my 10 yo daughter as well vs. kids are free in the US.

bilboburgler

good looking trip, I'll do similar this autumn, German smaller towns tend to have good deals, while city prices get high. So on the Mosel prices will vary all over the place, area is generally struggling with tourists going abroad so plenty of cheaper hotels in this area and B&Bs all good prices. TA or Bookings not bad but smaller villages you'll find the local tourist info will organise deals on walking hostels which are normally very clean and fun (not at all the big city type) in old buildings. For example,
https://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/Hotel_...alatinate.html

France look out for B&B which normally will be a cheap small hotel or some of the cheaper chains, Ibis, Ptit Dej (or however they spell it now) http://en.ptitdej-hotel.com/ and there are others can be very good deals, but check trip advisor to ensure the hotel is not next to a oil refinery etc. If using google maps to track things down remember that hotels in france can be called hotel, B&B, hostelerie, auberge etc (it's like a foreign language )

http://vegucation.eu/about-vegucation/about-us/ may help but may be too commercially based