topping for Doug

There are some great hotel bargains very near Times Square (Carnegie Suites and the Salisbury are the first two that come to mind) so I have to agree.

Also in the general neighborhood, but a bit more central is the Best Western Hospitality House on on 49th b/t 3rd and Lex. The rooms are actual apartments with full kitchens and a huge living room. It would be perfect for a family.

My aunt usually stays either at the Best Western or the UN Crowne Plaza when she's in town, so I've visited her a few times at her hotel.

There really is a dearth of good restaurants near the Crowne Plaza, but a few recommendations:
Yama has great sushi (49th b/t 1st & 2nd).
Divine Bar has pretty good tapas (51st b/t 2nd and 3rd).
Caterina's is a cute Italian place (53rd b/t 1st & 2nd)

I should have been clear. When I talk about the high prices in the Times Square area, I'm actually referring to everything ... not simply hotel prices. There are actually a few hotels in the Times Square area (the Edison, the Broadway B&B, and even the---yuck---Milford Plaza that usually have decent rates), and many other hotels offer seasonal bargains.

But, to be blunt, the prices of delis and restaurants and stores and almost everything else are completely ridiculous. I'll just take the new Junior's as an example. The jumbo hot dog (one of my favorites) is over $10 at the Times Square location; the same exact thing in Grand Central costs less tahn $8. Cheesecake is similarly overpriced and about 25% to 30% higher. And there are so few good places to eat and have breakfast in the area. Even the delis and such are horrendously overpriced. We won't even talk about the crowds, which some first-time tourists may love, but which drive me crazy. So I admit that much of my animosity toward the area stems from being a New Yorker and wanting to avoid the crowds rather than go to all the crowded, touristy areas.

From a cheapskate point of view, I just can't stomach Times Square, and I don't know why any tourist should have to. Hotels in more residential parts of town (such as the east side around the UN) are close to many more neighborhood delis, diners, and small stores that offer relative bargains (for Manhattan at least).

There are a few exceptions. Virgil's is a great bargain, as is Ollie's Noodle Shop, as is John's Pizzeria (and all are actually GOOD, which is my main complaint about the Times Square area); more upscale restaurants like Vice Versa and Chez Josephine are also pretty good). And if you are willing to go west to 9th Avenue, you'll find a vibrant strip of modest restaurants in the 50s that are not only good but quite good. I love Rice and Beans, Q2 Thai Restaurant, Wondee Siam, and Old San Juan.

But as someone observed---quite rightly, I must add---there is a definite lack of really good places to eat around the UN, but the little local delis and such are certainly cheaper than what you'll find in Midtown. And nytraveler is right about the gridlock going from east to west (especially for the past week).

Ok .. end of rant, and I'll just stay out of this thread from now on.

I guess everyone wants to give good advice....but I also think everyone is asking the question: what is the point of staying in that Hotel?

Have a great Monday everyone!

Thanks for clarifying, Doug. I thought you meant hotel prices. I haven't noticed the price differential in Times Square for restaurants, but we typically don't eat our dinners there. Although we did have a very good $32 fixed prix pretheater dinner at Le Rivage on W. 46th on Restaurant Row on our recent stay. We had breakfast at a tiny deli across from the Muse w/breakfast sandwiches for $5, and a good vegetarian food bar dinner at a place called Green Symphony for about $10 apiece.

I think you are right that you have to look for the better places to eat and stay away from the bad ones there. Much of the food right on Broadway in Times Square produced for the masses, esp. late at night, and then it is the drunken masses.

But we agree that the hotels can be very good and can be a bargain (not just the skuzzy ones, but even very upscale ones like the Muse) there just as anywhere else in NYC.

I do hope Kevey reports back with a trip report and comments on the U.N. Crowne Plaza stay, and gives us a restaurant report of the area too.

In my experience, it is pretty hard not to have an all around great time in NYC, all things considered, regardless of where I've stayed or where I've eaten. Those things can make it better for me, but just going to NYC is enough to get me in a very good mood.

Doug, for what it's worth, I dislike the Times Square area more than you can possibly imagine.

However last February I needed a cheap room for a couple of nights and used all areas and got the Milford Plaza for $80 per night.

I really liked the hotel.

My my , I do seem to have caused a bit of a stir with my original question.

I think its time I told you the background to my question.

Firstly, I have never been to New York - I am British, from London to be precise. The only part of the USA I have visited is Orlando - last year.

Next year is my 40th birthday, and my wife has a 'special' birthday next month. So we decided to visit NYC as a joint celebration but have chosen May next year when I hear the weather is very good for touring/sightseeing.

We were able to obtain a very good package with British Airways via Expedia on the internet.

They gave us a choice of what seemed like hundreds of hotels to choose from. I opted for this one because I am a priorty card holder ( a loyalty card for Holiday Inn affiliated hotels) and know from personal experience that Crowne Plaza hotels are a very good chain - I know that there are always exceptions, but I read up on Trip Advisor and apart from a few people, the majority of reviews were good. I did consider staying at the Grand Hyatt, but decided not to as the 'deal' was considerably better at the Crowne Plaza for the sake of a walk/cab ride but with the bonus of a peaceful nights sleep !

The bottom line is - once booked I cannot change the hotel therefore I was hoping for an endorsement of my choice.

Of course, once I have been there and sampled it for myself, I will post a trip report.

So to all those that have contributed - thanks, its been very interesting and at times entertaining to read your replies/views.

Kevey, so you were trying to get validation. Just tell us ahead of time. You said you were "thinking" of staying at that hotel, when you were locked in already. When you said you were thinking of it, it gave people free reign to recommend staying somewhere else that they think is in a better location. If you'd just told us up front that you were definitely staying there, I think that people would have generally been more positive, saying well it might not be the best location but you can make the best of it and it isn't terrible.

I hope you and your wife and girl have a great time in NYC! I think you will, just bring the walking shoes.

Well, the discussion has been interesting and I finally got to understand why Doug thinks staying in Times Square is so expensive. It's those darned high priced hot dogs. b-(

I don't expect a New Yorker to WANT to go to Times Square. Why would he (other than for theatre if so inclined)? And yes, some prices will be higher there because real estate (rental costs) are higher.

As I've mentioned before, I live in a resort beach town in Florida. You couldn't pay me to live right on the beach -- with the noise, the constant traffic of people and cars parking, and even the spray of the sea causing a need to wash windows every single day. But I realize that a place on the beach will probably charge more for their hotdog than a similar place in a more commercial/residential district. And I certainly would never tell visitors coming here to stay away from the beach because there are many nicer areas of town to stay. They come here for the beach and I totally understand that. And frankly most of them don't mind paying an extra couple of bucks for a hot dog because they are where they want to be -- somewhere totally different from where they live at home.

I just don't get why so many New Yorkers can't realize the same thing is true in their city. Tourists often come to New York FOR Times Square and the hustle and bustle. They aren't looking for a nice residential area to live in -- but a place that's fun for vacation.

I would never suggest to someone coming for a week at the beach to stay away from the beach because so many residential areas are so much nicer. So why do so many New Yorkers tell people headed to New York for a week of theatre and excitement to stay away from that area and stay in a less convenient location because it's nicer? That really isn't the point -- these are tourists, not people looking for a new place to settle down.

One thing that I don't think I have yet seen expressed by Kevey is whether or not they plan to see much theatre. That to me would make a big difference.
I know some New Yorkers who hate Times Square the most because they get caught up in all that commotion when they go to the theatre -- it is one big traffic jam every evening and they have to deal with it BECAUSE they are coming from somewhere else and trying to get out of there after a show. But to the tourist who is staying a couple blocks from the theatre, this is not an issue. He simply walks a couple blocks to the theatre, has dinner before or after in the immediate vicinity and then walks a block or two back to his hotel. No fighting with traffic, too few cabs available in the mad rush at 10:30, or getting stuck in traffic on a bus or even in a taxi. Those are the things that people staying away from the theatre district have to face every time they go to the theatre -- and to me it should be a big consideration, particularly if they are doing theatre several nights or like some of us EVERY night.

Well said, emd. I've just posted a new thread about "why all the deception in recent posts". I just wish people could be upfront here. I would agree that if the original post had said "we are already booked in this hotel and we can't change" that many of us would have been offering good suggestions of how to make it work to your advantage.
We're all here to help, but when people give false or misleading information it only hurts them.

Thank you for clarifying, Kevey! I think you and your wife will have a wonderful visit. You can see that Fodorites really take your needs to heart....and I hope we can be more positive for you as you begin to plan the details of your trip.

I live in Manhattan.

I always strongly suggest that visitors NOT stay in the Times Square area.

Why? Because, inevitably, when visitors complain that New York is dirty/loud/crowded, they stayed in that awful area.

Yes, New Yorkers avoid Times Square like the plague. I know a guy who switched top 20 law firms because he didn't want to work in Times Square (lateral hire).

If you're coming in for a quick 2 night theater weekend, then fine, stay there, but otherwise, please, stay elsewhere. New York has too much to offer and is too great a city for people to spend the night in Times Square.

Well, let's face it. Anyone who chooses to go to New York and then complains because it is loud and crowded would have to be a complete idiot. I don't know of a single tourist who goes to New York looking for peace, quiet, and solitude.

I only hear people who live in New York COMPLAINING about those things in Times Square. Over and over again, I see tourists who mention it was crowded and noisy also say that's why they liked it.
I haven't heard those "dirty Times SQuare" comments since they tore down the porn palaces.

And the comment about a lawyer switching firms because he didn't want to WORK in Times Square. Well of course. Duh! What does that have to do with someone flying to New York for a week of theatre and fun?

I've stayed in many places in different parts of Manhattan. Central Park South is my favorite if I am working at the Park Ave. office of the law firm I consult with in NYC. I love the brisk walk across to Park Ave and 39th in the morning.

But when my family is there for pleasure, we go to the theater every night. And in that case, we like staying closer to Times Square. Even walking back to Central Park South from Times Square seems like a long way after a whole day out on my feet. This is why I loved the Muse on my recent stay. Small, good service, great location but our room was quiet, and believe it or not, 46th St was also quiet as soon as we turned off Broadway. Ditto for our stays at both of the Sheratons and Michelangelo, although those seemed like a further walk and less convenient than the Muse.

The convenience factor is huge for us late at night after the show, and we just hop on the subway the next day to go wherever.

Neopolitan - we would like to go to the theatre on one evening - although what we end up seeing is anybody's guess - I suppose we shall book something up early in the new year as I presume most of the shows will be available for tickets by then.

Re my 'deception' - I didn't tell you the exact truth at first, because I know from previous experience that people may not always tell the exact truth if they think it may hurt your feelings. However, point taken, I understand you and Cabovacation only want to help - therefore, please help me. We are in New York for 5 days and want to do the real touristy things from visiting Empire State Building to seeing Statue of Liberty. We want to cram as much as possible into these 5 days but appreciate that we cannot do everything. Please can anybody give me the 5 things that ALL first time tourists 'from the old country' should do.

I'd recommend 1) seeing the views, though I think the Top of the Rock is actually better than the Empire State Building these days and has shorter lines; 2) Visiting the Metropolitan Museum of Art, one of the world's great art museums; 3) Visiting Central Park -- and seeing whatever most interests you; 4) Visiting the American Musem of Natural History; 5) Seeing a Broadway show of your choice; 6) seeing the UN General Assembly Building, especially since you'll be staying there -- it's a sight to behold; 7) seeing the Statue of Liberty -- either by taking the ferry there or by taking the free Staten Island Ferry (do the actual tour if you want to see the Ellis Island museum and enjoy learning about immigration in the US); 8) Shopping in some of our great stores -- on Madison Ave., in SoHo, or even on Fifth Avenue.

I guess that's eight, but those are things that I still enjoy even though I'm a New Yorker.

Eating is also a big experience in NYC, and if you have a chance, have a real New York pastrami sandwich at either Pastrami Queen or Katz's; a real New York hot dog at Katz's or Gray's Papaya; and real New York pizza at John's --- preferably the original on Bleecker Street (but there's another at Times Square). All are pretty reasonable.

Regarding the comparison of views between the Top of the Rock and the Empire State -- I loved the comment (I believe it came from Howard R, first) that the Top of the Rock has something that the Empire State Building doesn't. And that is a view of the Empire State Building. So true.

Kevey,

We're from the UK too (from Glasgow, actually).

Here's a link to my NYC trip report which might help;

http://www.fodors.com/forums/threads...1&tid=34778469

Jim

I have nothing to offer since, I need a room and I have been trying since August to get to NYC to just shop, I want to shop on the east side but I don't want the east side prices for hotels. I have been to NYC a few times so I know my way around pretty good. I want to come after Oct 16, 2006 which is the 19-22. Or later but I know that marathon will be coming up too and that makes rooms expensive already. I want to celebrate my birthday alone and just shop. It has to be after tax season for me here in BR, LA which is Oct 16. I am just ready to get away but the hotels are just so expensive. Any help appreciated. Thanks to all in advance. i would have posted a new message but is seems like the most experienced views are on this thread right now.

thanks, Lizzy