bamakelly

Here's another take on the idea:

When I got engaged it was a complete surprise. I had absolutely no idea the ring was coming so I had no input in its selection. (Normally this would have been a bad idea, but in this instacne I fared far better letting him pick it!)

My husband went to a diamond broker well-known in our region (which was then South Florida) who bought his diamonds from NYC -- mostly he dealt with diamond district dealers.

Before buying the diamond, he went to a LOT of trouble to research the 4 C's. (This is ESSENTIAL for you to do for such a big purchase, by the way.) After preparing with his research, he purchased the diamond from the broker, knowing exactly what he might compromise (cut or carat) over what he would absolutely not compromise (clarity or color). This made his selection far more personal: he ended up narrowing the stones down to four, then choosing the one with the best clarity and color for its size and style.

THEN he took it to a local jeweler and had a setting designed to match the stone. He even added a couple extras on the sides to make it sparkle more.

When he proposed to me, I was absolutely stunned by the diamond ring he gave me. I would never have had the nerve to pick something so fabulous for myself. But when I found out what trouble he went to make it something totally tailored to US...his PERSONAL selection fit for ME...well, let's just say I was more than impressed at the lengths he would go to, all for me. And to think I had no idea he'd been working on it for those weeks prior!

Now, while romantic and sweet (I hope you think so, anyway), here's the unfortunate part of our tale-- and the one you should pay most attention to:

When I got my ring sized a few days later, the jeweler who sized it tightened the prongs too much. My stone -- precious and expensive as it was -- BROKE. (Yes, you read that right.)

Thankfully, because, as one eaerlier poster pointed out -- diamonds are a commodity -- and also because my husband did his research and knew what he was talking about, he was able to sell the pieces back to the broker (to be recut into smaller jewelry) and buy another diamond. Same process, same selection criteria: he got the best color and clarity, and chose a style and size that I liked. Fortunately, the broker was able to find a similar stone and my ring #2- which gets complimented almost daily, wherever I go - is stunning. But what if he hadn't known what he was talking about? Insurance, as we found out, will only cover so much, and replacing the stone to equality was risky business for someone who just trusts the jeweler.

I guess my points are these:
--sometimes the effort is worth more than the designer or brand name.
--a diamond is a commodity, not just a fashion statement. And even the most expensive diamonds may not be perfect. Know what you are buying in the event that you must replace it, appraise it, trade it, or whatever in the future.
--And on a personal note, if I just wanted a diamond for the designer name, I'd rather have a Harry Winston than a Tiffany.

bermyguy

Thanks for all of the advice. Just to confirm, my girlfriend will be picking out the ring.

Still pretty undecided to be honest. I mean if it was as simple as having an understanding of the "4 C's", seeing a certificate and then buying the diamond then I would have to wonder what all of the fuss is about?? Everyone should be able to go out and buy great value diamonds!!!

Also, just for the record, were we to choose Tiffanys/H.W. then it wouldn't be a case putting a stamp on her forehead saying "My ring is from Tiffany's"!!! However, people will inevitably ask where you got it as opposed to "is that a VVS1 or VVS2"? Assuming the ring looks well (which I presume is more or less guaranteed with Tiffs/H.W. although if my girlfriend doesn't see something she loves then obviously we won't be purchasing in Tiff's just for the sake of it) then is the monetary value really that important at all? I'm not going into this thinking about how much the ring will be worth in 10 years time or how much I would get for it if we split up!!!!
Marion, I think Irish people are too sentimental...we need to toughen up!!!

LoriNY

I didn't read all the posts so this may have been said before - but at Tiffany's while the experience is wonderful - you are paying for the name. DH and I have always done business with Iannelli Diamonds, 45 W 47th Street(north side of street) in the Diamond district. Fair, reputable, and one year naned in New York magazines best places to buy a diamond in their annual shopping guide. Great guys, have known them for years!Ask for Anthony or Mario

frankdaddy

One thing that needs to be noted is the grade of the stone. There are certain grades the stones come in, and it is based on th 4 c's. You can shop the grade you are looking for. The standard for an investment grade stone is a 1 carat VV1 and it used to be $30,000. That's is how they price the stones, from that investment stone. If you decide on a grade, you can then get a better idea what the each dealer is charging for that grade. You can then decide what grade and budget and have a better idea about prices. When looking at the right stone,and give you the price ask them about the grade. I believe the grade is numerical and if they show you a beautiful stone tell you the price them ask about the grade.It shows you are educated. Also, ask if it is GIA certified. Make sure you get a certificate on the stone as well. GIA stands for Gemological Institute of America. You get a certificate and authenticates the stone quality. I would recommend looking at Empire Diamond in NYC. The only company that is still in the Empire State building since it opened. They advertise as 1 800 SAVE HALF. They will guarantee if you buy a stone from them they will buy it back at the same price from you if you want to sell. All thier stones are GIA Certified and the view is spectacular. They will even let you see the stone under a microscope point out the flaws and give you a certicate of the grading. When I purchased my stone from them I got the best education in Gems for a lifetime. Maybe not as romantic, but believe me I have bought jewelry for many years on 47th Street and do not trust any of them.

sylvia3

Wow! A written guarantee to buy it back? Plus the education--if I wasn't in the business, I'D go there!

Italiano

you can get great free advice and idea about how much each cost go to bluenile .com they have a good artilce about buying diamonds also consider maybe while you are in NYC go to Parmus NJ they have the NJ diamond exchange on rt 4 west and also Fidelity Diamond one of the best on rt 17 south and get a lower sales tax in NJ

BarryK

Sales tax? What's sales tax?

Personally, my wife gets most of her jewelry from a jeweler in the "other" diamond district, near Canal and Bowery. The jeweler was recommended by an acquaintance years ago. The first time we were ready to buy, we took the stone, pre-purchase, to a certified appraiser down the block, just to be sure we were getting what we were told we were getting, and the price was good. I also had a copy of a current Rapaport Diamond Report.

Since then, we've done lots of business with the guy (a family business since the 30's), always a good deal, and always get what we paid for.

Buying jewelry retail (Tiffanys, Macys, etc), is silly, in my opinion. I'd rather save some money than pay 25-50% more for a little blue box. Also, I wouldn't take recommendations from someone you don't know (which is why I didn't give you the name of our jeweler), which includes this board. You never know who is for real and who's a crook or a shill. And even if they are for real, they may not be getting the deal they think they're getting.

Oh, about the sales tax - I live out of NY, so he ships our purchases (or an empty box) to avoid the tax.

TarheelsInNj

Hi bermyguy! I've been following your story, as I replied to your proposal post as well

I may get knocked for this, but I'll say it anyway. If you and your girlfriend are willing to pay for the experience as well as the ring itself, Tiffany may be the right choice for you. You only get engaged once, and if you're not on a strictly tight budget, the memories may be worth it.

I know that you're coming to NYC specifically for a visit and the proposal, and that is all part of the experience. Getting engaged in New York at Christmas time is something magical that you'll always remember, and buying your ring at "The" Tiffany will be a lovely memory as well. This is especially true since you'll be going through the process of visiting the store, shopping, and buying it there together. Therefore the cost is inclusive of more than just the physical ring.

LMWW

I would enthusiastically recommend a trip to Ben Moses in the Diamond District. My family has been going to him for decades, and he is incredibly reputable (several celebrity clients) and fair. He's a sweet old Romanian man, who loves to chat. You will get a lot of personalized attention.

Ben Moses
15 West 47th Street
New York, NY 10036
(212) 221-1017

hunnym

I would recommend against going to Tiffany's if you are NOT going to buy there.

My husband and I went in there when we were ring shopping and we never looked back. We have a family member who's a jeweler and I could have had a much bigger diamond for the same amount of money. In the end we couldn't get the Tiffany ring out of our heads because nothing else compared in terms of style and quality.

We are thrilled with the purchase and those folks who say you're only paying for the name - I disagree. My rings and my husband's band have held up much better than others' platinum bands, as have my rings versus my other platinum rings. You really do get what you pay for. (Also, my understanding is that Tiffany only takes the best diamonds on the market...talk to someone there for info.)

We were also happy with Tiffany's because we felt that there wasn't any shady business going on - their price is their price.

All that said, if you want an "experience" - Tiffany in NYC is not the place. The store is overrun with people who are window-shopping, and some of the staff isn't particularly friendly (and you have to work to get their attention).

hunnym

Bermyguy - perhaps you should look into whether you have to pay duty on the ring? Not sure how customs works between US and Bermuda.

suzanne

I'm with BarryK. My parents have their "guy" on Bowery near Canal that they've been going to for years and years. My mom has the most beautiful engagement ring I have ever seen. Dad goes back every year to get Mom a gift from the same jeweler. You get so much more for your money there.

MarionCK

I thought I'd said all I had to say but you know there's always something to add

Hunnym makes some good points about how crowded it may be at Tiffany or Harry Winston, especially during the holidays.

I would encourage you to go and do some advance work. I'd go straight to the customer service office, and ask them to select a salesperson for you. Discuss budget and perhaps pre-select some rings that make you smile. Set an appointment and make clear the distance you've travelled and that certainly a purchase will be made. This is major money, no matter where you eventually shop, so YOU are entitled to run this show

And since I've shown myself to be the true Type A that I am, I'd take a stroll up to 59th and Central Park, and take a look at the horses and the carriages and make a selection that you think will please and talk to the driver about this special ride No need to stand in line and just *take what you get*.

I'll try to be quiet now.

Marion

walkinaround

>>>>>
We were also happy with Tiffany's because we felt that there wasn't any shady business going on - their price is their price.
<<<<<

the whole diamond racket is, by definition, shady. from the cartel, debeers to the bloody mining origins, to the vulgar diamond industry telling us that the "commonly accepted rule of thumb" is to spend three months salary on an engagement ring. people should smarten up and not follow these phony "traditions" that were wholly dreamed up in a marketing suite.

from a marketing perspective, it is pure genius. make people believe that they just have to buy a diamond for an engagement ring, then make some phony rules about how much people have to spend on that contrived tradition.

sylvia3

I wondered if anyone would bring up that appalling recent commercial (literally) attempt to guilt men into spending more than they can afford for what used to be a symbol of commitment (not pricing love). DeBeers has had a monolpolistic stranglehold on the market for more than 100 yrs, and folks seem to buy into it. I loved that Chuck bought Di a sapphire (tho the end result wasn't all that great...).

MarionCK

Oh for Friday night's sake, let's not turn this into some sort of political discussion.

Some traditions rise above what might be economcally/politically at any given time.

You can call it marketing if you choose, but a symbol of love/betrothment has been around a long time.

There are many who choose something other than a diamond and so it should be...a stone, a symbol to last for generations, something very personal to the couple. And when the children come along, a story to go along with the *ring*...not about its' value or color, but about the love it signifies, and the story !

Marion

jlents

bermyguy, if you want some experienced jeweler advice please e-mail me at [email protected]. I live in nyc, I am diamond certified by GIA(gemological institute of america) and DCA(diamond council of america) and have been in the business for a few years. If not, best of luck with you and your engagement. Josh

Worktowander

One question, Romantic Sir:

Are you absolutely sure she wants diamond solitaire? Some women don't.

I didn't - for me it was all about a very top quality blue-green tourmaline (with two small accent diamonds).

Does she wear any diamonds now? Or does she lean toward emeralds, sapphires, rubies or semi-precious stones in the jewelry she has?

You might want to discreetly feel this question out before your trip and make adjustments to your shopping plans or go ahead accordingly.

(I always told myself that the guy who showed up with a diamond engagement ring wasn't the man for me - because he didn't know me well enough to be asking if that's what he brought).

Bermyguy, you sound great - I'd shop at Tiffany's with you!

GBelle

We too shopped the diamond district downtown for an engagement ring. I chose the style I wanted, we both looked at the diamond (under a microscope not a jeweler’s loop) that would be set in the ring. He didn’t “pop” the question in the store – it was another day in a romantic setting. You aren’t getting engaged in the store, so why does it matter where you buy it.

With the “Tiffany experience” you will likely pay more for a ring than you would in a diamond district store. If you are just starting out, look at the practical side too and see what the additional $$ you are paying at Tiffany will buy for your future. Your honeymoon? Furniture? Downpayment on a house?

In the near future you may be able to buy lab created diamonds that are chemically and physically true diamonds. http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...0212090354.htm
DeBeers will have some competition and the price for diamonds will likely drop.

bermyguy

Thanks for all the help. After analyzing all of the info I think I'll....join the priesthood!!!!