I wish you could edit these posts - meant to say LA & SF were two very COSMOPOLITAN cities (not metropolitan, duh). Oops.

So some may disagree with the idea to live in the city, but that remains my vote...if I were to move back that's the first place I'd look...especially with the new shopping in Homestead & South Side Works.

Truly, Pittsburgh seems to be getting a bad rap on this thread. Due to the nature of my job, I get to travel frequently to other cities in the US, Canada, and Europe, and there are very few that I'd prefer to live in other than Pittsburgh. For the purposes of full disclosure, I did grow up in the South Hills area here. Currently, I live with my wife in the Mexican War Streets area (6+ years). She moved up from Columbus, OH after we were married, and just recently her sister moved up as well. Her parents are planning to also do so shortly. Mostly, this is due to the uniqueness of the area and its abundance of ethnic areas to visit. I think the problem a lot of people have with Pittsburgh is that, to find the truly interesting stuff around here, you need to work at digging it up yourself, by meeting the locals and actually being interested in the things they have to recommend. This area has a ton of things to do, and a ton of places to go, and is very beautiful architecturally, culturally, and environmentally, and much of the charm is finding them out for yourself - NOT relying on travel guides to point you to the nearest Quaker Steak and Lube. There is a ton of ethnic charm in the area to be discovered, and each neighborhood really does have its own character to uncover, unlike many other places I've had the benefit of visiting. The people are, across the board, very friendly and very accomodating if you ask them for their favorite places to go. All I would ask a visitor to do is to embrace the (so called) 'provincial' aspects of the town (which are overstated), and view it as an opportunity to go places and do things that you would otherwise not do, or not be able to do in a different city. If you do that, you can be very happy and fulfilled here. I suspect that many of the detractors are those who consider themselves 'cosmopolitan', but can't be bothered to have to actually do anything but have the 'cosmopolitan' aspects of ANY city handed to them in a brochure for their consumption. By the way, as I mentioned earlier, I've lived in the Mex. War Streets for 6+ years, and have never had a single problem over here - the neighbors are extremely nice and accomodating and I have trouble imagining living in a more friendly neighborhood. Good luck in your move (if it hasn't already happened yet)!

- S

Gripper you comments are ridiculous. Especially this one:

"Mostly, this is due to the uniqueness of the area and its abundance of ethnic areas to visit."

Pittsburgh have very little cultural diversity compared other big cities. An ethnic area in Pittsburgh is Italian or Irish. In most big cities these days, there is also Chinese, Thai, Indian, Pakistani, Sir Lanka, Jamaican, Turkish, Lebanese, Russian, Salvadoran etc., etc., none of which exist in Pgh to any extent. Pittsburgh is one of the least cuturally diverse cities in the US.

You're sneering remarks about travel guides are pathetic. You are just rationalizing simple fact that there is very little to do in Pgh.

I am so tired of comments like the above - anyone who thinks there is nothing to do in Pittsburgh must be a very dull person. And anyone who thinks there are no good restaurants...I'm just baffled by that.
True, maybe it's not right in front of your face a la New York or LA, but anything you want to do, if you look, you'll find it.
Pittsburgh is not for everyone and I am well aware of its faults. If you want a place that is cheap and unpretentious, has lots of urban amenities, and doesn't require you to comform to the latest hip standards at all times, please consider our wonderful city, Pittsburgh.

I gather that Pittsburgh, like many places, does not pigeonhole so well. That works for me, as I don't either ;-)

I am curious about what appears to be little mention of the northern part of the metro area--is that by design or is that area just under-represented here?

Again my thanks to all for a rich and continuing peek behind the Iron (City) Curtain.

"Pittsburgh is not for everyone and I am well aware of its faults. If you want a place that is cheap and unpretentious, has lots of urban amenities, and doesn't require you to comform to the latest hip standards at all times, please consider our wonderful city, Pittsburgh."

Let's translate this in English:

"If you want a place that is cheap": Translation: Houses are cheap because no one wants to move there so housing in in low demand. Taxes, on the other hand are astronomical.

"unpretentious." Translation: There is nothing to be opretentious about. It is an aging blue collar town with crumbling infrastructure. People get out of there as soon as they can. That's why it's the oldest city in the US.

"has lots of urban amenities" Translation: You mean the same big box stoes they have in South Podunk Alabama. Yeah.

"and doesn't require you to comform to the latest hip standards at all times." Translation: It is an aging blue collar town with crumbling infrastructure.

I notice that you don't even try to defend the horrible perpetually overcast weather, the virtual nightmare of trying to get around the constantly under-repair bridges and pot-holed streets, the really terrible commute into the city, and the coating of road salt that rusts out your car in a year as they try and make the steep hills passable in winter. Oh, yeah, and there's the high crime rate.

Aw come on, Metellus. There must be something you liked about Pittsburgh. Mineo's Pizza? You must have liked Mineo's! Can we make peace over a cheesy slice of Mineo's???

3RiverRelo - Personally I think the North Hills represent the best of the suburbs. We live near Sewickley, a charming little town and if you have kids, we live in a school district that is among the top in the country - North Allegheny. Mt. Lebanon is great too as many here have said, but the traffic between the north and city is much more bearable than from the south or west (I have lived in all sections). I also agree with many here that the city is very provincial even though it is my home town and I have lived elsewhere, but there is a draw to the city that many have posted here - big town amenities, small town charm. I wish the city itself wasn't languishing so much (in bankruptcy actually) and the downtown is definitely more depressing than it was 10 years ago or so...but still there is enough here that has kept me here for almost 15 years despite other opportunities. If we could just get rid of winter, I'd be happier though!

If you go north of the city do you avoid mine insurance? I am learning and wondering about subsidence insurance, which seems prevalent in/around South Hills--elsewhere as well?

Ahhhh, Pittsburgh you sure can drink for cheap. That's about all I got. Oh, and Fathead's rules.

Metallus has no clue. He/she thinks "has lots of urban amenities" means "the same big box stoes they have in South Podunk Alabama. Yeah."

Whatever "stoes" may be, they aren't in Pgh (and why this hatred for Alabama, let alone for Pittsburgh, metallus?)

Urban amenities in Pittsburgh include a world-class symphony, ballet, opera, theatre, professional sports, parks, restaurants and interesting neighborhoods.

Pittsburgh is a pleasant place to live. The cost of living is very reasonable, public schools provide an excellent education, the terrain is unique and beautiful. I would highly recommend Mt. Lebanon. An established community with a defined town area with sidewalks, restaurants, small businesses, etc. Commute into the city is about 20 minutes. The north suburb equivalent is Wexford/Franklin Park/Pine Twp. Similar commute, not really a town center. About 10 minutes north, the county changes to Butler. Property taxes are probably half of Allegheny County.
We have top rated hospitals, universities, theater, corporations, museums, zoo, multi-religions, sporting and cultural events. We are not NYC, LAX, BOS, SFO, and I know you are well aware. However, we don't have the population of those cities either. So, we don't have the traffic, costs, etc. If there is an event in the city that you want to attend, you can. We are culturally diverse with immigrants from the 20s, who came from Italy, Ireland, Russia and Eastern Europe as well as Indian, Asian, European, etc. Best restaurant for 2004 as voted by the population...Indian (as if that really matters.)
I would take caution with the posts from Metellus. He/She seems obstinate on all posts on this site. None are beneficial, just unhelpful, and somewhat rude. Perhaps a move to a more pleasant city would help

Metellus is obviously jonesing bad for a Primanti's sandwich.

Mineo's Pizza? I remember the day it opened. We all wondered, "Pizza? what's this pizza stuff?" My dog especially loved it. He went there every day to beg pizza crusts from customers. In incidentally, know whatr gets voted the top pizza in Ph every year? Pizza Hut. Sad, very sad.

Primanti's sandwich? That's a classic example of hoow pathetic Pittsburgh has become. You put French fries on a sandwhich and that's considered a special local delicacy. That really is pathetic. Now Isaly's toasted almond fudge ice cream and chipped ham, those are delicacies. And George Aiken's deviled crabs.

"Ahhhh, Pittsburgh you sure can drink for cheap." Huh? Thanks to the ridiculous state liquor stores and limts on beer sales Pa is one of the most expensive states to buy booze.

Oh Metellus-If only I had known to say the words "George Aiken"!!!

Well, I'm new to these boards. I currently live in HOT Scottsdale (Phoenix) Arizona. We are moving to Pittsburgh in June. I have 2 high school students and we are looking to move to either the Pine/Richland High School are or Upper St. Clair. Could I please have your thoughts on both areas, pros and cons? Thanks!

I believe both of those areas have great schools...and from the brief time I spent on an admissions committee at a university in Pittsburgh (a few years ago), I recall that Upper St. Clair may have the edge on reputation. However, from a purely geographic standpoint, if you are working downtown it might be an easier commute to be coming from north of the city rather than south (where upper st. clair is), so that you wouldn't have to deal with the tunnels. I may be wrong on that, but from my recollection the tunnels (Liberty and/or Fort Pitt) could be a major pain.

However, the SouthHills actually the subway track. You could hop on and be downtown in minutes, if you would rather commute that way instead of driving.

The SouthHills has more of a community feel. The Pine area is pretty and wooded, but my spread out--like surburbia.

azsummer2003: I know nothing about Pine/Richland. I lived in Upper St. Clair and attended USC schools, as did my siblings, and am quite satisfied with the quality of the education received.
Commuting to downtown is not bad, considering there's a rail station at South Hills Village. I wouldn't want to commute from USC to another part of town, e.g., Oakland, however.

hi,
im considering taking job with my company. the job is located in freedom pa. I will be going there sometime this week to check the office and area out. Just wondering how the school systems there are. what counties are above the others in elementry.

my wife is a 1st grade teacher, in md teachers are hard to come by. is it difficult for teachers to get jobs?

we are moving from the dc/balt area im sure the price of homes will be much cheaper....

what is the traffic like? it takes me 30 mins in the am to go 15-18 miles, pm rush hr it takes me about 45-1hr.

so im use to a 30 min -45 min commute, from freedom what areas with in the 30-45 min time frame would you recommend for school, and live... we are suburb people...

thanks for the help