chimes0709

Here's a thought -

We add half or 3/4th of a day to Bogota by taking a later flight from Bogota to Cartagena on 18 Dec or an earlier flight on 19 Dec (depending on prices).

Stick to the flight from Cartagena to Medellin and land at 9.50 am on 22 Dec, take bus/taxi straight to Jardin. Stay over night and the next day. Then take bus to Guatapé and come back for the night to Medellin on the 24th (probably stay close to the airport just to sleep). Still have to do our crazy travels out of Colombia on the 25th but can spend time in towns we are keen on vs. Medellin itself.

Thoughts?

mlgb

Was that flight on the 25th all that was available on your miles? If moving it isdifficult would they let you change it to just Bogota to Salvador?

If you keep Medellin you might include a tour of the Christmas Lights.

Not sure if flights are going to be difficult to book leading up to Christmas holidays.

crellston

FWIW my take on VdL versus Jardin was that the former, although very quaint, is a fair bit larger and, being quiet close to Bogota, attracts a lot of weekenders. Weekdays, a lot of the restaurants close down and it is a lot quieter. It takes around 2.5 hours by bus to Bogota bus station. The main "attraction" is the massive plaza. Some nice walks out and around the town. A lot of people were jumping off the bus at the airport on the way back to Bogota so maybe that could work for you. Zipiquira is also on that side of town which could be worth considering.

Jardin is a lot smaller and being harder to get to, sees fewer visitors. It takes 3-4 hours by bus probably less by taxi. Lovely place! Enjoyed just hanging out in the main square in the evenings watching the cowboys and their horses, te cable car and the caves were also excellent.

As I recall the airport is quite close to the centre of the city so there possibly no need to stay near the airport.

chimes0709

Quite convinced about spending 2D/1N in Jardin and will modify our Medellin reservations. Will skip Villa de Leyva. A bit confused about our 3rd day in the area - would still love to visit Guatapé and come back to Medellin for a Christmas Eve dinner on 24 Dec. Not sure what the best way to get from Jardin to Guatapé is. Should we just return from Jardin to Medellin on 23rd night and do a day trip to Guatapé on the 24th? Are we making it to hectic? Should we skip Guatapé? The view from El Peñol looks divine and the colours of the city are stunning to make us not want to miss this little town. Any help here will be great.

crellston

I think you are making it a little hectic, but nothing wrong with that. Guatapé is on the other side of Medellin from Jardin and would likely be better visited as a day trip from there. We decided to skip Guatapé but whether we made the righ5 decision, I we may never no (unless we return!)For Xmas eve In Medellin, I would consider staying somewhere Inn Poblado. A little touristy but I think that is where it will all be happening in terms of restaurants etc.

Bus travel does take time in Colombia, not just the travel time but the waiting around and finding time too, plus getting to and from bus stations. If I recall correctly, I think yestravel hired a car and driver for part of her trip a year or two ago - http://www.fodors.com/community/sout...o-colombia.cfm hopefully she may see this thread! It may be expensive, but could be the best option.

chimes0709

Thank you all for such thoughtful feedback and comments. Here's where we landed on our Colombia itinerary -

(Arriving in Bogota at 2:21 am on 16 Dec (after traveling for ~40 hours from Singapore) so the first half of the day is defunct)
16 Dec - Bogota
17 Dec - Bogota
18 Dec - Cartagena
(LATAM Airlines from Bogota to Cartagena at 12:14 PM, arriving in Cartagena at 1:38 PM on 18 Dec)
19 Dec - Cartagena
20 Dec - Cartagena
21 Dec - Medellin (husband's birthday)
(Avianca from Cartagena to Medellin at 11:20 AM, arriving in Medellin at 12:33 PM on 21 Dec)
22 Dec - Day trip to Guatapé (optional), overnight in Medellin
23 Dec - Bus/taxi to Jardin, overnight in Jardin
24 Dec - Day in Jardin, back in Medellin for X'Mas Eve dinner and overnight
25 Dec - Departing Medellin at 6:00 AM for Salvador via Bogota and Sao Paolo - insanely long day of travel

Looking hectic but we get to cover everything we'd like to.

Would love suggestions for the following -

1. Nice spot for dinner and drinks (can be two separate places) for my husband's birthday on 21st Dec in Medellin - any good party spots? Low down on night life in general can be helpful - nothing super wild but a good vibe will be appreciated.

2. Accommodation options for Jardin - I have Hotel La Casona tentatively booked but it sounds like it's in an noisy area close to the city square. Any feedback on this? We'd like to stay in a bustling area but less noisy is better for restful sleep

3. Good spot to enjoy christmas eve dinner and enjoy the Christmas lights/decorations on 24th Dec in Medellin

4. Overall suggestions for clothing as per the weather at the time across our various locations in Colombia

5. Any good chocolate factories/cocoa farms/chocolate tours/cafes in any of the locations we are visiting?

6. Will do some research on bars and restaurants for Cartagena separately but any not-to-miss suggestions are always welcomed!

Thank you so much for helping shape our trip so well.

P.S. crellston, your own blog and you linking me to yestravel's trip reports has been super helpful! you may get more questions from me in due course

crellston

1.El Poblado in Medellin is where most of the upscale restaurants, bars and clubs are situated. A pretty safe area at night and sound like what you are looking for. We were saying in a different part of te city so I hesitate to recommend anywhere specific, but we did have some good meals there. Mondongos is a Medellin institution (for its tripe soup!). Bandeja Paisa is the cholesterol busting antiquoian regional dish.

2. We did look at a few hotels in Jardin as we turned up on spec. Hotel La Casona was one that looked just fine but we settled on Hotel Valdivia Plaza on the opposite side of the Plaza. Didn’t find it that noisy apart from the layout - both being colonial style courtyard buildings te noise of other guest can echo around a lot but that is th case all over South America- I always travel with ear plugs as a precaution!

The plaza is buzzing in the late afternoon and evening but restaurants tend to close quiet early and the noise wasn’t at all a problem when we were there ( and for me it often can be!) . The horses can make quiet a noisy when thy start dancing on th cobbles but that is one of th main reasons for visiting.

3. I would imagine El Poblado is good for this

4. Should be warm and sunny for most places. Cartagena was one of the hottest places we have been in South America!!

5. -

6. http://cafehavanacartagena.com Is definitely worth a visit. So many bars and restaurants to choose from but we enjoyed an alfresco beer in the plaza near our hotel in Gethsemane, some decent bars on and around that Plaza and some ok street food stalls to. KGB Bar in the old town was just plain weird but ok for a quick drink.

Glad to be of help chimes, Yestravel’s input was invaluable when planning our trip.

chimes0709

Thanks for the amazing tips, Crellston. Now picking up on some of the advice you had provided earlier on Peru to get more specific. So here's what we are working with -

5 Jan - Avianca AV837 from Lima to Cuzco (arriving 12:24 pm) + transfer to Olly
6 Jan - Sacred Valley
7 Jan - Sunday markets in Pisac and Chinchero
8 Jan - Machu Picchu
9 Jan - Cuzco
10 Jan - Cuzco
11 Jan - Peruvian Airlines P9331 from Cusco to La Paz at 7:50 AM

Questions -
1. Should we take the train from Olly to AC late evening on 7 Jan or morning of 8 Jan?
2. We want to stay 1 night in AC for sure. However, if we take the train from Olly to AC late evening on 7 Jan and the return on late evening of 8 Jan, we don't get to enjoy the train ride during the day even once. Are two nights too many in AC?
3. What's a good place to stay in Olly, AC and Cusco? What's that hotel in Olly that has a train station of its own?
4. Best way to transfer from Cusco to Olly and back - bus or taxi? What's faster? And what prices are we looking at?
5. Are we rushing too much? We obviously want to see all the ruins and sights but we don't want to get "ruined out" either. We don't have to see everything and can take it easy too. What suggestions do you have for us to pace ourselves in Olly and Cuzco during our 2 days at each of the places?

crellston

It is not that you are rushing too much but more that the places you want to visit are in the wrong order. I think perhaps this is because you are intent on visiting Pisac and Chinchero on the Sunday?

The main sights of the Sacred Valley are strung out along the road between Cusco and Ollantaytambo. Moray, Maras and Chinchero are all worth visiting and could be incorporated into the journey to Ollantaytambo or back to Cusco. Allow around 4-5 hours to cover those sights in one trip. Longer if you want.

Transport www.taxidatum.com is a good reliable outfit at reasonable prices. As I recall $60_75 for the Olly /Cusco trip with stop offs. Another option is to ask you Hotel in Cusco or Ollantaytambo for a quote. If your Spanish is ok, negotiating direct with taxi driver will be cheaper, but you run the risk of getting a dodgy driver ( a lesson we learnt the hard way years ago!). A Collectivo (small bus) costs around 12 soles from Cusco to Ollantaytambo but you would need to get from the airport to the station in town by taxi which takes extra time and money.


Personally, I would prefer to visit Pisac from Cusco. A great day out is to get the bus ( or a taxi) to Pisac first thing, explore the ruins and then get the bus or a taxi back to Cusco jumping off at Tambo Machay and then take the Inca paths back down to Sacsayhuaman via Q’enko, Puka Puccara and then into Cusco. A easy walk downhill which takes about 3 hours. A full day out with some great views of the mountains and Cusco from above.

In Ollantaytambo we stayed last time in La Casa Del Abuleo Riverside. Nice place. App Lodge is good and El Alberque on the railway station gets good reviews but is quite a walk out to the village centre. The hotel that has its own station is Tambo de Inka and is in Urumbamba not Ollantaytambo.

I think two nights in AC is too many. Long time since I have been and apparently it has improved from the dump that it used to be. However it only exists as a departure point fro MP and has few attractions IMO. You will be surrounded by wonderful scenery and whilst the train ride has some nice views there are much better around and I would not worry too much about the views. Be aware tha5 in Jan and Feb part of the train ride COULD be replaced by a bus if the track get washed out etc.

Pacing yourself is important if only because of the altitude. Take it easy, esp. on your first couple of days. The visit to Pisac and Sacsayhuaman is easily a full day. The major Bolleto touristico sights in Cusco will likely take another full day but it is also the sort of place to hang out, grab a beer in in the Plaza de Armas. There are a couple,of Market that are worth a visit and wandering the streets of San Blas is a great way to spend some time. You won’t get bored!

Ollantaytambo is clearly tiny in comparison with Cusco but again, a couple of hours exploring the town will provide a great insight into a living Inca town. The main ruins are best visited in the early morning before the tour buses arrive. The store houses across on Wirichoa can be left until the afternoon. Early morning and late afternoon are great for photographs when the sun is shining on the relevant parts.

There are some nice walks or rides out of Ollantaytambo and also a weaving coop somewhere nearby (mlgb will know the details) Sorry I can’t be more specific I am in Vietnam at the moment without access to my notes.

odie1

"1. Should we take the train from Olly to AC late evening on 7 Jan or morning of 8 Jan?"
-I would take the train the night before. The train scenery was fine but not worth fretting about that you will be missing something unseen elsewhere.

2. We want to stay 1 night in AC for sure. However, if we take the train from Olly to AC late evening on 7 Jan and the return on late evening of 8 Jan, we don't get to enjoy the train ride during the day even once. Are two nights too many in AC?
-Yes two nights are too many. The town is very geared toward tourists and is really not too charming at all. Olly was far nicer. The train scenery was fine but not worth fretting about that you will be missing something unseen elsewhere.

3. What's a good place to stay in Olly, AC and Cusco? What's that hotel in Olly that has a train station of its own?
-We loved Apu Lodge (crellston had a typo above I believe). El Auberge is right at the train station in Olly but it is not its own private station but is located right at the station. We stayed at Apu Lodge for our three nights in Olly, then Aguas Calientes for one night and then Auberge on our return because it was so convenient and we knew we were going to be exhausted.

4. Best way to transfer from Cusco to Olly and back - bus or taxi? What's faster? And what prices are we looking at?
-Agree with crellston-taxi datum is the way to go-not very expensive and includes all the stops. They have a website that quotes all the prices right there.

5. Are we rushing too much? We obviously want to see all the ruins and sights but we don't want to get "ruined out" either. We don't have to see everything and can take it easy too. What suggestions do you have for us to pace ourselves in Olly and Cuzco during our 2 days at each of the places?
-The weaving coop crellston refers to is up in the mountains from Olly. It is a long drive and you do go higher up in elevation but it was great. The organization is called Awamaki. Charleston is correct in trying to do both Sunday markets seems redundant and they are not really close to each other. We did not attend any of the Sunday markets but there are smaller markets set up in Olly, AC, Cusco etc and people selling their goods everywhere. I loved Chincheros when it was quiet on the green with just a few ladies selling goods. I think I would rethink that day not to mention if you have troubles with elevation you may want your first day to be quiet.

Like crellston mentioned, you could have taxi datum make a stop in Pisac on the way to Olly and then on the way to Cusco you could make the stops in Moray, Maras, Chincheros.

chimes0709

Super super helpful! We were certainly planning the order of things because of the Sunday markets. If those are not critical must-visit spots, we can certainly move things around. Do we need to apply for any permit/entry pass for MP or any part of our Sacred Valley itinerary? I'll take time to soak in the info provided by crellston and odie1 and come back with more questions, if any. Huge thanks for the taxi tip!

By the way, I need some tips on clothing for our overall itinerary. We are in Colombia (Bogota/Cartagena/Medellin/Jardin) in December followed by Salvador/Rio/Buzios in Brazil, then Peru with Cusco/Olly/MP/AC/Sacred Valley, followed by La Paz and Uyuni salt flats for 3-4 days, and then heading to Salar de Atacama for a day followed by Torres del Paine/Santiago/Valparaiso/wine valley. Rather varied climates, it seems.

1. What sort of winter hear should we cary for TdP and Salar de Uyuni? Do we need a super heavy duty down jacket (like an LL Bean Baxter State Parka or a Superior Down Parka from Eddie Bauer) or can we go with a packable down jacket (preferably synthetic so we are good in the rain from Patagonia/Marmot/Montbell/etc.)? We already own the formerly mentioned super heavy options but are open to investing in a packable down because it'll make for lighter packing for a multi-climate trip like ours. Any other tips for winter gear keeping in view that we won't be doing any intense hikes but have glacier navigation and other outdoorsy excursions on the list?
2. Will we ever get very hot weather suitable for summer dresses and shorts or are we always looking at a light jacket/shawl at the very minimum? I am hoping parts of Colombia and Brazil are warm enough for proper summer gear but don't want to be misled by hope/assumptions.
3. Best way to be equipped for the wet weather in Peru? Will a hooded wet-proof down be good enough or should we be planning for a separate rain jacket?

Thanks!

crellston

If it helps, here is a link to my packing list for South America https://accidentalnomads.com/2016/05...ck-like-a-man/ . I have been nagging my wife, to no avail, to provide her list.but this should provide a general idea.

This list has served me well for travelling to all those destination at various time of the year including Salar de Uyuni at the coldest time of year ( -20c) and Cartagena and Mompox (+35-40c)

I am not a fan of down jackets, but my wife loves them. I am a fan of layers, inc. Merino base layers. I always use a lightweight rain jacket but frequently forget to take it with me - just got a soaking here in Saigon!

I think the hottest part of your trip will Be Cartagena but don’t know about Brazil. Many places you are visiting are at altitude which will reduce temps, especially at night.

chimes0709

Wow! Your packing list is so helpful - not only for the packing tips but everything else esp. debit cards and managing bank security on the road. And I am impressed that you can do 6 months of travel in a carry on. We are actually planning to check in baggage - 1 piece each. So we have A LOT more space to work with. Looking at packing cubes as well but your tips on vacuum bags is good. Still deciding if our checkin luggage should be a backpack or a mid-sized suitcase.

What would your wife say about down jackets for our trip? Needed or not? Super heavy duty or package? Haha.. just trying my luck here. We will look into merino wool layers too - these things are just hard to come by in Asia so we'll have to order via Amazon and see if they ship here.

On travel insurance, do you have an economical option that you might recommend? Else, we will go to good old Google for some comparisons. Thank you!

P.S. Hope you are enjoying Asia. Saigon is amazing; Hanoi and Hoi An are even more special. Happy to share tips if you happen to be stopping by Singapore or other areas around SEA on your Asia tour.

odie1

I agree with crellston on the layers, especially for TdP and Peru. A big bulky down coat is not ideal nor necessary. We are die hard Patagonia fans and it has never let us down. A super light weight water and windproof shell is perfect with a layer or two underneath. We do like the down sweaters from Patagonia they are super lightweight, packable and are windproof so then you only need a light weight waterproof layer on top.

For MP, the ticketing system has changed since we were there in April. My understanding is that It is now timed for two separate times per day and I would say yes, you should get your tickets beforehand, like now! No other entry passes were needed ahead of time.

Use insuremytrip.com for comparisons on insurance and choose the plan that is best for you all.

crellston

Down? My wife says go for it, but I suspect that is more a fashion than need for warmth!

Merino maybe best sourced from New Zealand. We stocked up in the sales when we were there last month. Although it would probably have been cheaper back in the UK. Icebreaker is the premium brand, Kathmandu also have some good but cheaper stuff.

Travel insurance is nearly always country specific. The company I use is Trailfinders but like most providers one has to be resident within the EU. Worldnomads as recommended by Lonely Planet May be worth a look but I can’t vouch for how good or bad they may be on claims, service etc. As odie suggests, it would be best to use a consolidators site like insure your trip. I could suggest some great UK ones but they probably would not accept you if you are not a UK or EU resident.

We are loving Asia thanks. We are coming to the end of six months travel through Asia to NZ and Australia. We have spent a lot of time in Vietnam over many years and Saigon now seems like home. Our last week is being spent with our friend the wonderful Giang sister who run a Homestay in District 3. We are seriously going to miss the food here!

PS with warm clothing in mind, do leave space in your suitcase for some alpaca. Sweaters, scarfs, gloves, hats. Great value in Peru, even better in Bolivia. Our relatives were mightily impressed with the alpaca scarfs we bought in La Paz. Especially when one saw the very same in Harrods at 20x the price we paid!

chimes0709

Thanks a bunch, Odie1 and crellston. Getting down to Peru bookings today and all your tips have been super helpful! Same for picking and clothing. Can't imagine how we'd plan an itinerary like ours without this amazing community.

chimes0709

Hey crellston and Odie, does the following itinerary for Peru look better?

5 Jan - Avianca AV837 from Lima to Cuzco (arriving 12:24 pm) + transfer to Olly with TaxiDatum + chill in Olly
6 Jan - Olly + Awamaki weaving coop (optional) + evening train to AC
7 Jan - Machu Picchu + train back to Olly for overnight stay
8 Jan - Olly to Cusco via Moray, Maras and Chinchero
9 Jan - Cuzco to Pisac day trip (jumping off at Tambo Machay and then take the Inca paths back down to Sacsayhuaman via Q’enko, Puka Puccara)
10 Jan - Cuzco
11 Jan - Peruvian Airlines P9331 from Cusco to La Paz at 7:50 AM

The day trip to Pisac with Tambo Machay et al - can this be arranged with TaxiDatum as well or are there cheaper options than taxi? How long/intense is the walk down the Inca bath to Sacsayhuaman via Q’enko, Puka Puccara? I am hoping we don't have to book with a tour company and can manage this on our own but please tell me if the former is an easier option. Thanks.

chimes0709

Another option is to not stay in AC at all and take the morning train (maybe 8 am?) from Olly to AC on 7 Jan and return the same day. What is recommended for weather in Jan? Also, should we be booking train tickets now or are they readily available on the spot? Thanks!

chimes0709

Hate to be posting multiple times but there isn't a way to edit/delete replies here So I just went back to Odie1's post and going to AC the night before makes more sense. Looking at the following train options -

Saturday, 6 January 2018
Olly to AC
Peru Rail VISTADOME 603 at 15:37 (arr 17:02) OR Inca Rail Executive Class at 16:36 (arr 18:09) or Peru Rail EXPEDITION 75 at 19:04 (arr 20:45). Personally, I'd like to leave Olly as late as possible to give us enough time to enjoy the village and not rush as it'll only be our first full day in SV. Is the last train too late? Do trains run on time or often get delayed?

Sunday, 7 January 2018
AC to Olly
Peru Rail EXPEDITION 84 at 18:20 (arr 20:05) OR Inca Rail Executive Class at 19:00 (arr 20:41). There are later options as well and we won't be in a rush to get back to Olly - should we plan to stay longer at MP (inside the ruins)? I am guessing we will go up to the ruins around 8-9am in the morning now that we are staying in AC - should 8 hours be good enough to explore the place?

Any suggestions for guides at MP or should we able to get one at the entrance or not need one at all?

crellston

The walk back down to Cusco from Tambo Machay is pretty easy. it is all downhill and the paths reasonbly say to follow. I would say allow 3+ hours with time to linger at the various sites, esp. Sacsayhuaman. from there you are on the edge of the city and it is a 20 min walk down through San Blas to the centre.


Whether to o/n in AC is down to personal preference. it is 10 years since we went and stayed in AC but i thought it was a dump and was glad to get out. we took some friends there last year and they decided to just get the early train up and evening train back and they loved it and thought that was plenty of time. of course, no one can predict the weather esp. in Jan. we arrived for the “dawn” in Aug but it was very misty and the best views were later in the morning.

i think guides are now compulsory and you also have to fix entry times - am or pm or both but don’t know the details of how to arrange under the new regime. trains are generally punctual, but again it will be rainy season so there are no guarantees. * hours should be plenty for cost people.

The trip to Pisac /TM/Sacsayhuaman can be done either way. Taxidatum or another taxi has the advantage that you won’t have to wait around for collectivos and if you change your mind and decide not to walk, that can drop you off at each of the sites. But it would cost probably $75-100. A collectivo cost peanuts and quite fun and easy to do. We were acclimatised enough to climb up to the top of Pisac and walk back down. Something i would only recommend if you are both well acclimatised and reasonably fit, otherwise, get a taxi to the top and walk down.