Constructive Criticism?
Sep 24th, 2005, 05:11 AM
#43
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Y'all are very kind, but I have to admit I'm not nearly as patient with the trolls and the wool-gathering questions masking a possible under-troll of controversy ("what is your town's favorite color?"). Am always hoping to see the response that would nip it in the bud, but I think that's logically impossible.
Sep 24th, 2005, 05:50 AM
#44
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Cassandra, thank you -- that was so well said.
Artman, don't you think your response about Hawaii is just a tad patronizing. I know many people who are well-traveled but who haven't been to Hawaii (myself included). Two in particular are my brother-in-law whose lecture circuit that takes him everywhere in the world but who spoke in Hawaii for the first time a few years ago and friends who traveled to Hawaii for the first time on their way to live in Australia for a year. I wouldn't consider these people to be unsophisiticated travelers or, as you so cutely put it, taking a Very Important Trip. On the contrary, these people are so well-traveled that Hawaii is nowhere near the top of their must-see list.
Artman, don't you think your response about Hawaii is just a tad patronizing. I know many people who are well-traveled but who haven't been to Hawaii (myself included). Two in particular are my brother-in-law whose lecture circuit that takes him everywhere in the world but who spoke in Hawaii for the first time a few years ago and friends who traveled to Hawaii for the first time on their way to live in Australia for a year. I wouldn't consider these people to be unsophisiticated travelers or, as you so cutely put it, taking a Very Important Trip. On the contrary, these people are so well-traveled that Hawaii is nowhere near the top of their must-see list.
Sep 24th, 2005, 06:11 AM
#45
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Let's not forget request for acomodations/restaurants that are: 1)"inexpensive", 2) "reasonable", or (most ambiguous) "affordable!
As to Hawaii: Now THOSE questions are THE most inane: "Are there bugs?"; "What can I get for breakfast"; "Can I buy groceries?"; "How can I rent a car?"; etc.
I'm sorry, but I get the distinct impression that the Hawaii bound on this board are not the sharpest tacks among us.
As to Hawaii: Now THOSE questions are THE most inane: "Are there bugs?"; "What can I get for breakfast"; "Can I buy groceries?"; "How can I rent a car?"; etc.
I'm sorry, but I get the distinct impression that the Hawaii bound on this board are not the sharpest tacks among us.
Sep 24th, 2005, 06:53 AM
#47
Almost none of this bothers me. If people ask a question that someone has answered fifty times before, that person should not feel obligated to answer it. If someone asks a question that another person feels is lazy, and it feels like work to answer it, don't answer it. This shouldn't feel like work.
Most of us are doing this for fun. If it feels like people are asking us to do their work for them, it's time for us to find something else to do for fun.
I have no desire to discourage people from posting here, even (and maybe especially!) people for whom this is the first source they check when planning a trip. We can point people to good resources or, if we're feeling creative and want to share our experiences, we can offer advice.
I don't really care if a question is vague. If it is really too vague for me to answer, I won't answer. Or I might ask for more specifics. But why get annoyed that the question was even asked?
I am not bothered when someone asks for a moderate hotel or restaurant. It's a word I use myself, and I understand what people mean by it, or at least what I mean by it. I mean something that is not the most expensive choice available and not the most inexpensive choice, but that offers a good quality/value ratio. I can not tell you my price range because I don't yet know what the options are as prices differ from place to place. I just want to hear what people recommend and then decide for myself if it's too expensive. Sometimes people will describe a place that is a little more expensive than I was thinking about but it might sound worth it for a slight splurge. I'm willing to bet that I'm not the only person who has a similar idea when asking for "moderate" suggestions.
There is an enormous range of experience and personality represented here. We can not assume everyone is like ourselves. Once we have been around a while, we get a feel for specific posters' peronalities. It is dangerous for people to assume that everyone shares the same sense of humor, for instance. So some posts strike me as hilarious while others find them insulting; some posts have me rolling my eyes while other people are laughing out loud.
I am wary of making too many rules or censoring too many types of comments. Once the variety of people posting diminishes, the interest of the board will diminish as well. Let's keep it lively.
Most of us are doing this for fun. If it feels like people are asking us to do their work for them, it's time for us to find something else to do for fun.
I have no desire to discourage people from posting here, even (and maybe especially!) people for whom this is the first source they check when planning a trip. We can point people to good resources or, if we're feeling creative and want to share our experiences, we can offer advice.
I don't really care if a question is vague. If it is really too vague for me to answer, I won't answer. Or I might ask for more specifics. But why get annoyed that the question was even asked?
I am not bothered when someone asks for a moderate hotel or restaurant. It's a word I use myself, and I understand what people mean by it, or at least what I mean by it. I mean something that is not the most expensive choice available and not the most inexpensive choice, but that offers a good quality/value ratio. I can not tell you my price range because I don't yet know what the options are as prices differ from place to place. I just want to hear what people recommend and then decide for myself if it's too expensive. Sometimes people will describe a place that is a little more expensive than I was thinking about but it might sound worth it for a slight splurge. I'm willing to bet that I'm not the only person who has a similar idea when asking for "moderate" suggestions.
There is an enormous range of experience and personality represented here. We can not assume everyone is like ourselves. Once we have been around a while, we get a feel for specific posters' peronalities. It is dangerous for people to assume that everyone shares the same sense of humor, for instance. So some posts strike me as hilarious while others find them insulting; some posts have me rolling my eyes while other people are laughing out loud.
I am wary of making too many rules or censoring too many types of comments. Once the variety of people posting diminishes, the interest of the board will diminish as well. Let's keep it lively.
Sep 24th, 2005, 07:06 AM
#48
Artman, I have found Hawaii one of the more difficult destinations to research actually, don't be so hard on folks. Way tougher to figure out from guidebooks than Europe or Mexico IMO.
Judy, I absolutely agree. There are important (and not so important) questions that should be asked of a lawyer, the airlines you are flying, the government of the country you are going to, the hotel front desk... not us!
Judy, I absolutely agree. There are important (and not so important) questions that should be asked of a lawyer, the airlines you are flying, the government of the country you are going to, the hotel front desk... not us!
Sep 24th, 2005, 07:10 AM
#49
Socialworker, I don't mind the people who ask for advice here having done no research at all yet. Because I feel I can truly give something back to them in the way of good ideas and outline some possibilities. I can be much more helpful in giving suggestions on how to pull together an overall plan for a trip to Europe, than trying to answer one miniscule detail when everything else is in place.
Sep 24th, 2005, 07:26 AM
#50
IMHO there is a little too much jumping down peoples' throats and insulting them if they don't fit into the forum's cliquie standards. Heaven forbid someone doesn't get the joke or asks a little too much. And yes, I admit to doing it a little bit myself. Sometimes bureaucratic web sites can be difficult to navigate. Someone on this web site may have just had the same experience and can guide the questioner with first hand experience.
Sep 24th, 2005, 07:50 AM
#53
If you don't like the question, ignore it.
If you think someone is a troll, ignore him or her.
Some never let go and turn the thread into a stream of insults.
there are no stupid questions."
"Mean spirited mediocrities, especially those with a smattering of learning are the most likely to be opinionated. Only strong minds know how to correct their opinions and abandon a bad position."
-de Sable
If you think someone is a troll, ignore him or her.
Some never let go and turn the thread into a stream of insults.
there are no stupid questions."
"Mean spirited mediocrities, especially those with a smattering of learning are the most likely to be opinionated. Only strong minds know how to correct their opinions and abandon a bad position."
-de Sable
Sep 24th, 2005, 08:10 AM
#55
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Well, many interesting points have been made here and I found many of them helpful, esp Nikki. I would still prefer that people not make their request in a way that strikes me as sounding "entitled" for lack of a better term, but my perspective has been broadened and I appreciate that.
Sep 24th, 2005, 08:18 AM
#56
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I kind of like the vague questions. Not so much because I'm hoping to answer it, but because I read back over posts, old and new, I get the best ideas for future trips for myself from them.
When people are encouraged, or encourage themselves to offer the best of their experiences, it sometimes makes for an enjoyable read and I think the original poster still ends up having to do the research. Could be that they're not as good at decision making or knowing where/how to start.
Good posts Cassandra & Nikki, btw.
).
Sep 24th, 2005, 10:27 AM
#58
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Thanks Nikki, Cassandra, and Clifton. Well said.
I never mind the questions, just sometimes have the energy to answer and sometimes not. Gentle guidelines and suggestions for improving posts are helpful and kind, blasting someone is not.
I like the comparison to chatting with neighbors and simply throwing out questions with each other. Sometimes it helps to think outloud - you get others' impressions and sort your thoughts.
It is great and appreciated when people do some research ahead of time, but sometimes a little direction helps people work in the right direction.
Anyway, I guess I think it is best to either ignore annoying posts or make kind suggestions on how those posts can be improved (and yeah, sometimes I roll my eyes over people's lack of information or outrageously overambitious plans). But, all of us here share a love for travel, and this is supposed to be a fun,informative place for sharing.
Happy travels everyone!
I never mind the questions, just sometimes have the energy to answer and sometimes not. Gentle guidelines and suggestions for improving posts are helpful and kind, blasting someone is not.
I like the comparison to chatting with neighbors and simply throwing out questions with each other. Sometimes it helps to think outloud - you get others' impressions and sort your thoughts.
It is great and appreciated when people do some research ahead of time, but sometimes a little direction helps people work in the right direction.
Anyway, I guess I think it is best to either ignore annoying posts or make kind suggestions on how those posts can be improved (and yeah, sometimes I roll my eyes over people's lack of information or outrageously overambitious plans). But, all of us here share a love for travel, and this is supposed to be a fun,informative place for sharing.
Happy travels everyone!
Sep 24th, 2005, 11:08 AM
#59
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Sometimes I just want to give up! There is another thread that has a title that did not mean anything to me. I clicked it on out of curiosity.
I then posted that if the title related to the question the poster would no doubt get more answers to their question. I tried to post this in the kindest way possible and wished them a beautiful trip.
The original poster answered one person that gave them information (which I could not do) and then referred to negative posts. I assume that meant mine. I give up!
When I was new to Fodor's I so appreciated help from those on Fodor's with more experience. But guess not everyone does.
I then posted that if the title related to the question the poster would no doubt get more answers to their question. I tried to post this in the kindest way possible and wished them a beautiful trip.
The original poster answered one person that gave them information (which I could not do) and then referred to negative posts. I assume that meant mine. I give up!
When I was new to Fodor's I so appreciated help from those on Fodor's with more experience. But guess not everyone does.
Sep 24th, 2005, 11:16 AM
#60
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Hi, LoveItaly. Just checked out that thread. I have a feeling you weren't the poster who was being accused of "negativity". Did you read Maxwell Smart's response? While the point is well taken, you were much more gentle in your approach! I see no reason to feel that you did anything other than try to help.
