kgh8m

I don't have kids, MikeT, but my husband could take them to the daycare at his office. I'm getting the impression that Nancy doesn't work outside the home - as she's not mentioned her own job/commute concerns. If she does work, she could also look closer to wherever they decide to live in order to make the childcare work. It would only be her husband's commute that's an issue, and if he goes in a little early (as most fed govt commuters do), he could have plenty of time in the afternoon with their children. (BTW, I wasn't suggesting she consider Herndon - but parts of Fairfax and Burke and other places are completely doable.)

I simply think under $500k for the things she stated she needed or desired isn't going to work - virtually anywhere in the DC Metro region - unless she does a townhouse.

BTW, the market softening is a real consideration, and something for her to watch while she rents. Many home prices in Fairfax County have been reduced by over $100k, and many condos in DC (even older ones with more reasonable prices) have been adjusted by at least $50k before selling. Renting is a better proposition currently.

NancyCo

When I left D.C. two years ago I felt so relieved!!! The stress is already creaping up on me and I'm not even there yet!

I have been fortunate to stay home and raise my kids. I'm beginning to think I may need to go back to work!

I don't think the commute in the morning is going to be a big issue because my husband is awake at the crack of dawn. The evening commute is what's going to be the problem.

birder

kgh8m said, "I would disagree with some of the prior posters about the "hellishness" of certain commutes. I work smack dab in the middle of downtown DC and my husband works in Alexandria. We live in Herndon and we commute in and out at off hours (he goes before the rush hour, and I go after) - because our jobs allow this."

Yes, that is wonderful. But your jobs allow this. Many people's jobs don't. My husband worked for the federal government as a supervisor and he was not allowed to do flex time because of his supervisor position. I know that some agencies allow this, but his didn't.

If you are planning on commuting during normal commuting hours, then either plan to live nearby your work or nearby public transportation.

If you are lucky enough to be able to commute outside of normal commuting hours, congratulations, but realize that many people can't.

Even working outside of normal commuting hours can be rough. We lived in Virginia near a VRE station. Sometimes I would try driving in very early in the morning. Unless I left by 5:30 a.m., I-95 was a nightmare. Unless it's gotten better since I've left (doubtful), you would not want to be doing this yourself.

tabd

Nancy - I just left DC. The joke is that if you ask anyone in DC what their commute is - they will tell you it is about 30 minutes. Don't believe them. Anything south of the GW parkway will take hours (I'm not kidding) to go from one exit to the next. Maybe you don't care since it is your hubby's life that will be hell - but since his work will insure that he is going to hate his life anyway - do you really want him to spend hours, daily, twice a day, wondering why he got married, had children and has to endure such a hellish commute? Hey, your choice.

If it was me and my husband worked in Crystal City, for the sake of both of our sanity, security, and schools, I'd only be willing to live in Alexandria, North Arlington or Mclain. You will have your choice of small v/s outdated - but hey - it will be as good as, if not better than housing. Go for location and settle for small or crappy. Your quality of life will be better, I promise. Don't buy - rent. Even if your husband is an 07. The real estate market is soft but not low enough to make it worth your while. 500,00 won't get you anythign worthwhile. Just for rent you are looking at a minimum of $2500 and probably 3000+.

Sounds like you have a bead on a house. If they told you it's a 30 minute commute and it is not in Alexandria, Arlington, DC or Mclain - they lied. Falls Church may look like a short drive on the map - but it's long. Herndon may as well be in East Bejesus. I guess it just depends on how much you care about him.

tabd

oh and one last thing, Nancy. You said the morning commute will be no big thing cause he's up at the crack of dawn. So is everyone else. If he gets up at 4 - you may have a point. After 4 - join the crowd.

The commute is the number one cause of discontent in DC. Trust me - if you live in a filthy hovel within the true 30 minute commute distance, all of your friends will be envious of you.

tabd

Nancy - I was just noticed that your husband is retired and thus you plan to stay in DC. I was giving advice thinking it was another duty station. Sorry. Lots of good advice on this board from others and since you've been there before and know what you are in for - I know you will have a great time with all that the area has to offer. Good luck!

GeorgeW

I don't mean to hijack the thread, but the plight of NancyCo and her family and the sprawl of Washington DC had led me to reach the following conclusion- Metro Washington has run out of room and government agencies, when practicable, should be moved out of Washington DC. For instance, the Department of Agriculture could be moved to Cedar Rapids or Davenport, Iowa. The towns receiving the relocated government agency would benefit economically (and places like Davenport are economically stagnant), the government workers might benefit from less stressful and expensive surroundings, and the Washington area sprawl might be stemmed to a degree, aveliating some of the pain of those remaining in Washington. As it is, Washington's sprawl has reached Harpers Ferry, West Virginia, southern Pennsylvania, Maryland's Eastern Shore and the Civil War battlefields surrounding Fredericksburg, Virginia. Of course, the powerful real estate lobby would oppose this.

emd

Nancy, going back to your question: I used to own a home and live in the area of Telegraph and Franconia Rd. (Ridge View Estates, across from the soccer/ball fields called Clermont Park). The traffic on Telegraph Rd to get across the bridge over Duke St. and then under the beltway is bumper to bumper in the afternoon, but it moves. The stretch of rd. is not that long (1/2 mile) and I did it every day. If you are commuting via GW Parkway, you'll have some traffic at the area of the light by the George Washington Masonic Temple and Amtrak station. That area is close to the Alexandria courthouse complex, a bad area for traffic. So you'll have a short bottleneck in both of those places each day, but if you can tolerate that (we aren't talking a half hr of traffic in those places, unless something is wrong like an accident), you're ok.

We liked the Franconia area. Ridge View Estates is a community of modest 1950s small single family split level homes w/carports (no garages). No homeowners assn., so you need to check out your neighbor's outdoor housing appearance before you buy, but we had a good experience there for 7 yrs. Those houses go for the low 400s now. You could also look in Rose Hill.

The Fairfax County Public schools for that area are Rose Hill elementary, middle school is Francis Scott Key, high school is Edison. We were not happy with those, nor were we happy with the next set of schools going west (Lee high School, Franconia elementary, Key middle) and we moved eventually to the West Springfield school tier (Cardinal Forest, Irving middle, West SPringfield High), 6 miles further out Franconia Rd. The schools here are much better. There are older single family houses out here for $350-400K also, and up from there.

I would not even think about the area on the other side of Telegraph Rd behind Jefferson Park (Huntington metro area). That neighborhood has smaller older townhouses, is more transient, and it flooded massively this year.

emd

To get to Crystal City from that Telegraph/Franconia area, you'd take Telegraph to right on Duke, cut through a corner of Old Town, and then take Rt. 1 up to Crystal City. You would not need to use GW Parkway.

emd

One more thing. I strongly disagree w/the idea that you should not worry about quality of the public schools because you can send your kids to private school for less than it costs to buy a house in the good public school areas. While I was living in the Franconia area I sent both of my kids to private school for 3 1/2 yrs., then we moved to gte them into good public Fairfax Co. public schools so I have some experience w/this.

First, you have no guarantee that private schools that you want your kids to go to will be anywhere close to your home, or that there will be ANY private schools close to your home. The only private school close to the Franconia area was Burgandy Farm, and we didn't like the philosophy or the really high price tag of that school. We ended up driving them to one of the private schools on Russell Rd. in Alexandria, pretty far from us.

Small private schools usually do not have the capacity to offer all of the opportunities on many levels that a public school can offer. And when the kids get older, a class of 10-12 kids is not always the best thing. Plus, private schools can have a hard time recruiting and keeping teachers, and the impact of that is huge in a small private school-- my son once had three teachers in the first 5 months in one year in grade 4 (and at that age in the private school he was in, the teacher taught all subjects in one classroom all day) and at that point we took him out. And if you have a problem w/a teacher that isn't getting resolved, there is sometimes no option to move the kid to another class because there is no other class. Sometimes the "small" part of private schools can become claustrophobic.

There is much more to this analysis than the $$ it costs in housing vs. tuition for private vs. public school.

tabd

emd - I'm wondering how long ago that you lived there. In 2005, I used to to commute that area for appointments and the traffic was horrible. I can think of nothing more frustrating than sitting on that freeway. Sometimes - traffic would be so bad that I would just want to turn off at the next exit to get out of the traffic and it could literally take 30 - 40 minutes just to turn around.

Do not underestimate the impact of traffic on your life. I would highly, highly recommend going to the area where you are think you want to live and experiencing the traffic week day morning and afternoon traffic before you sign a contract.

One thing that always amazes me is that people don't consider their gas costs when choosing a place to live. And not just gas costs - but the car costs as well. Unless you drive a total beater car, you should be calculating at least 50 cents per mile. Many people were spending thousands of dollars in commuting costs to save hundreds in housing costs.

birder

I have to agree about the traffic. It is just simply really, really ugly. That's why I would recommend living near work, or near public transportation. Metro, VRE or MARC are all good alternatives. My husband & I initially lived in Crystal City - rented an apartment. He walked to work and loved it. Later, we moved to Springfield and rented. We took the metro - not as good as walking, but still very do-able. Then we moved further south and lived near a VRE station. That was more difficult because of crowding, etc. - but that was far far preferable to driving. Sometimes we would have to drive, and we'd pick up a "slug." Even that was a nightmare, waiting in line for slugs, people cutting in line, then sometimes you'd still have back-ups in the HOV lanes. Wow, makes me feel alot better about my current commute!

emd

tabd, I still live in the area and use that corridor on Telegraph Rd. frequently Are you speaking of driving on the beltway? You don't get on the beltway to use the Telegraph Rd. Corridor that Nancy and husband would use to get to Crystal City from Telegraph/Franconia area.

emd

And I never said the traffic isn't bad. I said there is bumper to bumper traffic on that Telegraph corridor for about a 1/2 mile as it crosses over Duke St and under the beltway. But it lets up as soon as you get under the beltway, and at that point, Nancy would be home in a few minutes. And I also said that the area in front of the Washington Masonic Temple and Alexandria courthouse is a congested area.

It is also possible to ride the bus to Van Dorn or the Huntington metro from the Telgraph/Franconia area and take metro to Crystal City. Huntington metro has lots of parking that fills up early; Van Dorn has no parking to speak of.

tabd

I was talking about 395. I would usually take that because I could schedule to avoid rush hour (a very short window) - but sometimes the traffic was just bad and sometimes I got a late start.

You are much more familiar than I, but it seems to me that when I would go through Alexandria/old town/ Duke street during commuting hours that it was basically traffic light to traffic light and very slow going.

emd

She will only be on Duke St. for an equivalent of less than one block, btwn. Telegraph and the turn in front of the Masonic temple Monument and vice versa.

tabd

emd - I don't mean to sound like I'm questioning your advice, cause I'm not. Life in DC involves traffic. In fact, it revolves around traffic. And if they are planning on spending around $500 then you are probably giving her great help. I'm just warning her that 15 miles on the map can easily be 50 minutes on the clock.

So on, be honest.....how long is that commute during rush hour. Let me guess....30 minutes, right?

allison04

Wow--there is so much negativity in this thread! Don't tell her not to move here! I LOVE it here! Yes, the traffic is bad, it's expensive, and commutes are often long, but I wouldn't rather be anywhere else.

I'm partial to Arlington and Alexandria because, to me, they feel more like little cities than SUBURBS (like Reston and McLean). So if I were you, Nancy, I'd look first in those two cities near the Metro stops (assuming your husband's work will be close to the Crystal City metro). There's both the city of Alexandria, which is closer-in and more expensive, and the part of Alexandria that is in Fairfax County, which is farther out and cheaper, but still on the Metro.

(I agree that you do NOT want to commute from Annapolis to Crystal City, although Annapolis is nice!)

tabd

allison, I completely agree with what you wrote. I lived in North Arlington just off Spout run and it was great. But I'm just warning her that the locals say the traffic is no problem, their commute is only 30 minutes and not to believe a word of that unless they live in Alexandria or Arlington.

It's important to think about the traffic and what's important to her lifestyle because the traffic will an impact on her life.

emd

Who is saying the traffic is no problem? No one I know who lives here says that. You just find the best route and deal w/it if you are going to live here. In Nancy's case, the best route will include a bad bottleneck for a short stretch, and of course in any commute in any major metropolitan area if there is an accident on your route, your commute is lengthened and you have to find a way around it.

I also love it here, it's a great community, very diverse and a dynamic place to raise a family.