leslie cain

i don't understand gigi's idea that it's difficult to "subtract" and find out what the pre-tax total is... it's right on the bill! i'm 27 and live in nyc, and eat out frequently at nice restaurants, where i tip generously. but i have never tipped on the tax! nor does anyone i know! we are not old, we are not cheap, and we are not poor.

George

Please enough of this. Just accept polarization on this issue.

You're cheap if you deduct the tax, by definition, because you're obsessed with pennies or at most a few dollars. And tipping varies from place to place. What's considered appropriate in most markets is cheap in Manhattan.

I too am in my mid-40's and have never met or seen anyone I know deduct or worry about the tax. Sheesh! Not even my 70 year old Mother is so cheap.

Reminds me of a bunch of Florida retirees arguing over a Coke refill.

Finally, I agree with an earlier comment: Who needs the money more? If that $1 you save being cheap is that important to your bottom line, well, then, you should be eating baloney at home. Most waitstaff are young people, many are students, who actually, ACTUALLY need every penny of tip they receive. So please think about that before whipping out your tip calculator to make sure you don't give an extra penny. Cheapness is a sickness, like OCD.

anotherNY'er

I never tip on tax but I think it has nothing to do with being cheap. One can still be very generous and not tip on tax.

x

It really has nothing to do with being frugal or cheap. Consider the situation below
$100 meal + $7.50 tax with an %18 tip is $126.85 (or $19.35tip)
$100 meal before tax but with a %20 tip is 127.50 (or $20 tip)

where's my

Obviously everyone discussing this is under 40. Once you hit 40, you realize the only thing you can SEE on the bill is the grand total in big numbers at the bottom. So you have to tip on the total. Besides, you are now earning enough that 65 cents doesn't matter anyway.

Loserfest

Tip 15-18% for normal service, more for great service OR if you plan on being a regular. Just make your life easier and base it on the total amount for God's sake.

To the above poster: Amazing how some of you just can't get over Bill Clinton. Pretty funny. Move on and quit listening to so much talk radio.

tip

Agree with "former waiter" -- why tip the same for a table of 4 (or 6 or 10) as a table of 2?! A table of 2 is a LOT easier to serve ("When Harry Met Sally" type Sallys excluded). Does opening a bottle of wine for the table of 2 equal getting 4 orders right for the table of 4? No way.

Tip on level of service, not size of the bill. I've tipped a couple of dollars for a cup of coffee in a diner. I've tipped the bus people $10 (keep that bread coming!) and the waiter nothing (where did she GO?!) Now, according to almost everyone here, the diner waitress should have gotten pennies and the waitress at the restaurant (who forgot about us) should have gotten 15%?

I won't be guilted into tipping when it's not due or tipping excessively.

Rachel

You have absolutely zero concept of reality, "tip." Servers' compensation assumes 15% of the total. If you tip anything less, you're effectively stealing from them. Of course, if that's the type of person you are, then you have to live with yourself. But don't come into my restaurant more than once (I'm a manager); we'll be sure to treat you like you treat us. You sow what you reap, jerk.

wow

And you are a manager with that attitude! Your staff must be some of the most pleasant, well trained people around.

toRachel

Tip = To insure proper service
If the staff is worth it I am sure they would recieve it.

marilyn

tip, you sure have a screwy concept of serving larger tables vs. smaller ones! It is a LOT harder to serve larger tables because there are more demands, timing may be different etc. Plus, you are not tipping "the same," if you tip a percentage of the total bill, because the total bills are different. The diner server makes money with faster turnover, or may not in fact make as much as a server in an establishment with higher average checks, but that doesn't mean you tip some amount YOU think is adequate for good service with no relevance to the total tab.

Mom

Rachel, what you are implying is illegal. To discriminate based on tipping is wrong. If that is how someone chooses to tip, that is his/her choice. You also choose a profession in which you just have to deal with it.

klam

marilyn, unless I missed something, I think "tip"'s post explictly recognizes that it is more work to serve larger tables than doubles.

And I tip like that too, often leaving 25%-50% at a diner/greasy spoon place. When 2 of us can eat a hearty breakfast for under $10, why not leave a bit more for the server who was conscientious with coffee refills, water, etc.

Having said that, we eat at all types of places, and often tip 20%. However I am sick and tired of tipping just cuz it's expected of me.

For example, while in San Fran as a tourist recently, I came across the famed Buena Vista Cafe. I decided to go in to have their Irish Coffee and a snack. It was around 3 p.m. on a weekeday and the place was not busy (had patrons but there were still tables available).

My server took the time to coo and ahhh over the next table's baby, and check several times with the four ladies seated at the table behind me.

For me, she took my order while walking away from the table, brought my drink, and laid the shrimp salad sandwich down while turning away. Never checked back with me (I would have liked a bottle of ketchup for the fries), and she asked if "that's everything?" from a whole table away...I had to look around to see if someone was talking to me. She took absolutely no interest in me as a patron.

The point of my long story? She was the last straw. As soon as I walked out the door, I regretted leaving her the standard 15% tip.

I will no longer be guilted into leaving a 15% tip when the server clearly gives me inferior service.

So I actually agree with "tip's" philosophy. If all the server does is indifferently bring me the food I order, then they have done their minimum work, and they will earn the minimum...their base wage plus less than 10% from me.

I know all sorts will call me cheap, etc., but I'm tired of being taken advantage of.

marilyn

I guess I was trying to convey that tipping as a percentage of the total bill automatically means you are not tipping "the same" for different size parties. Yes, I also tip more for outstanding service, especially when viewed as a percentage of the total on a small tab, but my MINIMUM is 15% except for lousy service, which frankly I don't seem to encounter near as often as some of the previous posters.

Kelly

Klam, I don't think you're cheap, in fact, I think you should have left her your loose change to really illustrate the point. I was in Manhattan in March, my friend and I went into Hooligans, a standard bar/restaurant. It was totally dead inside, middle of a work day. The waitress was pathetic. I asked her how much a margarita was, she said "about 8.00" I repeated "oh, 8.00, huh?" She then stated quite defensively, "I don't decide on the price you know!". I said "I know". She was in her early twenties and on the flaky side.
My friend ordered a margarita, I ordered a small ceasars salad, nothing major, right? She brings the items to our table, leaves, and doesn't even offer to get me any silverware! I had to ask some busboy walking by if we could please have some silverware. Then she asked from about two tables over if everything was alright (in a automated tone, I might add) I said "Uh, no you forgot my silverware" She said "oh, sorry." When she brought the check I told my friend we weren't going to give this loser a dime. We ended up giving her the change from the bill, about 52 cents. She sucked and she deserved to know it!!!

It's about time we customers take control of the whole tipping situation. I hate feeling goaded into tipping, it should represent good service, as everyone has stated here. I am a great customer. I am polite, I don't demand and get nasty. I always say, I could never be a waitress, so I appreciate when I get a good one, which is usually the case. But the bad ones need to learn that their behavior will not be rewarded with my hard earned dough!

Rachel

Fact: Cheap lousy tippers are quickly identified at restaurants and treated differently than their more generous counterparts.

You call for a reservation on a busy night. Last time you left exactly 15%, to the annoying and neurotic pre-tax penny. Do you expect to get a decent table, if you get one at all? No way.

A cramped table near the restrooms opens up. Who gets it? The cheap rude people or the patrons known for nice gratuities? You guessed it.

A chicken breast falls on the kitchen floor. Who gets it? That's right. Enjoy.

Someone "accidentally" drools into a bowl of soup. You asked for it, tightwads. Lap it up!

I said it once and I'll say it again, YOU GET WHAT YOU GIVE!! DEAL WITH THAT!!!

Curious

So Rachel? If you are so proud of what you do, where do you work? Maybe your owner would like to know how you treat his guests.

xxx

She won't tell. She knows what she does is wrong even at the truckstop she works at.

Tommy

Rachel, how long did you take to learn to say "would you like to super size your order?"

xxx

LMAO!! And to think, it was only last year when she was saying "Paper or plastic?"