Gerald

As a regular reader of the European Fodor discussion site, I seldom wander across to the US site.
I must say that in reading several of the postings here, I'm a bit perplexed about something. Why is it that Americans seem to be so intolerant of one another, and so critical of their own major cities? And all the bickering about rudeness and child behavior. Lots of anxiety afoot, it seems.
Seems that many are quite discontent with the status of things over there.
Any thoughts?

mimi taylor

I suspect, Gerald, that the ones who are the most intolerant are the ones who "haven't been around the block. I have relatives who are bigots, refuse to try different foods, and don't respect people's difference. All don't travel and the minds are closed.

Abigail

I think I may understand some of your confusion. I went to University of London as a political science major and was amazed at the lack of challenging discussions in classes. It wasn’t that the ideas were not there it was just unacceptable for students to oppose the professor. Students where rarely asked what they thought at all so we did not have an exchange going on between us unless class was over. The professors focused more on memorization than conceptual understanding/development so the classes left no room for discussion. At my home institution, I was encouraged to challenge the professor and students, this helped my teachers to see my command of the material.. In any event that is what you see happening in this forum, people are having opinions, exchanging ideas, being passionate about travel, this can be a good thing. Just a different way, I am sure there are merits to each style.

jim

This is something I'm always explaining to my Canadian relatives: Rather than being a melting pot, the US is a salad. We have so many people with such different backgrounds that conflict just seems natural. However, you may have noticed, we can get consolidated when an outsider criticizes us. Which means it's OK for us to say that our president is an idiot, but you better not.
P.S. Apropos of nothing, has anyone noticed that Gerald's last name is that same as the boy's who got attacked by the shark in Florida?

Spider

In the US it seems that almost everyone has access to the internet, and therefore everyone can provide an opinion. I'm sure in Europe the boards/forums will be just as obnoxious when the hooligans increase their numbers in cyberspace.

Joyce

I regularly read a European newspaper and the opinions from the readers are as obnoxious, rude, intolerant, etc. as anything you read in the U.S., but, just as here, they'll all stick together when someone living abroad says something about their country. We're all pretty much the same.

Marie

Gerald, there's not a lot to add to Abigail and Jim's most excellent postings. You should have been around last November and December when we were attempting to elect a president -- even this travel board got caught up in hundreds of postings. We are our own biggest critics, but as Jim pointed out, we sure can stick together in a hurry when we are criticized by outsiders. - America is a pretty neat place to live, Gerald, and despite our complaining (at the moment we are grousing about the weather) most of us love it. Thanks for the interesting post. Marie

chuck

Gerald,

Interesting observation. I live in North Carolina (US, in case our great state's reputation hasn't made it across the border). I catch myself feeling discontent quite a bit. And in the grand scheme of things, I probably don't have a right to complain. Perhaps part of my problem is perspective--I forget how good I have it in the US and what a generally comfortable life I have.

On the other hand, perhaps it is just an American trait to complain and criticise. Also, I sense that while physical/economic life is, for some but by no means all, quite comfortable in the US; culturally and philosophically my impression is that the US is lacking. Or at least I find myself more comfortable with some of the non-US (mainly European) attitudes and values that too seldom trickle into my American conscious.

Bottom line, I think a lot of Americans chase financial success but are unhappy doing so. We sacrifice other components of our lives (sometimes knowingly and sometimes unintentionally)and that creates an underlying unhappiness. From this unhappiness or dissatisfaction comes a lot of sniping and hostility. At least that's the way it looks to me. Cheers!

MyNeckIsRed

Aaaahhh, shaddup, ya stinkin' limey!

Judy

So funny Jim I am a serious liberal but frequently find my self defending conservative U.S. presidents abroad. It's like they are attacking my family or something,I always have to laugh at this. I have not been abroad with Bush in office yet, I think he just might be the last straw.

Roger

Americans aren't as accepting of their political class as Europeans, who tend to be sheep. On one hand, Americans wouldn't accept having their elites shoving something like the European Union down their throats like the Europeans have. On the other hand, massive Third World Immigration is being shoved down our throats by the elites even though 75-80 % of Americans oppose the Open Doors policy. Politicians are genuinely hated in America. We're more free; no bogus "hate speech" laws like in Canada, France or Germany. We're very regional yet mobile at the same time. My Midwestern father-in-law despises Southerners; as a Southerner, I don't like him and find Ohio the dullest place on the globe filled with fat people whose greatest love is to wash and wax their "cairs." Analyzing the county-by-county presidential totals of the last election shows a country at cultural and regional war with itself. The Gore counties and the Bush counties have two radically different worldviews.

AmericanAndProud

Americans are descendants of renegages, hooligans, slave traders, risk takers, revolutionists etc. What do you expect?? A bunch of namby-pamby wimps!! No sireee. We Americans are a feisty lot and damn proud of it. When the American people get a bee in their bonnet about something--watch out!

Leone

Judy, I can empathize about defending our Presidents abroad, but the best policy with W. is just to avoid the issue. He is gradually turning the Presidency and the US into a second-rate experience ... and as one example, I suggest the view of many in the middle east that the US voice is practically unheard there these days, in a time of violence and insanity. Take a look at W. each time the camera alights ... he is always laughing. What is this man laughing at? He is desensitizing us to failure and low expectancy, and the US is going to pay a price for him. I just bet we are going to look back and wonder how we accepted such a second-rate guy in the White House ... this man who is currently on his way to establishing a new record for longest vacation taken by a modern US Prsident. At last count by the Post, he has been on vacation 25 percent of his time in office. I am not a Bush basher, but he is embarrassing us, and I just wonder what shape the US will be in when it finally wakes up after eight years of George. Gosh, he makes even his dad look fabulous ... can you believe it. Gerald and Ron were giants by comparison. Can you imagine $10M for W's memoirs? You could get the same insights in a Mad comic. Ciao

Ohioian

Roger, Your take on Ohio is dead wrong pal. There are plenty of sophisticated people in Ohio. You have to look further than your relatives trailer park! Don't knock a place until you have been there. When you visit Cleveland, Cincinnati, Columbus and the rest of the state and quit relying on your prejudices then you can say something about Ohio.

Bush

Leone, I can tell you why he's laughing. He has no clue what is going on in the world. If I went on as many vacations and did as little work as he does, I'd be clueless and happy too. (By the way, you never see old Dick smiling, do you.)

L

Nope, I'm the one with the trailer park relative in Columbus, and the "bashing" I gave to Comulmbus weeks ago was deserved, but modest and restrained. Ciao

Ohioian

L-Columbus didn't deserve to be bashed because you didn't see more than the fence at the trailer park. I might add that trailer park is in one of the worst areas of town. You should know better to judge a town by a trailer park. I think you owe the people of Columbus a humble aplogy...

trythis

If Fodors identified each post by the poster's electronic ID (either via cookie, IP address or some other non-registration method), I suspect we would see multiple postings by one person (multiple times) on some of these more intolerant threads.

I know I have posted under different names during some of the more fun postings (trolls). Afterall it is just for fun. It feels like a collective writing exercise for some B rated screenplay.

Roger

Dear Mr. Ohio,
Father-in-laws' town of Wadsworth is very upper middle class with an old fashioned Middle West downtown, a couple of blocks of brick road, a giant high school football stadium larger than most Division III football stadiums. He does not live in a trailer but in a deluxe 4 bedroom home.

xxx

OK, I admit that I voted for Bush and His performance so far has been less that stellar, but would it have been any better with Bore, I mean Gore in office. The really sad part is that out of 300 million americans it came down to a choice of these two. I guess the really intelligent people of this country would not want the job.