makai1

Going to auntie's wedding in Flagstaff next week. We plan to hit Sedona for lunch on the way from PHX. Then on to Flagstaff to visit w/ family and the wedding. Sunday is designated for the Grand Canyon.
My parents, late 60's will be with mr mauka & I.

After researching, we plan to head out very early. Obviously, summer and Sunday will mean crowds.

Just not sure if we should go in the East entrance w/ stops at The Watchtower, Lipan Point and the others on the South Rim, with a short walk on the Rim Trail exiting by the south entrance, and possibly the IMAX on the way back to Flagstaff.

Another option I'm considering is, enter at the south entrance, walk when less hot & crowded and then head east stopping along the way, out the East Entrance toward the Painted Desert, stopping in Cameron on the way back to Flagstaff.

Skip the IMAX?

Would Bright Angel Trail be tough to hike for an unfit 67 yr old?

AND, do we not want to miss sunset??
Twist my arm and we'll go from sun up to sun down.

Thanks!

J62

Bright Angel trail is NOT ok for unfit 67 yr old, especially not at mid morning in August. No way, no how. Not even for a very short walk into the canyon. It's a strenuous walk back up under intense sun/heat.

I'd recommend enter from the South, stop & park at the visitors center, walk along the rim for a bit (paved trail), then take the shuttle bus either stopping at some of the overlooks, or head to GC village/Bright Angel/El Tovar hotel area. Grab lunch at one of the restaurants at Bright Angel, check out the various sights & shops, observe the condors, rim views, etc. Mid afternoon take bus back to visitors center, then drive out the East exit, stopping at overlooks and the Desert view tower.

gail

Skip sunrise. Drive to South Rim, park car. Walk to Rim. Hop on shuttle bus that travels along roadway on this Rim, getting off at various points to see different views. Back to parking area for light lunch and then hop on the other shuttle bus that goes to Visitors Center, several historic sites. Make reservations for dinner at El Tovar dining room - great atmosphere, OK food. Depending on time of reservation, you can see sunset before, during, after.

Under no circumstances should unfit person of any age do any below-the-rim hiking. If you are Mr makai are into hiking, then revise itinerary in first paragraph. Arrive early at South Rim, park your parents at Bright Angel lodge for breakfast and walk one mile down trail near there, turn around and return. Go early in morning - heat can be brutal in summer.
You can reasonably do this in a couple of hours. Then resume shuttle bus trip.

Bill_H

Just not sure if we should go in the East entrance w/ stops at The Watchtower, Lipan Point and the others on the South Rim, with a short walk on the Rim Trail exiting by the south entrance, and possibly the IMAX on the way back to Flagstaff.

This is the better option, I feel. IMAX is definitely worth it ... there are three canyons, the one on the rims, the one you see floating the river, and the one you see hiking the trails, and the IMAX movie gives a great sense of the ones you're missing, especially the river running.

Would Bright Angel Trail be tough to hike for an unfit 67 yr old?

I wouldn't venture very far down, surely no more than the first switchback. The elevation is around 6,400 at BA trailhead and it could be warm even at the top. 'unfit 67 yr old' and 'heat' and 'canyon trails' can easily lead to death via heart attack. I will feel easy going down, but don't be lulled.

AND, do we not want to miss sunset??

Yeah, maybe Mather Point since you can then drive back to Flag easier from here than from the famous west rim viewpoints. Maybe try to have lunch at El Tovar if you can get a reservation too, to make it a special day?

Bill

spirobulldog

I think Bill's suggestion of walking the first switchback is OK. Just go down 10 or 15 mins and come back. If your 67 old has some heart condition or serious medical issue, I wouldn't attempt it. This will give you a taste of below the rim.

What about a scenic helicopter tour. We have done this twice in July and it is hot as most of the helicopters don't have air conditioner.

I would spend more time in Petrified Forest than Painted Desert. The PD is the only NPS park/monument that I have been to, that I have NO DESIRE to ever go back to. PF is certainly worth spending a couple of hours at.

Your first glimpse of the GC as you walk up to the rim, will almost bring you to your knees. It is that awesome of a sight. There is still several things I want to do at GC. We have been three times, once rafting it. I hope to do a rim to rim hike someday. I want to see Havasu Falls. I haven't been to the North Rim yet. Look forward to hearing what you think about it.

gail

I still disagree about unfit 67 year old venturing even to first switchback. People that age often have knee, hip, back or other orthopedic problems and walking back up could be a killer, literally.

But perhaps it depends on how one defines "unfit". How far and how often does this person walk? Any issues on inclines, steps without railings (such as at stadiums)? Any suspecgted or confirmed arthritis diagnosis, especially in knees? Any history of dizziness, andy recent falls?

spirobulldog

Well, my 65 year old neighbor hiked rim to rim last year. I think the heat to be more of a factor than the 30 minutes of walking should be the top consideration. Usually 30 minutes in the heat isn't bad on a person. Its the prolonged several hours without hydration that will get you.

makai1

Thanks so much for your input and concern. Yes, dad has heart issues, and mom can get dizzy. It makes sense for them to stay off the Bright Angel Trail. Poss mr mauka and I will venture out for a bit as you suggested.

The more research I do, the more I am realizing that we need to make this a priority trip in the near future. Come back and spend more time in both Sedona and GCNP.

spiro, my mom said the same thing about being brought to her knees the first time she saw it. Breathtaking. I'm a photographer, and my instinct will be to pick up the camera, but from what I am hearing, no photo will do it justice.

I just want to make the best of our short time there.

Again, thank you all for your suggestions.

schmerl

I'm with Gail on this. I was at the Grand Canyon two weeks ago. I am a pretty fit 59 year old and the walk back up can be brutal!! An unfit person could have problems just walking a flat service in the heat at those high elevations. There is no way an unfit person whould go more than just a little way down Bright Angel train. Going down is not the problem....it's coming back up that will get you!

gail

makai - great idea for a future trip. You might want to include Zion and/or Bryce - some people go to Page as well - one can create a really nice itinerary of 7-10 days in the area - part of the fun of having obligatory travel to an area is that it gets one thinking about possibility of return.

I concur with your thinking that unfit older people with cardiac and dizziness problems can and should enjoy the Grand Canyon in ways other than a hike.

Bill_H

Yes, dad has heart issues, and mom can get dizzy. It makes sense for them to stay off the Bright Angel Trail.

Yes, with a heart condition then definitely even the BA (the easiest trail) is a risk.

I would suggest going to Mather Point and then there's a nice trail to the west (left as you face the canyon) from Mather that stays on the rim, so it's pretty level, with occasional benches to sit on and rest. Even a couple hundred yards away from the parking lot you'll find many fewer people and enjoy the uncrowded views. This would be a decent alternative and much safer.

Bill

spirobulldog

I agree, if any health issue, don't consider it, especially in the heat. The views from the rims are really the most impressive site. The rest is all icing on the cake.
You might consider a meal as early poster mentioned in EL TOVAR.

Vttraveler

Definitely skip the IMAX

I would go via the East Entrance one way or the other, not sure it matters which

I think getting there for sunrise would be hard from Flagstaff which is too bad because it is beautiful and less crowded than sunrise

WhereAreWe

You'll have about 14 hours between sunrise and sunset. With the fitness and health issues of your parents, I think you're best off skipping sunrise and planning on making it there by 8 or 9 am. That still gives you a good 12 hours of daylight, considering that it won't get completely dark until after 8 pm.

I like your second option (enter at south entrance, walk when cooler, etc. then head out the east entrance). But I would add in a trip to the IMAX in the afternoon when it's hottest. That would be a nice air-conditioned break for all of you during what's probably the busiest time of the day. If you drive out the east entrance, you'll be able to avoid the massive crowds on the south rim at sunset.

Vttraveler

In my earlier post I meant SUNRISE is less crowded than SUNSET. My husband and I really enjoyed getting up for sunrise, but we were staying in the park. OUr kids slept in. I think if you drove there in time you would be too tired for the rest of your day at the park. If you do decide to try for this go in the south entrance and save the east entrance drive with its great views for daylight hours. The reverse is true if you stay for sunset.

In general I was surprised at how few people were out and about early in the mornings. Mostly hikers. The whole area around GC village and the rim trail is very pleasant then.

There are many good ranger programs during the day covering a broad range of topics.

J62

My experience from about a month ago is that on weekends big crowds come and also thankfully depart with the train. Mid afternoons were crowded along the rim near the hotels & also near Mather point/visitors center area, but once the train departed back to Williams it quieted down quickly.

luvtravl

Glad you have decided not to consider Bright Angel trail with your parents. With heart conditions and dizziness they may have difficulty just being on the rim because of the altitude. Recently returned from a trip with my 68 yr old mother. Even the stairs at El Tovar proved to be a challenge due to altitude so we stuck to a short walk along rim trail and the overlooks. She thought it was spectacular. Hope you have a safe and enjoyable trip.

bmttokyo

Thanks for posting the query makai1 & thanks to all who are in the discussion. Looks like this is the issue most relevant to our planned trip for our family in 2 weeks.

Will follow this closely & post questions if I still need help later.

THANKS TO ALL !!!

makai1

Ditto bmttokyo!! Many thanks to all of you who have joined in here. Your suggestions have been extremely helpful in giving us some good direction.

Mom has been watching the thread as well, and almost signed up to say, "Hey, I'm the unfit one"! LOL... all in good humor. She and auntie had a good laugh over it!

It's very wise to heed advise from those who know an area. That's why I love this forum.

We will forgo the trails this visit and hang out on the rim near Mather.

Looks like the plan will be to go to the South Rim, via the south entrance before the crowds arrive. Walk around. Shuttle around.

Need to talk to parents about lunch at El Tovar... but read on another post about packing a picnic and finding a quiet spot to enjoy. That'll be more our style, I think.
We also may have a caravan, as some of auntie's family as well as the "newlyweds" (also in their 60's) may join in the fun too.

Maybe back to the IMAX when the crowds hit for a little cool down. Then back through the south entrance heading west... stop at all the points of interest... The Watchtower, Lipan Point etc... and out the East Entrance toward the Painted Desert, stopping in Cameron on the way back to Flagstaff.

Now who knows, the mood may strike us differently that day... but it sounds like a good plan.

Again, thanks J62, gail (BTW, love your "not speaking thread!"), Bill_H, spirobulldog, schmerl, Vttraveler, WhereAreWe, luvtravl & bmttokyo!

You've all been very helpful! ><

I'll post a report upon our return.

Bill_H

read on another post about packing a picnic and finding a quiet spot to enjoy. That'll be more our style, I think.

Shoshone Point is perfect for a secluded picnic ... almost no one knows about it, but it's the next point east from Yaki. There's a dirt road leading to it with a locked gate and you can apply to the NPS for the key for things like weddings, group gatherings etc. You can just hike on the level dirt road if you don't want to hassle with applying for the key.

There are picnic tables, an outhouse, solitude (unless a group has it, which is rare), beauty. Like having one of the major overlooks all to yourself.

Here are some links describing it. This will be a much better picnic spot than the 'normal' ones if you want to have a viewpoint to yourselves, especially if you can drive in for the sake of your parents.

http://www.azcentral.com/travel/hiki...honepoint.html

http://www.trails.com/tcatalog_trail...lid=HGS273-005

http://ezinearticles.com/?Grand-Cany...Spot&id=600869

Bill (who got married near Shoshone Point in a snowstorm)