Disappointed with Hotwire for our Austin Rental Car
Aug 21st, 2014, 12:22 PM
#41
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Patrick:
Airport Access Fee 11.11% $14.54
City Rental Tax 5% $8.76
State Rental Tax 10% $17.52
Surcharge $4.70 per day $23.50
All of the above was in the estimate.
Then there is a part called "Charge Summary" that has the unexpected charges:
CFC (Customer Facility Charge) $5.95 daily $29.75 (So that's the airport's fee, not a Texas fee as I was advised by Thrifty)
TST $4.99 daily $24.95
According to Thrifty those are additional taxes charged (Don't know what that stands for)
Airport Access Fee 11.11% $14.54
City Rental Tax 5% $8.76
State Rental Tax 10% $17.52
Surcharge $4.70 per day $23.50
All of the above was in the estimate.
Then there is a part called "Charge Summary" that has the unexpected charges:
CFC (Customer Facility Charge) $5.95 daily $29.75 (So that's the airport's fee, not a Texas fee as I was advised by Thrifty)
TST $4.99 daily $24.95
According to Thrifty those are additional taxes charged (Don't know what that stands for)
Aug 21st, 2014, 12:52 PM
#42
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OK. So you're saying the BASE price was $175.20. At least that's what the taxes seem to be based on by the percentages. Add those to the base price and it was already another $64.32 added or about $239 for the estimate, since you say they were already IN the estimate. Not the $150 I was estimating if the $50 extra was 33% of the bill. Or am I totally not following those figures?
And sadly those customer facility fees are not all that unusual for airports, but I agree they should have been in any original estimate.
Bottom line. I'd never book a car through Hotwire or any other "discounter" that says "estimate only" when it's going to be billed by someone else. I guess I don't get the idea of dealing with one company telling me what the other company "may" charge me. I have used them when I prepay and their total was much lower than any of the agencies would provide.
And sadly those customer facility fees are not all that unusual for airports, but I agree they should have been in any original estimate.
Bottom line. I'd never book a car through Hotwire or any other "discounter" that says "estimate only" when it's going to be billed by someone else. I guess I don't get the idea of dealing with one company telling me what the other company "may" charge me. I have used them when I prepay and their total was much lower than any of the agencies would provide.
Aug 21st, 2014, 01:16 PM
#44
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schlegal, you really ought to file complaint with the Texas Attorney General as well as with the BBB. The AGs office can actually take legal action against whomever is at fault here, whether Hotwire or Thrifty, to force them to change whatever is resulting in the disconnect—especially since each side seems to be blaming the other (i.e., is Thrift really failing to provide Hotwire with all the right data, or is Hotwire failing to add all the charges Thrifty provides to them?).
Aug 21st, 2014, 02:02 PM
#45
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If you look at the Thrifty site itself and price a car and go to where they itemize all the fees and taxes, they match up what was on the estimate. But their total price includes the "facility charge" of $5.95 a day just like on Schlegal's final bill and also a "fleet recovery" of $4.70 a day (apparently the equivalent of whatever that TST was). So clearly Thrifty adds those figures to their prices right on their contracts. Why they don't pass that on to Hotwire or why Hotwire chooses not to show them, I have no idea.
But I'm also curious. If one prices the option with Hotwire and compares it to pricing it directly with Thrifty -- is there any difference in price? Or is leaving certain fees off the only way Hotwire has to attract people to book with them, thinking their rental will be less than booking direct?
But I'm also curious. If one prices the option with Hotwire and compares it to pricing it directly with Thrifty -- is there any difference in price? Or is leaving certain fees off the only way Hotwire has to attract people to book with them, thinking their rental will be less than booking direct?
Aug 21st, 2014, 02:05 PM
#46
I found similar daily rates. Therefore for comparison shopping, there is no deception. The problem seems to be whey the TX taxes are not loading the estimated total. I'm not convinced that's a Hotwire problem.
Aug 21st, 2014, 02:06 PM
#47
Here are the estimates from the Hertz website -
Rate Details
3 days at 58.65 USD
175.95 USD
Airport concession fee recovery
20.12 USD
Property tax, title/license reimbursement
3.63 USD
Rental Facility Fee
17.85 USD
ENERGY SURCHARGE
1.49 USD
Included
Unlimited Free Miles Included
Vehicle Subtotal
219.04 USD
Taxes
32.85 USD
Total Approximate Charge
251.89 USD
Rate Details
3 days at 58.65 USD
175.95 USD
Airport concession fee recovery
20.12 USD
Property tax, title/license reimbursement
3.63 USD
Rental Facility Fee
17.85 USD
ENERGY SURCHARGE
1.49 USD
Included
Unlimited Free Miles Included
Vehicle Subtotal
219.04 USD
Taxes
32.85 USD
Total Approximate Charge
251.89 USD
Aug 21st, 2014, 09:29 PM
#49
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Gretchen,
A complaint with the consumer affairs division of the Texas AG's office is not a lawsuit. It is a request to investigate business practices that seem suspect.
As schlegal says in the OP, "I spoke with Thrifty about this. They advised that this is a regularly occurring problem and they have advised Hotwire about it."
In a subsequent post schlegal says "There's finger-pointing between Thrifty and Hotwire. Hotwire says they get their info from Thrifty and therefore I should take it up with Thrifty. Thrifty says they have advised Hotwire many times about these Texas-specific taxes because have customers complaining to them daily about it."
It is highly unlikely that both Hotwire and Thrifty are telling the truth here (although I suppose it IS possible that Thrifty thinks it is supplying all/complete info to Hotwire but is unknowingly dropping the ball at some point).
Thus, I advised schlegal to file a complaint with the state agency that makes sure consumers are being treated fairly in Texas. If this is indeed an ongoing issue, then whoever is at fault (be it Hotwire, Thrifty, or both of them) should be called to account, and the erroneous (if not deceptive) practice(s) halted.
That is a far cry from a "lawsuit" in which schlegal might seek compensation for damages from one or both parties. Filing the complaint actually has the potential to benefit many other consumers who might face a similar situation.
A complaint with the consumer affairs division of the Texas AG's office is not a lawsuit. It is a request to investigate business practices that seem suspect.
As schlegal says in the OP, "I spoke with Thrifty about this. They advised that this is a regularly occurring problem and they have advised Hotwire about it."
In a subsequent post schlegal says "There's finger-pointing between Thrifty and Hotwire. Hotwire says they get their info from Thrifty and therefore I should take it up with Thrifty. Thrifty says they have advised Hotwire many times about these Texas-specific taxes because have customers complaining to them daily about it."
It is highly unlikely that both Hotwire and Thrifty are telling the truth here (although I suppose it IS possible that Thrifty thinks it is supplying all/complete info to Hotwire but is unknowingly dropping the ball at some point).
Thus, I advised schlegal to file a complaint with the state agency that makes sure consumers are being treated fairly in Texas. If this is indeed an ongoing issue, then whoever is at fault (be it Hotwire, Thrifty, or both of them) should be called to account, and the erroneous (if not deceptive) practice(s) halted.
That is a far cry from a "lawsuit" in which schlegal might seek compensation for damages from one or both parties. Filing the complaint actually has the potential to benefit many other consumers who might face a similar situation.
Aug 21st, 2014, 09:50 PM
#50
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schlegal,
Call Thrifty and ask if the TST is Tripsaver (their roadside assistance package). It seems (from numerous online postings) that Thrifty has a habit of charging for Tripsaver and not telling customers they are doing it or explaining what it is.
If that's what TST is, and you did not request it and were not advised you were being charged for it, you should be able to get it refunded. (Tripsaver is NOT mandatory.) If they won't do it, then you should (1) dispute that part of the bill with your credit card company if possible and (2) consider filing a complaint with the AG's office over what would appear to be a deceptive practice on the part of that particular Thrifty location (and maybe others). Of course Hotwire would not include it, because it is not mandatory (unlike taxes and the customer facility charge).
As for the CFC, that is a fee that Thrifty should be telling Hotwire about and that Hotwire should be including in their price estimates. Clearly someone is dropping the ball here and should be called to account for it.
Call Thrifty and ask if the TST is Tripsaver (their roadside assistance package). It seems (from numerous online postings) that Thrifty has a habit of charging for Tripsaver and not telling customers they are doing it or explaining what it is.
If that's what TST is, and you did not request it and were not advised you were being charged for it, you should be able to get it refunded. (Tripsaver is NOT mandatory.) If they won't do it, then you should (1) dispute that part of the bill with your credit card company if possible and (2) consider filing a complaint with the AG's office over what would appear to be a deceptive practice on the part of that particular Thrifty location (and maybe others). Of course Hotwire would not include it, because it is not mandatory (unlike taxes and the customer facility charge).
As for the CFC, that is a fee that Thrifty should be telling Hotwire about and that Hotwire should be including in their price estimates. Clearly someone is dropping the ball here and should be called to account for it.
Aug 21st, 2014, 11:02 PM
#51
"Call Thrifty and ask if the TST is Tripsaver ..."
Great detective work!
I'd definitely do what cranachin recommends. Other renters are going to encounter the same problem. It needs to be fixed. My guess is that the problem in on the Thrifty side of things because Hotwire gains no benefit for this glitch. Thrifty does and they have indicated that it's happening to others.
Great detective work!
I'd definitely do what cranachin recommends. Other renters are going to encounter the same problem. It needs to be fixed. My guess is that the problem in on the Thrifty side of things because Hotwire gains no benefit for this glitch. Thrifty does and they have indicated that it's happening to others.
Aug 21st, 2014, 11:25 PM
#52
Thrifty has been doing the TST scam since 2010 -
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/thrif...rip-saver.html
Well, earlier than that - 2009
http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowTopic...oad_Trips.html
At least one lawsuit was filed in 2013 -
http://www.abcactionnews.com/news/lo...ics-and-tricks
So, they (Thrifty) knows what they are doing. The add-on charge is intentional.
Makes one wonder if the CFC charge is "real" or a duplicate of a charge in the quotes fees at the time of booking. I agree with those who say this should be reported.
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/thrif...rip-saver.html
Well, earlier than that - 2009
http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowTopic...oad_Trips.html
At least one lawsuit was filed in 2013 -
http://www.abcactionnews.com/news/lo...ics-and-tricks
So, they (Thrifty) knows what they are doing. The add-on charge is intentional.
Makes one wonder if the CFC charge is "real" or a duplicate of a charge in the quotes fees at the time of booking. I agree with those who say this should be reported.
Aug 22nd, 2014, 05:13 AM
#53
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Ok, I become more and more confused. So I read those complaints about TST being a trip saver or road assistance charge and can only assume that was the $4.99 per day that Schlegal got.
But now when I do a quote it shows "Fleet Recovery" of $4.70 per day.
So does that mean that due to the pending lawsuits against Thrifty, they've just changed the name of that charge from Trip Saver to Fleet Recovery? What does Fleet Recovery mean anyway? But in any case there was no Fleet Recovery Fee on Schlegal's bill and now there is no trip saver charge -- unless that is still added at the counter by Thrifty, and not on the contract?
By the way, I suddenly remember that I haven't used Thrift in years -- but the last time I did, they REQUIRED you purchase a full tank of gas. I balked, protested, and argued, but there was no choice. This was particularly aggravating because I was only doing a one day one way rental and using only about 2 gallons of gas! The full tank pretty much doubled the contracted price of the rental. I don't think they or anyone else now REQUIRES that, but it is offered as an option.
But now when I do a quote it shows "Fleet Recovery" of $4.70 per day.
So does that mean that due to the pending lawsuits against Thrifty, they've just changed the name of that charge from Trip Saver to Fleet Recovery? What does Fleet Recovery mean anyway? But in any case there was no Fleet Recovery Fee on Schlegal's bill and now there is no trip saver charge -- unless that is still added at the counter by Thrifty, and not on the contract?
By the way, I suddenly remember that I haven't used Thrift in years -- but the last time I did, they REQUIRED you purchase a full tank of gas. I balked, protested, and argued, but there was no choice. This was particularly aggravating because I was only doing a one day one way rental and using only about 2 gallons of gas! The full tank pretty much doubled the contracted price of the rental. I don't think they or anyone else now REQUIRES that, but it is offered as an option.
Aug 22nd, 2014, 05:23 AM
#54
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>
I disagree--there is some benefit to them for me booking through them. I don't know what it is but they aren't doing it without some business monetary gain.
I am going to call Thrifty about the TST one and I'll report back.
I agree that they need to fix the problem and will follow up with appropriate complaints--again this was so annoying when talking with Hotwire that they just insisted that it wasn't their fault and didn't need to do anything to fix it. (One of the most interesting parts of this thread to me is that others see this as a Thrifty problem--I don't disagree, I just don't think I should be responsible for fixing their communications problems).
NP : It was a quote for the rental of $151 total (including estimated taxes). My actual bill was $201--your original math was correct. My reference to 33% was meant to relate to the original quote, not the final bill. It was 25% of the total final bill.
And you have summed up my complaint nicely here because that's what it feels like is happening:
>
Though there is some chance the two companies just aren't communicating properly.
I disagree--there is some benefit to them for me booking through them. I don't know what it is but they aren't doing it without some business monetary gain.
I am going to call Thrifty about the TST one and I'll report back.
I agree that they need to fix the problem and will follow up with appropriate complaints--again this was so annoying when talking with Hotwire that they just insisted that it wasn't their fault and didn't need to do anything to fix it. (One of the most interesting parts of this thread to me is that others see this as a Thrifty problem--I don't disagree, I just don't think I should be responsible for fixing their communications problems).
NP : It was a quote for the rental of $151 total (including estimated taxes). My actual bill was $201--your original math was correct. My reference to 33% was meant to relate to the original quote, not the final bill. It was 25% of the total final bill.
And you have summed up my complaint nicely here because that's what it feels like is happening:
>
Though there is some chance the two companies just aren't communicating properly.
Aug 22nd, 2014, 05:38 AM
#55
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Well, here's a weird answer---TST is the "Trip Saver Tax"--it IS roadside assistance but the customer is NOT allowed to decline it. I just asked. Twice.
The representative stated that Thrifty and Dollar both charge it because their Austin location is their only location in all of Texas and it would otherwise cost too much to respond to any roadside problems without this charge (at least $250).
The representative stated that Thrifty and Dollar both charge it because their Austin location is their only location in all of Texas and it would otherwise cost too much to respond to any roadside problems without this charge (at least $250).
Aug 22nd, 2014, 05:41 AM
#56
Thrifty took your extra money, not Hotwire.
This could be deliberate scamming by Thrifty and after reading the links above (and others) last night, they've been getting away with the TST scam for years.
This could be benign negligence having to do with the communication of those charges between Thrifty and Hotwire - but IMO it's Thrifty's responsibility to communicate the appropriate charges to Hotwire.
What possible reason would Hotwire have for misrepresenting the fees for extra charges pocketed by Thrifty? Negative press only hurts Hotwire, not helps them.
This could be deliberate scamming by Thrifty and after reading the links above (and others) last night, they've been getting away with the TST scam for years.
This could be benign negligence having to do with the communication of those charges between Thrifty and Hotwire - but IMO it's Thrifty's responsibility to communicate the appropriate charges to Hotwire.
What possible reason would Hotwire have for misrepresenting the fees for extra charges pocketed by Thrifty? Negative press only hurts Hotwire, not helps them.
Aug 22nd, 2014, 06:04 AM
#57
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OK, so now I'm even more confused on that "imaginary" booking I did yesterday with Thrifty for Austin. There was NO TST listed, but apparently they are still adding that at the counter? And now there is also a $4.70 a day fee for fleet recovery that even Schlegal didn't have added to his bill?
And does anyone want to bet that TST was named that specifically because people would easily assume it stands for Texas State Tax and then not question it? Otherwise wouldn't it be called Trip Saver Fee or something? And why on earth would you call a road assistance program fee "trip saver tax"? I have no doubt there was some deliberate thought in using the letters TST for it!
Anyone who has read all this and still rents a car from Thrifty in Texas should have his head examined!
And does anyone want to bet that TST was named that specifically because people would easily assume it stands for Texas State Tax and then not question it? Otherwise wouldn't it be called Trip Saver Fee or something? And why on earth would you call a road assistance program fee "trip saver tax"? I have no doubt there was some deliberate thought in using the letters TST for it!
Anyone who has read all this and still rents a car from Thrifty in Texas should have his head examined!
Aug 22nd, 2014, 06:25 AM
#58
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<The representative stated that Thrifty and Dollar both charge it because their Austin location is their only location in all of Texas and it would otherwise cost too much to respond to any roadside problems without this charge (at least $250).>
schlegal1 - I don't understand this statement. There are other locations - I was just at DFW and they have locations there...?
schlegal1 - I don't understand this statement. There are other locations - I was just at DFW and they have locations there...?
Aug 22nd, 2014, 06:41 AM
#59
It's a scam. Thrifty has been doing the TripSaver scam for years.
NeoPatrick, good call on the TST = Texas State Tax for easier scamming
I know every airport has that airport fee. My guess is Thrifty is double dipping and charging it twice, just to get more money. Not all franchises are doing it, but some are. SLC was doing it years ago. Seems like Austin is doing it. Imagine the extra revenue generated = $8/day for every rental going out of a franchise. Sweet money for them. Scam for the customer.
NeoPatrick, good call on the TST = Texas State Tax for easier scamming
I know every airport has that airport fee. My guess is Thrifty is double dipping and charging it twice, just to get more money. Not all franchises are doing it, but some are. SLC was doing it years ago. Seems like Austin is doing it. Imagine the extra revenue generated = $8/day for every rental going out of a franchise. Sweet money for them. Scam for the customer.
