Northern Spain Nov. Road Trip/Marques de Riscal
Sep 14th, 2006, 10:49 PM
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Northern Spain Nov. Road Trip/Marques de Riscal
Hello, First time posting to this forum. My friend and I will be traveling in northern Spain at the beginning of November. We will have 7-8 days to travel around until we have to head to Paris for a few days. We both lived with a family in Pamplona years ago when we were in high school and so of course we want to visit there again. We would also like to see Avila, maybe Segovia and then head out to see the new Marques de Riscal (can't afford to stay there, just want to see it). Can anyone recommend the best mode of transportation (two women traveling without our spouses this time)? Is driving safe? Can you get an automatic? Or does it make more sense to take trains & buses? Other sights to see along the way (interested in the wine country but know nothing about wine tasting/right season to go/what to look for)? Good restaurants/hotels (I'm on a tighter budget than my friend so some nice but inexpensive hotels and restaurants would be good)? How will the weather be at the beginning of November? And the best/least expensive way to get to Paris from around Pamplona or up in that area (train or plane)? We're planning to fly into Madrid and out of Paris for our trip from the states. Don't have a flight booked yet, so if flying into Paris on a round trip is better, let us know. Thank you for your help.
Sep 15th, 2006, 06:08 AM
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LoopyLove,
If you want to travel to the Marqués de Riscal winery in tiny Elciego for a tour and to see the newly opened Frank Gehry designed "City of Wine", you should do this by car. And you should make an prior apt. for the tour, as MdeR is very picky about apts.
Call: 945 60 60 00 or email: [email protected]
If you'd like to dine in the stunning new restaurant, whose kitchen is supervised by 1 Michelin star Francis Paniego of Echaurren in Ezcaray, you should also reserve well in advance by calling the hotel. Yes, those rooms are pricey, with doubles starting at 400 euros! Phone: 945 180880
Driving in Spain is perfectly safe, and while you'll pay top dollar, you can rent an automatic. If you do know how to drive a manual, I would do a quick refresher course at home and rent a manual to save some big bucks, but if you're not comfortable with that, yes, automatics are available.
The weather can be chilly with rain (we've done the winery route in Nov.) particularly up in the bastide town of Laguardia, so dress in layers and take a rain slicker, just in case.
I have a lengthy guide on touring the Rioja and Rioja Alavesa that you're welcome to dowload (pdf) at www.maribelsguides.com
It will give you detailed info on all the sites to see in this wine country, lodging (some nice budget properties), dining... Think of the area as extending west to east from Haro to Logroño. and the wineries (bodgegas) are located in both cities and all the towns lying between, which are in the regions of La Rioja and Alava (Basque Country)-driving tours of the wine country will have you constantly crossing the border between regions.
You can drive to Logroño (to the east) or Haro (to the west) from Madrid on different routes in about 4 hrs.
There are interesting stops to make along the way. If you do this drive from Segovia you should take the N1/E5 up to Burgos. Along the way you can stop for coffee at the Parador and tour the hilltop village of Lerma, or take a little detour to the picturesque medieval village of Covarrubias before visiting the cathedral in Burgos.
From Marqués de Riscal in Elciego to Pamplona, it's about an hour 1/2 drive.
From Pamplona to Paris, I would drive to Hondarribia to the airport (San Sebastián's airport is located there) to return the rental car. You want to avoid the horrendous drop off charge of renting in Spain and dropping off in France. Then hire a taxi to take you across the border to Hendaye to catch the TGV to Paris. It's a longish 5 1/2 hr. trip because it's only high speed from Dax on to Montparnasse. And make sure to buy your tickets on the www.voyages-sncf.com site (you can do this 90 days out) to grab an inexpensive Prem's fare. I just saw one today for 25 euros!
Hope this helps.
If you want to travel to the Marqués de Riscal winery in tiny Elciego for a tour and to see the newly opened Frank Gehry designed "City of Wine", you should do this by car. And you should make an prior apt. for the tour, as MdeR is very picky about apts.
Call: 945 60 60 00 or email: [email protected]
If you'd like to dine in the stunning new restaurant, whose kitchen is supervised by 1 Michelin star Francis Paniego of Echaurren in Ezcaray, you should also reserve well in advance by calling the hotel. Yes, those rooms are pricey, with doubles starting at 400 euros! Phone: 945 180880
Driving in Spain is perfectly safe, and while you'll pay top dollar, you can rent an automatic. If you do know how to drive a manual, I would do a quick refresher course at home and rent a manual to save some big bucks, but if you're not comfortable with that, yes, automatics are available.
The weather can be chilly with rain (we've done the winery route in Nov.) particularly up in the bastide town of Laguardia, so dress in layers and take a rain slicker, just in case.
I have a lengthy guide on touring the Rioja and Rioja Alavesa that you're welcome to dowload (pdf) at www.maribelsguides.com
It will give you detailed info on all the sites to see in this wine country, lodging (some nice budget properties), dining... Think of the area as extending west to east from Haro to Logroño. and the wineries (bodgegas) are located in both cities and all the towns lying between, which are in the regions of La Rioja and Alava (Basque Country)-driving tours of the wine country will have you constantly crossing the border between regions.
You can drive to Logroño (to the east) or Haro (to the west) from Madrid on different routes in about 4 hrs.
There are interesting stops to make along the way. If you do this drive from Segovia you should take the N1/E5 up to Burgos. Along the way you can stop for coffee at the Parador and tour the hilltop village of Lerma, or take a little detour to the picturesque medieval village of Covarrubias before visiting the cathedral in Burgos.
From Marqués de Riscal in Elciego to Pamplona, it's about an hour 1/2 drive.
From Pamplona to Paris, I would drive to Hondarribia to the airport (San Sebastián's airport is located there) to return the rental car. You want to avoid the horrendous drop off charge of renting in Spain and dropping off in France. Then hire a taxi to take you across the border to Hendaye to catch the TGV to Paris. It's a longish 5 1/2 hr. trip because it's only high speed from Dax on to Montparnasse. And make sure to buy your tickets on the www.voyages-sncf.com site (you can do this 90 days out) to grab an inexpensive Prem's fare. I just saw one today for 25 euros!
Hope this helps.
Sep 17th, 2006, 10:31 PM
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Maribel,
Thank you for the great information! It was all very helpful.
I am wondering about some additional things if I can bother you further. If we plan to arrive in Madrid and want to see Avila, Segovia and Salamanca in the first few days (we arrive in Madrid at around 9:00am and have three nights before we head toward El Ciego and Pamplona), where would you recommend we stay? We want to be somewhere that makes it easy to access these towns (and any others in between that you might recommend). We would like to do all of this travel by bus or train if possible. If we stayed in Avila, is there enough to do there or would it make more sense to stay in Segovia one night with a day trip to Avila (is it easy to get there-it looks like the train route goes all the way back to Madrid first?) and Salamanca one night? Or Burgos with a day trip to Salamanca? We're not sure what we would see in Burgos, it just seems like the right place to pick up a car to drive to Logrono/El Ciego and on to Pamplona.
Also, can you recommend someplace to stay in Pamplona?
Hopefully you or someone can answer this even though it's not about Spain. What about flying from Hendaye or Bayonne to Paris instead of the train? Would we miss too much but save time? Would it take about the same amount of time what with waiting in airports, etc? Is the cost too high?
Thanks in advance for whatever help you or anyone can recommend. I sure appreciate all of the good suggestions.
Thank you for the great information! It was all very helpful.
I am wondering about some additional things if I can bother you further. If we plan to arrive in Madrid and want to see Avila, Segovia and Salamanca in the first few days (we arrive in Madrid at around 9:00am and have three nights before we head toward El Ciego and Pamplona), where would you recommend we stay? We want to be somewhere that makes it easy to access these towns (and any others in between that you might recommend). We would like to do all of this travel by bus or train if possible. If we stayed in Avila, is there enough to do there or would it make more sense to stay in Segovia one night with a day trip to Avila (is it easy to get there-it looks like the train route goes all the way back to Madrid first?) and Salamanca one night? Or Burgos with a day trip to Salamanca? We're not sure what we would see in Burgos, it just seems like the right place to pick up a car to drive to Logrono/El Ciego and on to Pamplona.
Also, can you recommend someplace to stay in Pamplona?
Hopefully you or someone can answer this even though it's not about Spain. What about flying from Hendaye or Bayonne to Paris instead of the train? Would we miss too much but save time? Would it take about the same amount of time what with waiting in airports, etc? Is the cost too high?
Thanks in advance for whatever help you or anyone can recommend. I sure appreciate all of the good suggestions.
Sep 17th, 2006, 11:33 PM
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With what you are trying to do, in such a short amount of time, I suggest you pick up the car when you arrive and spend the first night in Ávila and the second in Segovia before heading for Elciego and Pamplona. Salamanca can be done on a day trip from Ávila. It will be a lot simpler than trying to take the train back and forth. Ávila and Salamanca are on the same line, but Segovia is on a different route, a Regional line.
There are a number of excellent hotels in Pamplona, Hotel Avenida, close to the old city, the AC Ciudad de Pamplona, a top business class hotel, Hotel Masonnave in the old city itself. Check out the cities web site for additional information (http://www.pamplona.net/).
There are a number of excellent hotels in Pamplona, Hotel Avenida, close to the old city, the AC Ciudad de Pamplona, a top business class hotel, Hotel Masonnave in the old city itself. Check out the cities web site for additional information (http://www.pamplona.net/).
Sep 18th, 2006, 10:35 AM
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Hi LoopyLove,
I agree with Robert regarding your touring route. Three days is a short amount time to see properly all 3 cities, Segovia, Avila and Salamanca relyiing on public transportation to hop from town to town. I'm assuming you don't want to spend that 1st night in Madrid,
While Avila and Salamanca are on the same train line, as Robert says, Segovia is best (most quickly) reached by La Sepulvedana bus from Madrid. Segovia to Avila is also best done by bus. Salamanca is a long detour WEST from the direct route north to the Rioja and Pamplona.
If I were making this trip, I would pick up my rental car at Barajas airport upon arrival and drive directly to Avila to the Parador (or if beyond your budget at 110€, let me know, there are other options).
I would stay in Avila for the first 2 nights and on day 2 make an easy day trip to Salamanca (I've done this-takes 1 1/2 hrs. by car). You'll have autoroute driving from Barajas airport to Avila's Parador and an easy in-and-out to make a day trip to Salamanca.
On day 3, I would drive northeast (in the direction you'll need for Pamplona) to Segovia and spend that night at the Parador (130&euro
because it's so easily accessible and has great views of the city
(but please advise if you need something less pricey-for those 60 and over there are nice 30% discounts room + brk).
This will set you on the proper path and save you time getting to Riscal. On day 4 from Segovia, drive up the N110 to the fast N 1 that will take you through Burgos, for a stop to visit the cathedral. From Burgos continue on the A 1 E 5 to Miranda de Ebro, where you'll take the fast A 68 to Logroño. But Elciego and the Marqués de Riscal is a detour BEFORE Logroño. Just take exit 10 off the A 68 at Cenicero and travel due north about 3 km. to Elciego, After your Riscal visit, return to the A 68 for the short ride to Logroño, then take the N111 to Pamplona.
As Robert says, there's plentiful nice lodging in Pamplona-just depends on your budget. I stay either at the Hotel Avenida, a traditional Old European style family run 3 star ,very near the Old Quarter and bullring, or the AC Ciudad de Pamplona, a more hip, stylish hotel in the quiet, upscale Iturrama district, a 20 minute walk from the Plaza de Castillo (but on the bus line). If you especially want to be in the Old Quarter, I would stay at the classic Maisonnave, with garage.
The Bayonne-Anglet-Biarritz airport located between Biarritz and Bayonne and has daily flights to Paris. Air France flys to Orly and CDG. Check airfares at www.airfrance.com but use the French site, as I've seen o.w. fares there for 73€
But you would still need to turn in the car at the Hondarribia airport or in Irún at the border, at any rate, to avoid the horrific drop-off fees.
It's easier to taxi the few kms. over to Hendaye and take the TGV to Montparnasse. And the Prem's fares are unbeatable.
If you plan to spend your last nights in Paris, I would take the train.
.
I agree with Robert regarding your touring route. Three days is a short amount time to see properly all 3 cities, Segovia, Avila and Salamanca relyiing on public transportation to hop from town to town. I'm assuming you don't want to spend that 1st night in Madrid,
While Avila and Salamanca are on the same train line, as Robert says, Segovia is best (most quickly) reached by La Sepulvedana bus from Madrid. Segovia to Avila is also best done by bus. Salamanca is a long detour WEST from the direct route north to the Rioja and Pamplona.
If I were making this trip, I would pick up my rental car at Barajas airport upon arrival and drive directly to Avila to the Parador (or if beyond your budget at 110€, let me know, there are other options).
I would stay in Avila for the first 2 nights and on day 2 make an easy day trip to Salamanca (I've done this-takes 1 1/2 hrs. by car). You'll have autoroute driving from Barajas airport to Avila's Parador and an easy in-and-out to make a day trip to Salamanca.
On day 3, I would drive northeast (in the direction you'll need for Pamplona) to Segovia and spend that night at the Parador (130&euro
because it's so easily accessible and has great views of the city (but please advise if you need something less pricey-for those 60 and over there are nice 30% discounts room + brk).
This will set you on the proper path and save you time getting to Riscal. On day 4 from Segovia, drive up the N110 to the fast N 1 that will take you through Burgos, for a stop to visit the cathedral. From Burgos continue on the A 1 E 5 to Miranda de Ebro, where you'll take the fast A 68 to Logroño. But Elciego and the Marqués de Riscal is a detour BEFORE Logroño. Just take exit 10 off the A 68 at Cenicero and travel due north about 3 km. to Elciego, After your Riscal visit, return to the A 68 for the short ride to Logroño, then take the N111 to Pamplona.
As Robert says, there's plentiful nice lodging in Pamplona-just depends on your budget. I stay either at the Hotel Avenida, a traditional Old European style family run 3 star ,very near the Old Quarter and bullring, or the AC Ciudad de Pamplona, a more hip, stylish hotel in the quiet, upscale Iturrama district, a 20 minute walk from the Plaza de Castillo (but on the bus line). If you especially want to be in the Old Quarter, I would stay at the classic Maisonnave, with garage.
The Bayonne-Anglet-Biarritz airport located between Biarritz and Bayonne and has daily flights to Paris. Air France flys to Orly and CDG. Check airfares at www.airfrance.com but use the French site, as I've seen o.w. fares there for 73€
But you would still need to turn in the car at the Hondarribia airport or in Irún at the border, at any rate, to avoid the horrific drop-off fees.
It's easier to taxi the few kms. over to Hendaye and take the TGV to Montparnasse. And the Prem's fares are unbeatable.
If you plan to spend your last nights in Paris, I would take the train.
.
