Missing post: Moving to Bay Area
Dec 8th, 2003, 06:55 AM
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Missing post: Moving to Bay Area
Hi,
I can't find the the post we started Sat., Dec 7, and had lots of messages from last night Dec. 8. It was about us Moving to Bay Area, where to live?
Did it Disappear or move???
I can't find the the post we started Sat., Dec 7, and had lots of messages from last night Dec. 8. It was about us Moving to Bay Area, where to live?
Did it Disappear or move???
Dec 8th, 2003, 07:50 AM
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That must be the reason -- it's such a shame when this happens.
OK, based on what I remember of your parameters, I (and a few other posters) recommended the north bay. The further north you go in Marin, the lower the pricing but the worse the commute. I'm not sure what your husband's hours will be, but if they are at all flexible, San Rafael or Novato might work. Corte Madera, Larkspur, Greenbrae, Mill Valley, etc. are all an order of magnitude more expensive.
If he's going at peak commute hours, I would stay away from anything off Sir Francis Drake Blvd., an east/west artery that runs through central Marin -- lots of traffic morning, afternoon, and when school lets out. It goes into the Kentfield/Greenbrae/ San Anselmo area, which is great but also very pricey.
Other than that, I would look into the Rockridge or Piedmont areas of Oakland/Berkeley. They are vibrant communities with a good people mix. Also have access to BART, good shopping, a variety of schools (public and private). Also check out North Berkeley and Albany, perhaps off Solano Ave. There are some really great older neighborhoods (Thousand Oaks is one), all with good access to BART. For that matter, there will be pockets of adjacent El Cerrito that might work as well.
If you are trying to avoid a 'planned community' feel, you might like the places I mentioned. I think some people might recommend places like Pleasanton, Danville or the SF peninsula. Not so much my cup of tea, but they have their fans. You'll know if it's for you when you take a spin through the different Bay Area neighborhoods.
Have you been out to look yet?
OK, based on what I remember of your parameters, I (and a few other posters) recommended the north bay. The further north you go in Marin, the lower the pricing but the worse the commute. I'm not sure what your husband's hours will be, but if they are at all flexible, San Rafael or Novato might work. Corte Madera, Larkspur, Greenbrae, Mill Valley, etc. are all an order of magnitude more expensive.
If he's going at peak commute hours, I would stay away from anything off Sir Francis Drake Blvd., an east/west artery that runs through central Marin -- lots of traffic morning, afternoon, and when school lets out. It goes into the Kentfield/Greenbrae/ San Anselmo area, which is great but also very pricey.
Other than that, I would look into the Rockridge or Piedmont areas of Oakland/Berkeley. They are vibrant communities with a good people mix. Also have access to BART, good shopping, a variety of schools (public and private). Also check out North Berkeley and Albany, perhaps off Solano Ave. There are some really great older neighborhoods (Thousand Oaks is one), all with good access to BART. For that matter, there will be pockets of adjacent El Cerrito that might work as well.
If you are trying to avoid a 'planned community' feel, you might like the places I mentioned. I think some people might recommend places like Pleasanton, Danville or the SF peninsula. Not so much my cup of tea, but they have their fans. You'll know if it's for you when you take a spin through the different Bay Area neighborhoods.
Have you been out to look yet?
Dec 8th, 2003, 08:34 AM
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It's probably my fault for the post getting pulled. I apologize for it. I fell for the taunts of a certain you-know-who. I hope you find the info you need. Good luck with the move and settling the kids into new schools.
Dec 8th, 2003, 08:40 AM
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My vote is for Piedmont although you might also check out Danville or Orinda.
All three communities have great schools and are in the East Bay. Danville is more developed than all. Personally, I've lived in both Danville and Piedmont and far prefer Piedmont. It gave me the feeling of a small town. It is in close proximity to Oakland and a particularly great neighborhood in Oakland(Piedmont Avenue). You are also in very close proximity to Rockridge BART. Piedmont also have oganized commute car lines where one can be picked up by folks on their way to the city. This enables the driver to use the commute lane.
All three communities have great schools and are in the East Bay. Danville is more developed than all. Personally, I've lived in both Danville and Piedmont and far prefer Piedmont. It gave me the feeling of a small town. It is in close proximity to Oakland and a particularly great neighborhood in Oakland(Piedmont Avenue). You are also in very close proximity to Rockridge BART. Piedmont also have oganized commute car lines where one can be picked up by folks on their way to the city. This enables the driver to use the commute lane.
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Dec 8th, 2003, 09:35 AM
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Are you relocating with your company? If so, you might ask them to provide relocation counseling for you as a perk. That should cover the similarities/differences among communities and school districts, etc.
Dec 8th, 2003, 09:44 AM
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We are relocating from Bainbridge Island, which is a small communtiy near Seattle, and we will probably be purchasing a house, though we will have to downsize due to the Bay Area real estate market. Our company doesn't really offer too much in relocation counseling, but we are definitely negotiation for a cost of living adjustment! We like Marin County, but don't want to live in an area that is too high pressure. We prefer a relaxed small town feeling.
Dec 8th, 2003, 10:31 AM
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Dlai, having commuted to the SF Financial District from the far reaches of the City (Outer Sunset District), the North Bay, and the East Bay) I found the East Bay commute (whether by BART or by car pool over the Bay Bridge) the easiest and most pleasant. The Outer Sunset commute was my least favorite--a long, long ride on the Metro with frequently cattle car conditions. There are few if any more beautiful places to live than the East Bay, but the home prices in Marin are ridiculous and the commute from Sonoma long (Hwy. 101 between Petaluma and San Rafael is more of a bottleneck than the GG Bridge and its approaches themselves, although the latter can also be deadly)and sometimes the conditions on the Golden Gate Transit buses are not that much better than MUNI. Standing on a bus all the way between SF and Petaluma (as I often used to do) is not fun. BART is by far the fastest and most pleasant way to commute. And if you don't have your own car pool, there are numerous points in the East Bay where drivers and passengers both line up to fill the cars so all can have the benefit of being able to use the multi-occupant vehicle lanes. I did this often and never had a bad experience. Riding with two other strangers randomly standing next to you in line tended to keep everyone safe from bad behavior.
I second the person who mentioned Albany in particular (a little city a few minutes from the Bay Bridge on I-80, just north of Berkeley.) I have lived there, and found it a short and pleasant commute to the financial district. Although I did not have kids in school, I know it had the reputation of having a much better school system than any of the cities bordering it, and many people moved there for that reason. Also, there are many faculty, graduate students and staff of UC Berkeley living there, meaning there are a wide range of interesting activities and amenities (as well as in Berkeley immediately next door.) But it is mostly a town of modest, older bungalows, so it isn't that expensive by Bay Area standards. (There are also some newer condos by the Bay with sweeping views of SF and the Golden Gate.) But by reputation, the best public schools in the Bay Area are in Contra Costa County on the other side of the Oakland/Berkeley hills, still an easy commute to the financial district by BART. Each community as you go farther out on BART has a
more modest housing price level than the one before it (Orinda, Lafayette, Walnut Creek, Pleasant Hill, Concord in order) but all except possibly the first one or two are probably below the Marin cost level, and all have school systems with strong reputations.
I second the person who mentioned Albany in particular (a little city a few minutes from the Bay Bridge on I-80, just north of Berkeley.) I have lived there, and found it a short and pleasant commute to the financial district. Although I did not have kids in school, I know it had the reputation of having a much better school system than any of the cities bordering it, and many people moved there for that reason. Also, there are many faculty, graduate students and staff of UC Berkeley living there, meaning there are a wide range of interesting activities and amenities (as well as in Berkeley immediately next door.) But it is mostly a town of modest, older bungalows, so it isn't that expensive by Bay Area standards. (There are also some newer condos by the Bay with sweeping views of SF and the Golden Gate.) But by reputation, the best public schools in the Bay Area are in Contra Costa County on the other side of the Oakland/Berkeley hills, still an easy commute to the financial district by BART. Each community as you go farther out on BART has a
more modest housing price level than the one before it (Orinda, Lafayette, Walnut Creek, Pleasant Hill, Concord in order) but all except possibly the first one or two are probably below the Marin cost level, and all have school systems with strong reputations.
Dec 8th, 2003, 12:58 PM
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Since you are moving from Bainbridge, I might also suggest you check out Mill Valley. Housing prices are also quite high though, schools are good and it has managed to retain some of its "small town feel".
Dec 8th, 2003, 02:20 PM
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Here's my suggestions.
In the North Bay/Marin
Novato-
Marin without the botox.Homey, family oriented, more subarus then BMWs. Cheap by Marin Standards but a top shelf town nonetheless. The drive into SF in the morning is very bad.
In the East Bay
Orinda-
Posh town with some republicans( a novelty in the bay area) and brainy residents with lots of kids...on the other side of the hill which means its 15 degrees warmer then SF in the summer...wooded. leafy, hilly.
2nd highest scoring school district in the state of California(1st is Piedmont which happens to be on the other side of the hill closer to San Francisco)..BART STATION IN TOWN!!!
On the Peninsula
San Mateo-
within a stones throw of the airport..home to silicon valley commuters as well as SF bound commuters..large variety of homes..so-so schools....lots of racial and ethnic diversity(which is neat considering the town in considered upper class by the Census)...and CalTrain runs through town.
The South Bay...is too far.
In the North Bay/Marin
Novato-
Marin without the botox.Homey, family oriented, more subarus then BMWs. Cheap by Marin Standards but a top shelf town nonetheless. The drive into SF in the morning is very bad.
In the East Bay
Orinda-
Posh town with some republicans( a novelty in the bay area) and brainy residents with lots of kids...on the other side of the hill which means its 15 degrees warmer then SF in the summer...wooded. leafy, hilly.
2nd highest scoring school district in the state of California(1st is Piedmont which happens to be on the other side of the hill closer to San Francisco)..BART STATION IN TOWN!!!
On the Peninsula
San Mateo-
within a stones throw of the airport..home to silicon valley commuters as well as SF bound commuters..large variety of homes..so-so schools....lots of racial and ethnic diversity(which is neat considering the town in considered upper class by the Census)...and CalTrain runs through town.
The South Bay...is too far.
Dec 8th, 2003, 02:25 PM
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Thanks for all these helpful suggestions! Luiinsac, I cracked up when I read your description of Novato,"Marin without the Botox"! These are the kinds of things we need to know, even if they are generalizations!
Dec 8th, 2003, 03:29 PM
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More stereotypes about Bay Area communities, but pretty funny:
> Barbie Dolls Inc. Announces The Release Today of Models of Limited
> Edition Barbie Dolls for the California Market:
>
> Pleasanton/Danville Barbie:
>
> This princess Barbie is only sold at the Walnut Creek's Broadway Plaza
> and the Stoneridge Mall. She comes with an assortment of Kate Spade
> handbags, a Lexus, a lapdog and a cookie cutter house. Options include
> tummy tuck, face lift and a workaholic Ken.
>
> San Ramon Barbie:
>
> This trendy homemaker Barbie is available with the Lexus SUV or Ford
> Windstar minivan, gets lost easily, and has no full time occupation or
> secondary education. Traffic jamming cell phone sold separately.
> Optional matching gym outfit.
>
> Richmond Barbie:
>
> This recently paroled Barbie comes with a 9 mm handgun, a Ray Lewis
> knife, a low-rider Chevrolet with oversized wheels and tinted windows
> and a Meth Lab Ken. Also available in a Mexican version.
> Berkeley Barbie:
>
> This Barbie actually comes in two variations. One has long gray hair and
> archless feet, sandals with white socks, no makeup and a mutt. The other
> version has frizzy hair, a dingy white tanktop, low cut jeans and
> scratch-n-sniff armpits.
> Tiburon Barbie:
>
> This True Blonde shops exclusively at The Village, Stanford and Carmel.
> She drives her Land Rover (sold separately) to the Museum of Modern Art
> in San Francisco. She has an MBA from Stanford but has never worked
> outside the home. Her child stroller is bigger than your house and her
> tennis trophies are discreetly hidden behind CEO Ken's golf trophies.
> She knows enough Spanish to talk with the nanny; Tagalong to speak to
> the cook; and Chinese, Vietnamese and Korean, to talk with the gardener,
> house painter, and housekeeper respectively. She is a lifelong member of
> the Junior League and her Tiburon estate on Gilmartin Drive is featured
> in Architectural Digest. Her family owns a winery in Napa, but she buys
> cases of "2-Buck Chuck" at Trader Joe's. Hence the need for the
> rear-loading Land Rover.
>
> Her dirty little secret?? She's a closet Republican.
>
> Barbie Dolls Inc. Announces The Release Today of Models of Limited
> Edition Barbie Dolls for the California Market:
>
> Pleasanton/Danville Barbie:
>
> This princess Barbie is only sold at the Walnut Creek's Broadway Plaza
> and the Stoneridge Mall. She comes with an assortment of Kate Spade
> handbags, a Lexus, a lapdog and a cookie cutter house. Options include
> tummy tuck, face lift and a workaholic Ken.
>
> San Ramon Barbie:
>
> This trendy homemaker Barbie is available with the Lexus SUV or Ford
> Windstar minivan, gets lost easily, and has no full time occupation or
> secondary education. Traffic jamming cell phone sold separately.
> Optional matching gym outfit.
>
> Richmond Barbie:
>
> This recently paroled Barbie comes with a 9 mm handgun, a Ray Lewis
> knife, a low-rider Chevrolet with oversized wheels and tinted windows
> and a Meth Lab Ken. Also available in a Mexican version.
> Berkeley Barbie:
>
> This Barbie actually comes in two variations. One has long gray hair and
> archless feet, sandals with white socks, no makeup and a mutt. The other
> version has frizzy hair, a dingy white tanktop, low cut jeans and
> scratch-n-sniff armpits.
> Tiburon Barbie:
>
> This True Blonde shops exclusively at The Village, Stanford and Carmel.
> She drives her Land Rover (sold separately) to the Museum of Modern Art
> in San Francisco. She has an MBA from Stanford but has never worked
> outside the home. Her child stroller is bigger than your house and her
> tennis trophies are discreetly hidden behind CEO Ken's golf trophies.
> She knows enough Spanish to talk with the nanny; Tagalong to speak to
> the cook; and Chinese, Vietnamese and Korean, to talk with the gardener,
> house painter, and housekeeper respectively. She is a lifelong member of
> the Junior League and her Tiburon estate on Gilmartin Drive is featured
> in Architectural Digest. Her family owns a winery in Napa, but she buys
> cases of "2-Buck Chuck" at Trader Joe's. Hence the need for the
> rear-loading Land Rover.
>
> Her dirty little secret?? She's a closet Republican.
>
Dec 8th, 2003, 04:46 PM
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Here's a "You know your in the Bay Area" list off the net...geared towards the geek set.
You get the same off-color email joke from 17 people in the same hour, and one of them is your wife. [2]
Your "personal shopper" has become engaged to your "career coach". [1]
You know that "taking the Nerd Bird" means you're flying to Boston or Austin ... for the 3rd time in a week. [1]
You have a daughter named Meg and a son named URL. [1]
You bought stock in Starbucks just for the free chocolate-covered coffee beans. [1]
You recently built your children their first "tilt-up" concrete playhouse.
[1]
Almost all of the companies featured on your resume are no longer in business. [1]
You make $120,000 a year, yet still can't find a place to live.
Your commute time is 45 minutes and you live 8 miles away.
You live an hour or more from the office so that you can afford a larger house.
You spend more time in your office and car than in your house.
You stop asking how much things cost, but instead ask "how long will it take?"
Two-thirds of the people you know are from Boston or New York, but you are living in PST.
You know vast differences difference between Thai, Vietnemese, Chinese, Japanese, Cantonese, and Korean food.
Your home computer contains mostly hardware/software that is not on the consumer market yet.
You go to "The City" on weekends but don't live there because you like your car.
You think that "I'm going to Fry's" is an acceptable excuse to leave the office for a while, and your boss does too.
You lost your alarm clock, but you'll get to work when you get there.
You go to your favorite restaurant, but Clinton and Gore took it over for dinner again.
You go to an industrial-heavy-metal bar and see two guys get into a fight over what flavor of Unix is better.
You own more than 10 articles of clothing that have hardware/software companies printed on them. Bonus for embroidered stuff.
You know that 280 North goes west and that 680 North goes east.
It rained ... and your birdbath fell over ... or your tree fell over ... or a utility pole fell over.
It rained ... and the spiders came in ... and the ants came in ... and the mice came in.
You realize that even though Microsoft employs quite a few programmers in the Bay Area, they only work on PowerPoint.
The phone company installed fiber-optic cable to your home but they can't afford to light it up.
You have more bandwidth inside your home than there is in most major universities.
You get the same off-color email joke from 17 people in the same hour, and one of them is your wife. [2]
Your "personal shopper" has become engaged to your "career coach". [1]
You know that "taking the Nerd Bird" means you're flying to Boston or Austin ... for the 3rd time in a week. [1]
You have a daughter named Meg and a son named URL. [1]
You bought stock in Starbucks just for the free chocolate-covered coffee beans. [1]
You recently built your children their first "tilt-up" concrete playhouse.
[1]
Almost all of the companies featured on your resume are no longer in business. [1]
You make $120,000 a year, yet still can't find a place to live.
Your commute time is 45 minutes and you live 8 miles away.
You live an hour or more from the office so that you can afford a larger house.
You spend more time in your office and car than in your house.
You stop asking how much things cost, but instead ask "how long will it take?"
Two-thirds of the people you know are from Boston or New York, but you are living in PST.
You know vast differences difference between Thai, Vietnemese, Chinese, Japanese, Cantonese, and Korean food.
Your home computer contains mostly hardware/software that is not on the consumer market yet.
You go to "The City" on weekends but don't live there because you like your car.
You think that "I'm going to Fry's" is an acceptable excuse to leave the office for a while, and your boss does too.
You lost your alarm clock, but you'll get to work when you get there.
You go to your favorite restaurant, but Clinton and Gore took it over for dinner again.
You go to an industrial-heavy-metal bar and see two guys get into a fight over what flavor of Unix is better.
You own more than 10 articles of clothing that have hardware/software companies printed on them. Bonus for embroidered stuff.
You know that 280 North goes west and that 680 North goes east.
It rained ... and your birdbath fell over ... or your tree fell over ... or a utility pole fell over.
It rained ... and the spiders came in ... and the ants came in ... and the mice came in.
You realize that even though Microsoft employs quite a few programmers in the Bay Area, they only work on PowerPoint.
The phone company installed fiber-optic cable to your home but they can't afford to light it up.
You have more bandwidth inside your home than there is in most major universities.
Dec 8th, 2003, 04:47 PM
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You know you live in the Bay Area when...
Your co-worker tells you they have 8 body piercings but none
are visible.
When someone says TENDERLOIN - you don't think of steak.
Youthink of danger.
You make over $100,000 and still can't afford a house.
You can't remember....is pot illegal?
You've been to more than one baby shower that has two
mothers and a sperm donor.
You have a very strong opinion where your coffee beans are
grown and can taste the difference between Sumatran and
Ethiopian.
A really great parking space can move you to tears.
You know that anyone wearing shorts in April is just
visiting from Ohio.
You assume every company offers domestic partner benefits.
Your boss runs in "The Bay to Breakers"....it's the first
time you have seen him nude.
Your child's 3rd grade teacher has two pierced ears, a
nose ring and is named "Breeze." And, after telling that to a
friend, they still need to ask if the teacher is male or female.
You are thinking of taking an adult class but you can't
decide between yoga, aromatherapy, conversational mandarin or a
building your own website class.
You haven't been to Fisherman's Wharf since the first
month you moved to SF and you couldn't figure out how to drive to
Coit Tower if your life depended on it.
A man walks on MUNI in full leather regalia and crotchless
chaps. You don't notice.
A woman walks on MUNI with live poultry. You don't notice.
You think any guy with a George Clooney haircut must be
visiting from the midwest.
You know that any woman with a George Clooney haircut is
not a tourist.
You keep a list of companies to boycott.
Your hairdresser is straight, your plumber is gay, the
woman who delivers your mail is straight and your Mary Kay Lady
is a guy in drag.
Your co-worker tells you they have 8 body piercings but none
are visible.
When someone says TENDERLOIN - you don't think of steak.
Youthink of danger.
You make over $100,000 and still can't afford a house.
You can't remember....is pot illegal?
You've been to more than one baby shower that has two
mothers and a sperm donor.
You have a very strong opinion where your coffee beans are
grown and can taste the difference between Sumatran and
Ethiopian.
A really great parking space can move you to tears.
You know that anyone wearing shorts in April is just
visiting from Ohio.
You assume every company offers domestic partner benefits.
Your boss runs in "The Bay to Breakers"....it's the first
time you have seen him nude.
Your child's 3rd grade teacher has two pierced ears, a
nose ring and is named "Breeze." And, after telling that to a
friend, they still need to ask if the teacher is male or female.
You are thinking of taking an adult class but you can't
decide between yoga, aromatherapy, conversational mandarin or a
building your own website class.
You haven't been to Fisherman's Wharf since the first
month you moved to SF and you couldn't figure out how to drive to
Coit Tower if your life depended on it.
A man walks on MUNI in full leather regalia and crotchless
chaps. You don't notice.
A woman walks on MUNI with live poultry. You don't notice.
You think any guy with a George Clooney haircut must be
visiting from the midwest.
You know that any woman with a George Clooney haircut is
not a tourist.
You keep a list of companies to boycott.
Your hairdresser is straight, your plumber is gay, the
woman who delivers your mail is straight and your Mary Kay Lady
is a guy in drag.
Dec 8th, 2003, 06:28 PM
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dlai,
Sorry to see that your original post got deleted. Hopefully the nasty culprit won't be back again.
I am a San Francisco native. If you do decide to live in places live Livermore or Pleasanton, as others have said you do have BART as an option to take over to the Peninsula. The only disadvantage is that they are about 40 miles from SF, so it would take about 1.5 hours to commute
Of course I also liked the communities south of SF along the Peninsula. Burlingame, Millbrae, etc. are all close to Caltrain which is very convenient to SF and San Jose as well. Millbrae is about 11 miles south of SF and San Mateo is about 20 miles. Referring to Sf as "the city" is something that only old timers since SF used to the the biggest city and northern California. Since San Jose has ober taken SF in both population and as a jobs center in the past 10 or 12 years many will refer to San Jose as "the city", so it can get a bit confusing.
Best of luck with your relocation.
Sorry to see that your original post got deleted. Hopefully the nasty culprit won't be back again.
I am a San Francisco native. If you do decide to live in places live Livermore or Pleasanton, as others have said you do have BART as an option to take over to the Peninsula. The only disadvantage is that they are about 40 miles from SF, so it would take about 1.5 hours to commute
Of course I also liked the communities south of SF along the Peninsula. Burlingame, Millbrae, etc. are all close to Caltrain which is very convenient to SF and San Jose as well. Millbrae is about 11 miles south of SF and San Mateo is about 20 miles. Referring to Sf as "the city" is something that only old timers since SF used to the the biggest city and northern California. Since San Jose has ober taken SF in both population and as a jobs center in the past 10 or 12 years many will refer to San Jose as "the city", so it can get a bit confusing.
Best of luck with your relocation.
