jenwo

I'm trying to pick a safari for a group of 8 adults and can't decide between Sabi Sands and Kruger. Do any of you have any experience with one versus the other? Any advice would be appreciated.

cary999

First, so we know where we are coming from, have you or any of the eight ever been to Africa and/or on a safari?

Kruger is a South Africa National Park. Sabi Sand is all privately owned land that borders Kruger. Here's a simple map showing that relationship. Note that not all of Kruger is shown. Kruger is huge. http://tinyurl.com/2dvbs2

I've been to both Kruger and Sabi Sand camps several times. I love them both. At Kruger you basically drive yourself around the Park. At a private Sabi Sand camp you are "escorted" around for wildlife viewing in a totally open Range Rover type vehicle.

Bottom line is rather like, if you can afford $700 per day per person, go to Sabi Sand. If $150 per day per person sounds better, go to Kruger.

regards - tom

divine54

jenwo
it's all depending on your (all) expectations and whether you like to SEARCH for the animals yourself AND do some research and reading on animals, animal behaviour etc. .
the latter information will be provided by your guide if you chose a lodge in sabi sands.

regarding price tag:
it's not a necessity to pay 700 $pppd if you opt for sabi sands.
you can pay 700+++$ but you don't have to!

if the private sabi sands concession seems to be your cup of tea but 700$ sounds too much you might have a look at the following websites

http://www.elephantplains.co.za/home/

http://sabi.krugerpark.co.za/

http://www.sabisandslodges.co.za/Map.asp

the following links take you to the krueger park camps and lodges

http://www.sanparks.org/parks/kruger/

http://www.krugerpark-direct.com/

if you are a safari novice i would highly recommend you go for the private concession. here you get loads of information and also education. for the first time i would say it takes you smoothly to the "bush" without missing anything due to limited knowledge on environment, animals and their behaviour etc.

happy planning!

div

jenwo

thanks cary999 and divine54 for your responses. Of the 8 of us, 3 have been on safari (but very short, basic ones when we were just out of college and had no money

We are definitely not experienced safari people so being escorted sounds like the way to go. Granted, we can't afford $700 pppd, but, we're willing to pay for a good experience. I will check out the links you sent me. Thanks. And if you can think of any other helpful tips, it would be really appreciated.

jenwo

cary999

I agree, a private camp is the "nicest" way to safari. You are very well looked after and you will see the most wildlife there (compared to Kruger).

You might also consider the Timbavati Reserve. Also bordering Kruger and about 10 miles north of Sabi Sand. (On same map above). The private camps there are less $$$ than most in Sabi Sand. I have been to one camp there, Kings Camp and in fact will be there come Sep 4 for 8 nights. This will be my third time at KC (I like it). After KC I'm going next door to Ngala camp which is a new one for me.

Now is not to early to start looking at making reservations for any of these camps for even a year away.

regards - tom

lifelist

Your costs will also depend on when you go. For example, I was in the Sabi Sands at Exeter River Lodge in July which is low season (winter) in South Africa. I paid around $350 per person per night which is still a lot of money, but a lot more reasonable than $700 a night, and I had a great time.

aowens

Also worth considering - off-roading. You cannot drive off the road in Kruger, but you can in the private reserves of the Sabi Sand. This is a huge consideration for me. I want to be able to drive off road to see the game that may be further away. Just so you are aware.

divine54

jenwo


1 January - 30 April / 1 September - 31 December (summer rates)

* R 1460.00 per adult sharing
* R 1660.00 per single adult
* R 730.00 per child under 12

1 May - 31 August (winter special)

* R 1160.00 per adult sharing
* R 1360.00 per single adult
* R 580.00 per child under 12

this give you an idea on how much elephant plains charges you in 2008.

based on the fact that they offer great value for money they are heavily booked at any time of year.
one friend spent a couple of days there in july and another is leaving end of aug and stays there for 13 nts. both booked in nov 07!

and you need quite a number of rooms.............

let's say you fly in to OR tambo intl. you can get a transver from joburg to sabi sands for approx. 3000 ZAR which is quite a deal when you share between 8 pax.

ADVISE....what are you looking for?
specifics please.

it would be good to have your interests, expectations and budget.
then i am sure you get loads of tips and information.

div

jenwo

thanks div!! okay, so let's see. My group is coming to SA for two weeks. We're starting in Cape Town for one week (to see a couple of World Cup games) and then doing the wine country for a couple of days before heading off on safari. We figure that the safari will be the highlight of our trip and are willing to pay for that (within reason of course). To be honest, I am just starting to research the safaris (my portion of the trip to plan) so I don't know what a normal budget would be. Is a "cheap" safari $150 a night or $300?? We are looking for luxury, but not best of the best. Depending on what's included, I'd say approx $400 per night would be okay if it included everything. We also want a very authentic experience, so I'm looking for a place where the decor is african and has that safari feel to it (I do like the rustic "Ralph Lauren" look

What we're expecting from the safari would be to go on multiple game drives per day and see all the big animals, but also have a place that provides a great sundowner, good food and drink at meals, and a nice atmosphere to hang out at night. Since we'll be there during winter (June) the pool isn't important, but I'd love a place with a great viewing deck to sit and have cocktails.

You mention the flight being split between all 8 of us. I've noticed a few websites (like Elephant Plains) stating that the flight is about R4000. Is that per person or to charter a plane? How does that work?

Also, the websites mention costs for a guide. Do you have to hire a guide to take on safari? Isn't that what the lodges provide on the game drives?

Thanks again for all of your help. It is really appreciated!!!
jenwo

divine54

hi jenwo,

thanks div!!
PLEASURE!

okay, so let's see. My group is coming to SA for two weeks. We're starting in Cape Town for one week (to see a couple of World Cup games)

in between sporting you should try to get/do
- table mountain as soon as there is no tablecloth on it! don't postpone. jump on it as soon as it's clear!
- robben island where nelson mandela (madiba) was trapped for 27 years. book in advance!
- cape point
- enjoy the waterfront and/or camps bay's nice cafés in te afternoon
- eat fish in the waterfront at BAIA for dinner
- walk long street to get some cape town flair


and then doing the wine country for a couple of days before heading off on safari.

1 week cape town and a couple of days winelands means 4 days/nts safari which is not too bad. but you should spend it in ONE lodge! don't do lodge-hopping! waste of time as far as i see it!

We figure that the safari will be the highlight of our trip and are willing to pay for that (within reason of course). To be honest, I am just starting to research the safaris (my portion of the trip to plan) so I don't know what a normal budget would be. Is a "cheap" safari $150 a night or $300??

i would not say CHEAP! i would never spend my holiday money for cheap things ;-) favourable and good value for money is a MUST!
you want figures? okay let's get to the facts:
as mentioned before elephant plains is the BEST you can get for that money. FAVOURABLE and excellent value but not cheap!
it's favourable because they e.g. put up to 9 people in the vehicle which is a disadvantage for keen wildlife photographers! these people rent there a car for sole use and pay 3000ZAR per day for that.
but in your case it's not so much a disadvantage as your group packs a car for itself!
EP is especially great in view to leopard sightings - as is sabi sands in general. it's the reserves selling point!

so EP means approx. 200US$ per pay per day.

just check out the other lodges.

i can also highly recommend:
sabi sabi
lion sands
mala mala
but the pricatag at these lodges is at least double!
the rooms are more luxurious at lion and sabi. the food might be more fancy. but the wildlife is almost the same as they are all in one reserve with no fences to krueger. so the wildlife roames freely back and forth.

EP's concession is the smallest within sabi sands but for your length of stay sufficient. all lodges (except mala mala) allow the others to follow briefly if a leopard travels from one concenssion to the next in order to satisfy the guests. it's a kind of give and take.



We are looking for luxury, but not best of the best. Depending on what's included, I'd say approx $400 per night would be okay if it included everything.

oops - now that i have put so much effort in to getting you convinced about EP i change to another recommendation as you mention 400$pppd.
for that money i would definately spent my days and nts at sabi sabi bush lodge!
http://www.sabisabi.com/lodges/bushl...E6E2C0F061B58A

absolutely stunning chalets. spacious, shiny tiled floors, spacious lounge, bathrooms you can dance in, great location, great game drives, great guides, great food and great company!
there your group would be perfectly fitting in!


We also want a very authentic experience, so I'm looking for a place where the decor is african and has that safari feel to it (I do like the rustic "Ralph Lauren" look

i have these wishes incorporated into my thoughts when i came up with sabi sabi bush lodge!

What we're expecting from the safari would be to go on multiple game drives per day and see all the big animals, but also have a place that provides a great sundowner, good food and drink at meals, and a nice atmosphere to hang out at night. Since we'll be there during winter (June) the pool isn't important, but I'd love a place with a great viewing deck to sit and have cocktails.

SABI SABI BUSH!

You mention the flight being split between all 8 of us. I've noticed a few websites (like Elephant Plains) stating that the flight is about R4000. Is that per person or to charter a plane? How does that work?

NOT THE FLIGHT!!!
THE VAN transfer from OR tambo to sabi sabi! that you get for about 3000ZAR divided by 8 which is next to nothing!
here is the website:

http://www.kwathlano.co.za/
we use it all the time! very reliable and the fare is okay. very good service!


Also, the websites mention costs for a guide. Do you have to hire a guide to take on safari? Isn't that what the lodges provide on the game drives?

maybe that's a misunderstanding. of course you DON'T have to pay for your guide!

just copy that in and show us where that's written! it would be consideren INSANE!!!
maybe you mix this up with costs for private driver/pilot who must be accommodated at lodges.
no idea. but let me asure you: your guide is inclluded in the tariff! at any camp or lodge!

Thanks again for all of your help. It is really appreciated!!!
jenwo


again jenwo: PLEASURE!
at times when i cannot travel myself it's a relief or compensation to share experiences and information!

whenever you have got some ideas or questions - there are so many fodorites prepared to help out! just post!

happy planning!

div

divine54

sorry jenwo
when i wrote i nicely put some spare before i started writing.....in order to differenciate..........it's gone. now you have to figure out mine and yours.....
shame!

div

jenwo

OMG..you are THE BEST!! Seriously div, thank you so much for your help. I am going to look into Sabi Sabi right now! I think my husband and I would like Elephant Plains, but, the rest of our crew like to go more upscale than we do, so I need to accomodate them.

That makes sense about the transfer from the airport. I hadn't begun looking into that portion yet (more research to do!).

I re-read the info about charging for the guide/pilot and you are right--it must mean privately hired person that you bring along. Sorry I'm so clueless! There are so many moving parts to try and figure out.

Another question for you...getting from Cape Town to Sabi Sands (whether it ends up being EP or SS). Is the best way to fly into Jo-burg and then drive? Or since we only are giving ourselves 4-5 days for safari, could we fly? Is it safe? too expensive?

thanks again for all of your help!!!
jenwo

jenwo

div, I just checked the SS Bush lodge and when I convert Rand to US Dollar, for 2008 it's about $530 pppd. That's more than what I was hoping for. BUMMER because it is SO amazing!! I'm looking back at EP, but any other suggestions (just to give my friends some options) would be great.

jenwo

cary999

Yeah, look at the map of the camps in Sabi Sand Reserve and Timbavati Reserve and check out each camp, map is -
http://tinyurl.com/2dvbs2
But because they will for sure be more $$$ than you are looking at, skip in Sabi Sand - Singita, MalaMala, Leopard Hills.

regards - tom

AKR1

Strongly recommend EP- the luxury chalets are excellent. Even if your friends like "luxury" I would be hard pressed to imagine how much better some of the others are to EPs best rooms. Click on my name for my report on the Sabi Sands & Timbavati last summer.

jenwo

thank you AKR! A few questions for those that have stayed at EP....do you suggest the luxury chalets or rondavels? Also, drinks are not included in the tariffs--how does that work for the sundowners? Do you bring your own drinks or do they just charge you for what you drink while out there? Are there any other additional charges that I should consider that might not be included in the per day charge?

thanks!

divine54

jenwo
right - you can fly in to nelspruit and get the transfer provided by the lodge! no problem! either lodge!

the price tag for the luxury suite is not THAT much more but the product is much more upscale! go for it. you won't regret!

regarding sundowners and other consumption drink wise:
they charge you only what you got! price tags are bearable! is moderate!

but of course you can BYO and simply order the softdrinks (tonic water e.g. ;-) ). or you bring your own wine from the winelands......... just ask them to bring the cool box (for gin, chardonnays) and glasses.
i doubt they charge you for that!
no problem at all!

on whatever you decided pls consider you are a gib group requesting at least 4 rooms and these lodges have limited space!

happy planning!

div

aowens

I don't know if this is standard practice for all the camps that charge for alcohol or not, but we were NOT charged for sundowners at Mala Mala. We were only charged for the drinks ordered in camp. I thought the price of alcohol was cheap compared to what you would pay in a restaurant/bar in the US. I can't remember exactly what it was, but I was pleasantly surprised with my bill at the end of the stay!

divine54

aowens
it's not mandatory that drinks are included!
of course high-end camps which charge $$$$$ pppd mostly include all drinks except champagne/premium spirits. but more favourable ones don't!
sometimes wine with dinner is included. sometimes it isn't. all depending on the camp. there is no general rule on that. the same with the laundry.

div

jenwo

so...I'm back to square one. I checked with EP and they aren't available the days we are going to be there!! I am SO SAD as I really got excited about it. SO....if you have any other suggestions that are similar to EP in price, luxury level, etc. I would be very open to suggestions!! Thanks for your help!
jenwo