I have a chance to travel with my spouse to St. Louis for a meeting in mid-October. I've never been there, am wondering what, other than the Gateway Arch, are the highlights?

I'm mostly interested in art, music (jazz and classical), architecture, and other "Kultchah"-type things, but also up for interesting restaurants, gardens, etc.

What would you recommend? Is three days "too long" (no offense intended...)?

Some suggestions:
Zoo, Saint Louis Art Museum (both in Forrest Park), Jefferson Nat Expansion Museum (literally right below the Arch, Saint Louis Cathedral (world's largest mosaics), Cupples House and Museum, Old Courthouse, National Video Game Museum, Bowling Museum

There's a science center or something. It's not called Science City, but something like that.

Three days in St. Louis would be too long for me (I live in Kansas City). I guess you could go to Six Flags over Mid-America.

I visited some years ago the city. I recommend you the St. Louis Zoo and the Botanical Gardens (an interesting variey of plants of different climates). I liked both so much; I come from PR and I saw in the gardens many species that we have in the Caribbean. The Forest Park had free concerts in the afternoons. You will spend a half-day in the Zoo and the same in the Botanical Gardens. You will visit the Budweiser area too,and I remember that the city had a shopping that was many years ago a train station.I don't remember the name, but I'm sure if you ask, the people of the city will tell you.

My husband and I "rediscovered" St. Louis several years ago when our son lived there. It's wonderful! He lived across from Forest Park in the Central West End, which is a very lively diverse area filled with all kinds of restaurants (tables outside) and a variety of antique stores. I'd certainly advise you to spend a little time there.

Laclede's Landing
Soulard
Frontenac Plaza

Jordan-

There's a quite a lot to do in St. Louis, as I've found being a transplanted urbanite. Two wonderful places for music- the St. Louis Symphony and the Jazz Bistro. Restaurants (a mixture of casual and fine dining)- Tony's (Fantastic, Mobile 5-Star, Gourmet Magazine's best national Italian restaurant award), Frank Papa's (Italian), Fitz's (burgers, malts, make their own root beer), St. Louis Bread Co. (typical soup & sandwich fare, but gooood), Canyon Cafe (Southwest), Bandana's (down-home barbecue), Hacienda (Mexican)- I could go on and on... Did you know that at the turn of the century, Missouri produced more wine than any other state? Wonderful little wineries in Augusta (very short distance from St. Louis), etc... Historic Main Street in St. Charles has fantastic little restuarants, antiques galore and lovely walks along the Missouri River. We have a fantastic Art and History museum in Forrest Park (the largest city park in the nation, after Central Park in NYC). The Botanical Gardens are beautiful, particularly the Japanese gardens there. Check out the interesting residential architecture in Soulard (1780's - 1900's), Lafayette Square (1800's) and downtown. Not to mention, Forrest Park- where the 1904 World's Fair was held and retains some original buildings from the event. It's also cool to see some of the neighborhoods built in Central West End (Westmoreland Place, Hortense Place, Kingsbury, etc...) specifically to show off St. Louis for the world's fair. Unusual and unique boutiques in Clayton, the Delmar Loop (U. City), Central West End, etc... St. Louis County is made up of 119 different municipalities, most with their own unique charm. St. L deserves more credit! Feel free to e-mail me... We've lived here for 5 years and love it...

Be advised that if you're even the least bit claustrophobic, the Arch will not be enjoyable for you. I did it once, but I'll never do it again!

I really enjoyed shopping and strolling at the Laclede's Landing and Union Station areas. The downtown of St. Louis is quite nice!

You people are great! Thank you for all the info (this is what the forums are for, not squabbling, IMHO)!

Question for Christie -- what is claustrophobic about the Arch?

Thanks again.

Jordan:
as a St. Louis native three days is about right.

Sheila did a great job of listing things to do and places to eat. Also do a search and there should be some good threads on St. Louis restaurants.

Day 1, Downtown:
-go up in the Arch.
-Jefferson National Expansion Museum just below the Arch.
-Old Courthouse
-Walk around Laclede's Landing.
-Union Station

Day 2: Forest Park/Central West End/Midtown
-Zoo
-Art Museum
-Science Center (part currently being remodeled but should be done by October)
-History Museum
-Euclid Ave. in the CWE.
-Jazz at the Bistro

Day 3: South City/Soulard
-Botanical Gardens
-St. Louis Hills neighborhood
-Ted Drews Frozen Custard
-Walk around Soulard
-Anheuser Busch Brewery Tour

The side trip to St. Charles and the wineries would be a good half-day alternative.

Also:
-The elevators at the Arch are small cylinders that rotate as the go up to keep the occupants level. They are small but not too bad. Unless you are very claustophibic you should be fine.
-Six Flags will probably be closed by October except for the weekends. IMHO: skip it.

I would go to Laumier (spelling??)Scupture Park. It's a bit of a hike from downtown, but its very cool. There are many particularly bad Ernest Trova Scuptures since he's from St. Louis, but there are some very fine pieces. A while ago there was a Beverly Pepper earthwork that was wonderful. It's similar to Stormking outside New York City.

IMHO, Dave B is packing way too much into his three day schedule. The Science Center is interesting, but more for kids, IMHO. But the zoo and Forest Park really are really for everyone. I finally went on the brewery tour a few years ago and would recommend it as an interesting and educational tour. (If you're a beer drinker, there is free beer at the end.) Some places that I've haven't been to yet (you know how it is when you live in a place--you don't see everything till you come back to visit)---but would love to are the Eugene Field House and St. Louis Toy Museum and the DeMenil Mansion. I have been to Faust Park in Chesterfield, but not since they opened the Butterfly house and the carousel---it sounds charming. The above restaurant suggestions are good, plus there are a lot of good Italian restaurants on The Hill---Giovanni's, Zia's, and Charlie Gitto's to name a few---all three very different in atmosphere (and price). Other St. Louis favorites are Schneithorst's(near Plaza Frontenac) and Kreis' (pronounced like Chris's) for steaks. For St. Louis pizza you need to try Imo's. Ted Drewes frozen custard is another St. Louis "tradition"---don't know if they are open in October, but you can also pick it up at a grocery store. E-mail me if you have any questions.

I've shown people around all those things in three days. But Diane is right in that you would be pushing it pretty hard.

The main Ted Drews on Chippewa is open until X-Mas. The smaller one on Grand is only open from Memorial Day to Labor Day.

By the way Imos is an aquired taste. I love it but have friends from Chicago who want to declare war on St. Louis for calling Imos, pizza.

Also there is a difference between the two Charlie Gittos. The one downtown is more casual while the one on the hill is much more upscale and eligant. They still might require jackets and ties for men.

You have some good suggestions so far. Let me add Tucker's, a restaurant on Tucker Blvd. - or maybe it's called 12th Street in that area. It's right on the edge of the Soulard (French) neighborhood. If you're there on a Saturday, Soulard Market will be lively.

Also for restaurants, my favorite on "the hill" is Zia's. "The Hill" is the Italian neighborhood easily accessable in St. Louis (near Interstate 44 and Kingshighway). Actually, it's hard to go wrong at most restaurants on "the hill."

For shopping, when my sister comes in from New York, she heads for Dillard's discount center, downtown, about one block from TWA Dome. (or whatever they're going to call it now) Men and women's clothing for 66% off. Name brands - Tommy Hil, Chaps, DKNY, etc. For normal shopping, someone has already mentioned Plaza Frontenac. Most popular is Galleria - I-64 at Brentwood Blvd.

FYI, Imo's is a St. Louis area pizza chain - there must be 40 or 50 in the St. Louis area and nearby Illinois. Everything is thin crust, and they use creamier provel cheese instead of mozarella. Dave_b was correct. It's an acquired taste. I finally grew to love it. But there are other pizza options, especially at the Italian eateries on "the hill."

Across the Mississippi River, about 8 - 10 miles from downtown is Cahokia Mounds State Park - near Collinsville. Nice museum, several indian gettogethers throughout the year. In pre-Columbian times is was a settlement of about 20,000 - Sort of the New York City of North America at that time.

Fox Theatre is where touring Broadway shows stop in St. Louis. I don't know if fall schedule is completely set, but "Contact" starts October 30.

Downtown St. Louis skyline is beautiful. Not as impressive as NYC, Chicago, but beats the hell out of Atlanta, Cleveland, Nashville, Memphis, New Orleans, and many others. Only drawback is that it is best viewed from across the river in East St. Louis, IL (Ugh!). But you can get on MetroLink, cross the river and get off at East Riverfront Station where you can gamble a few bucks at Casino Queen.

If you like architecture, you need to visit the "New" Cathedral. I believe the official name is the Cathedral Basilica of St. Louis, and it is located in an area called the central west end. It is full of mosaic art and in my opinion is more beautiful than many of the churches in Europe. It has an active Catholic parish, but open for tours. It is fantastic, and not many people are aware of what a gem it is.

I assume the brewery you're talking about is Grant Park?

I just returned from a few days in St. Louis on a business trip. I managed to squeeze in a lot of things while there besides the business, and this forum was quite helpful for restaurants (search for the post from mid-March). The ride up the arch is somewhat clautrophobic and there can be massive lines, but it is well worth it. Union Station is a nice place to visit, either just to see it or for shopping. I found the fountain out front very photogenic, even though the water was turned off. I enjoyed walking from the arch to Union Station on Market Street for the architecture. Make sure to see the entryway at the front of Union Station, toward the fountain - beautiful. Do make sure to see the Basilica. I have seen lots of great cathedrals and found the interior stunning. As recommended above, an Italian dinner on the hill is a great choice. I ate at Dominic's. I have had recommendations from locals for Trattoria Marcella as well, but I couldn't get reservations a day ahead. If you like sports, try to get tickets to a St. Louis Blues game. They should be playing by then. They have great hockey crowds. The St. Louis Art Museum is very good. The Museum of Westward Expansion (under the arch) is pretty interesting for an hour or so. I just posted some of my St. Louis photos on my Web site at www.oneeyed.homestead.com, if you are interested.

2 things:

going up in the arch is like being in an egg ready to hatch. real small, but not that bad.

also, as most Chicagoan's agree, Imo's is what we call "cracker pizza." REALLY thin. i think of it as a snack because it never fills me up

Jordan- Those little cars that you ride up and down the Arch in really gave me the Willies. I'm usually not terribly claustrophobic, but those things were just too small!

Pat- one of my friends from Colorado calls St. Louis style pizza "pizza nachos!"

Regarding a dress code at Charlie Gitto's on the hill---we've seen people there in jeans, though most tend to dress a little nicer---khakis and a shirt for men, slacks and blouse or sweater for women is nice enough.

The "brewery" is the Anheuser Busch brewery downtown.