Tourism Leakage

Old Feb 27th, 2023, 11:48 AM
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Excellent post, P.M. And travel styles may very well change with experience as well as age.
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Old Feb 27th, 2023, 02:48 PM
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Originally Posted by carolyn View Post
Excellent post, P.M. And travel styles may very well change with experience as well as age.
That's happening with me.
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Old Feb 27th, 2023, 02:49 PM
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Guess I'm the only one who thought this was going to be about failure to heed the "don't drink the water" advice. BTDT
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Old Feb 27th, 2023, 03:01 PM
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As to the actual post, I think it's got to be up to local government to figure out how best to deal with travel operators and then DO those things. And to higher levels of government to get out of their way. Someone needs to be looking out for the long term well being of those living there.

If locals are going to sacrifice their peace or their infrastructure, there's got to be a return on investment and a way to extract those costs from those that damage those things. Maybe restricting bus parking to easily controllable areas so that they must go through some sort of substantial payment system to make the place a practical stop. Or charging a steep exit fee to deboard a cruise ship. Resorts should be taxed to an amount that offsets their drag on the local economy. I'm at a bit of a loss how you'd fight group discounting at hotels and restaurants though or even if you should. Maybe go after outside ownership instead of discouraging successful business practices,

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Old Feb 27th, 2023, 03:09 PM
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Originally Posted by scrb11 View Post
Especially with cruise ships, yeah they're not dining as much in local restaurants or staying in local hotels, not only not paying the hoteliers but also not paying the hotel taxes. But it seems undeniable that a lot of businesses organize around cruise ship arrivals.
A lot of cruisers fly in early, spend money on hotels and restaurants at the departure port. A lot of cruisers shop and eat in port, hire independent tour guides, use Uber and taxis, pay admission fees at museums, and sometimes splurge out more than cheapo tourists who fly in on budget airlines and perhaps stay in hostels or international chains. A lot (if not most) cruise ship excursions (those you book with the ship) are contracted out to local tour companies and use local transport and restaurants.

That's in addition to the income that goes to the cruise crew who are often from impoverished countries and send a good chunk of their salaries back home.

As far as taxes, a lot of ports impose taxes and fees at each port of call.

Last edited by mlgb; Feb 27th, 2023 at 03:11 PM.
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Old Feb 27th, 2023, 03:27 PM
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I'd think at that point, tourists haven't actually become cruisers (or staff) until they've boarded and set sail. In the originating city, they're just visitors like everyone else. It's the next stop(s) on the route that'll get the brunt of it.

It seems like if the locals in cruise port stops aren't realizing the benefits they'd like from the visits, then maybe either the port fees on cruise passengers are too low; or there should be an additional price to deboard and enter the city; or the benefits of allowing cruise ships (and maybe big bus tours too) aren't reaching as many people as they should.

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Old Feb 27th, 2023, 04:01 PM
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Originally Posted by TDudette View Post
I do object to hordes of people descending from a massive ship; feels like overfishing.
Me too.
I have a photo of a cruise ship that looks like it landed in a pasture on St. Croix.
We were headed down from the hills to shop in town for jewelry. When we saw the cruise ship was in, we turned around and waited for another day.
Now I wonder if I would enjoy a cruise...but I don't want to be one of those people in the crowd that swamp shops in small places.
Still struggling with that.
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Old Feb 28th, 2023, 02:33 AM
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Originally Posted by P_M View Post
We all have a travel style to suit our needs. Seeing the world is such a joy, and there's no right or wrong way to do it.
I'd like to agree with you P_M but I made a lot of mistakes on my trip to Paris. I guess the mistakes give me stories to tell.
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Old Feb 28th, 2023, 02:53 AM
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Originally Posted by mlgb View Post
Don't get me started on the cheap British airlines like Ryanair and Easyjet, not to mention the proliferation of Instagram "travelers".

It was the British who invented mass tourism according to Wikipedia (Thomas Cook). Because it's affordable to the "masses".
exactly what is wrong with flying from A to B more cheaply?
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Old Feb 28th, 2023, 05:42 AM
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Originally Posted by dfrostnh View Post
I'd like to agree with you P_M but I made a lot of mistakes on my trip to Paris. I guess the mistakes give me stories to tell.

they also give information about how to do it better next time.
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Old Feb 28th, 2023, 07:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Dukey1 View Post
exactly what is wrong with flying from A to B more cheaply?
It certainly contributes to over-tourism with its attendant problems.
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Old Feb 28th, 2023, 07:13 AM
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[QUOTE=Fra_Diavolo;17442349]It certainly contributes to over-tourism with its attendant problems.[/QUOTE

oh ok letís make it harder and more expensive to get to the place you want to go even if you already live there
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Old Feb 28th, 2023, 07:27 AM
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See the excellent doc 'The Venice Syndrome'. It addresses this issue head-on through the lives of 5 disparate Venetians.
It'll get ya to thinkin'.

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Old Feb 28th, 2023, 07:28 AM
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I am talking about the hordes of tourists for example in Portugal. Probably 80 people in line were from cruise tours (which one can tell from their badges) and the other 500 had gotten there some other way, like Ryan Air. It's mostly the Brits going on their cheap package holidays.
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Old Feb 28th, 2023, 07:29 AM
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[QUOTE=Dukey1;17442350]
Originally Posted by Fra_Diavolo View Post
It certainly contributes to over-tourism with its attendant problems.[/QUOTE

oh ok letís make it harder and more expensive to get to the place you want to go even if you already live there
We're talking about it in the context of "tourism leakage."
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Old Feb 28th, 2023, 08:02 AM
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As somebody who has used Ryanair, Wizzair and EasyJet several times, I'm feeling defensive here. Hey, if I had the means, I'd gladly pay the cost of a ticket on a major airline to get from one city in Europe to another; but I don't, so there we are.

The budget airlines may not be a barrel of laughs (or a gathering of Luis Vuitton-carrying travelers staying in spacious suites at 16-star hotels where the staff waits on them hand and foot and treat them like they're royalty), but I, for one, am glad they exist.
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Old Feb 28th, 2023, 08:07 AM
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I like Iceland's rules. They only have a limited number of hospital emergency beds, so will not allow more than one ship above a certain size into the full international waters so they can manage an emergency.
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Old Feb 28th, 2023, 02:16 PM
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[QUOTE=LucieV;17442364]As somebody who has used Ryanair, Wizzair and EasyJet several times, I'm feeling defensive here. Hey, if I had the means, I'd gladly pay the cost of a ticket on a major airline to get from one city in Europe to another; but I don't, so there we are.]

Yeah, It's been awhile, but I've also used Ryanair a couple of times, and don't feel bad about it. If local governments have an issue with over tourism then they need to address the problem, rather than blaming budget airlines. Until then I'll weigh if the extra cost is worth it for a major airline or find a more economical option. For Portugal, I choose to fly TAP which was much more budget friendly than the alternatives. I'd rather spend my money at the destination.


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Old Mar 1st, 2023, 09:06 AM
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Then they suggest you solve tourism issues by going someplace you don't want to go instead of the place that has the things you want to see

OK, that is really funny!!!
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Old Mar 1st, 2023, 04:34 PM
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Originally Posted by suze View Post
Then they suggest you solve tourism issues by going someplace you don't want to go instead of the place that has the things you want to see

OK, that is really funny!!!
Yeah, I like that one, too. Canned lima beans are not a substitute for fresh asparagus.
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