walkinaround

quote>>>

Wal-Mart and other such groups also offer consumers opportunities to buy items that they couldn't afford at independent sources.

>>>>

yes but at what social cost? walmart did not start the decline of shopkeeping in america but i think it will put the final nail in the coffin.

as for the comment that it should be respected because it provides jobs in the US, this is just silly. there was a time when owning a grocery store, hardware store, camera store ect, was a real job that could support a family. Also professions like meat cutters, etc were REAL jobs. Now they are not real careers but just jobs done by teenagers or those workers subsidised by public assistance. There are alot more problems but i'm sure you've all read the other arguments.

finally, walmart's culture does not translate very well to europe and this has been one of their big problems here. for example, the pre-opening pep rallies were a total flop in germany. Also, it is very expensive and difficult to get approval to build the large stores that walmart favours. unions cannot be avoided in europe (a strategy that is central to walmart's successes in the US).

TopMan

"In the areas around LA the Walmarts are frequented by lower income population and usually minorty shoppers. I have tried the one near me and I was about the only English speaking person in there."


Gee, if I didn't know it was LA I'd say you were posting about one of your shopping experiences in Europe, especially the "only English speaking person in there" part.

degas

I practically live at Wal-Mart.

Heck, fifty percent of the town works there and the greeters all know your name - sort of like a redneck Cheers!

I get me a big coffee, slip some of the family recipe in it, and then cruise the aisles checking out all the new products and the cute chickadees wearing those super short Daisy Dukes.

About half way through, I grab me one of those #3.50 lemon pepper chickens and loaf of white bread and make a snack as I wander the expansive hardware section. A real retrosexual just can't do without big tools!

Seriously, just listen to all the high and mighty talk you folks been doing about Walmart - you'd think they were mass murders by the tone of it. Poor folks got to shop some place!

degas

Shopping at Walmart

A woman goes into Wal-Mart to buy a rod and reel. She doesn't know which one to get, so she just grabs one and goes over to the register.

There is a Wal-Mart associate standing there with dark shades on. She says, " Excuse me, Sir... can you tell me anything about this rod and reel?"

He says, " Ma'am, I'm blind, but if you will drop it on the counter I can tell you everything you need to know about it from the sound that it makes. She didn't believe him but dropped it on the counter anyway.

He said, "That's a 6' graphite rod with a Zebco 202 reel and 10 lb. test line... It's a good all around rod and reel, and it's $20.00."

She says, "It is amazing that you can tell all that just by the sound of it dropping on the counter. I think it's what I'm looking for, so I'll take it."

He walks behind the counter to the register, she bends down to get her purse and passes gas. A loud one.

At first she is embarrassed but then realizes that there is no way he could tell it was her and would think it was another shopper.

He rings up the sale and says, " That will be $25.50."

She says, "But didn't you say it was $20.00?"

He says, "Yes ma'am, the rod and reel is $20.00, the duck call is $3.00, and the catfish stink bait is $2.50. And thank you for shopping Wal-Mart."

SidB

I'm from the UK so can't really comment on Wal-Marts policies toward politics and it's employmees.

However, surely all of these "supermarkets" aren't very super towards local shops. i think the same applies worldwide. Personally I'd rather shop at the local butcher, baker or gas station. I'm one of the lucky ones because I can afford to.

The subject of globalisation is a complex one, and American companies seem to be the major villans. Think MacDonalds, Coke,Ford, Hollywood. I have mixed feelings on the subject so please don't think I'm pro or anti these companies.

hansikday

I'm amazed at the snob comments and the "I'm so so above such common places" attitude.

All that aside, could someone please explain, without emotion and with some logic, why its important to subsidize expensive, inefficient shops and deny poor people cheaper prices, a wider array of goods and jobs?

Many of you say change is a good thing and that progress happens when we evolve with natural market forces. Why is this situation different?

Don't the wealthy have plenty of cute little shops they can spend money in?

4totravel

Carre-fours to me is just as bad (if not worse) than WalMart and they ARE taking over Europe - shutting down local shops and producers - it is a shame.

Clifton

LoveItaly,

Tell your dismayed friends that they should thank you for not shopping at Wal-Mart. If everyone shopped there, as the friends seem to want to guilt you into, then how could any of the competitors stay open? When I say competitor, I mean by either price or in service.

Once all the other stores closed, why would Wal-Mart bother keeping so many people on staff to provide service, etc? Where would you go then anyway if service was bad or prices started to rise? Tell the friends they can take you to dinner as a thank you...

Oh, and I generally don't shop at Wal-mart either.

twina49

Although I shop at WalMart frequently - they have good prices and it's conveniently on my way home from work, I hate when news releases state "WalMart opens in area and provides 300 new jobs." Well, maybe they do, but they are MINIMUM WAGE ($5.15/hr.) jobs - not anything a family can live on. Also, WalMart has some fairly rigid views. They wouldn't carry a t-shirt at one time that had a cartoon character saying, "A woman's place is in the White House" because it "went against family values." Baloney! Read "Nickel and Dimed" by Barbara Ehrenreich if you want an inside view on how the WalMart employees are treated.

Dr_DoGood

I'd have more truck with Hansikday if (s)he wasn't such a outspoken supporter for a government which maintains and has extended protectionist policies against the TRULY impoverished third world producers of cotton, sugar and other commodities.

A whiff of hypocrisy hangs over that particular post!

Dr D.

Judyrem

Don't like Wal-Mart at all, but I have to confess I go in OCCASIONALLY (once every 2 months) to buy some herbal supplements I can't find at a reasonable price elsewhere. I don't like the way they crowd out the local merchants either. Target is a much more palatable alternative to Wal Mart IMO.

Jocelyn_P

Hey, people, instead of blaming Walmart, why not blame the people who abandon their loyalty to the mom-and-pop place? Walmart is obviously filling a need and they're not forcing anyone to shop there. It employs people who may otherwise be unemployable and makes household neccesities affordable. If you're upset with how they treat their employees, don't work there. Again, no one is being forced to work there.

Do I want to see Walmarts in Europe? Selfishly, NO, but it's not my decision. If there is a market there for this style of shopping, why should it be denied? Free enterprise, right?

So, is it a pleasant shopping experience? Heavens, NO. (But don't tell my MIL that, lol.) With two young kids, one-stop-shopping is a huge convenience that I'm dang well going to take advantage of. Sure, I much prefer Target, and will drive the extra 15 minutes each way when I have the time and inclination, but otherwise, it's Walmart. The money I save there goes towards our travel budget.

hansikday

Dr. DoGood, I am a simple person, but have an open mind.

I'd love for you to clearly explain all about the USA's protectionist trade policies and its adverse impact on the third world.

It would also be great it you could show how the EU enacts no barriers and provides no hidden subsidy to its farmers/producers/workers.

ira

Hey y'all,

When I moved to Madison, GA there was one "supermarket", Ingles, where you could shop well if you ate hi salt, high cholesterol, high fat processed meats, didn't mind if your fish was 5-7 days old and the produce was limp and brown.

There was one other grocery, where you could buy cigarettes by the each, but otherwise it wasn't up to Ingles's standards.

A WalMart moved to town. It didn't put the other folks out of business because it didn't have the food store. It did provide other goods at a good price for the quality. It provided additional jobs.

A BiLo supermarket moved to the same shopping center as WalMart. More jobs. The competition caused Ingles to improve its product line and service and reduce prices.

A Home Depot moved in across from the BiLo. More jobs. Home products at low prices. We no longer have to drive 70 miles to buy plywood.

A Super Walmart is now under construction, as is an Eckerd's Pharmacy. Ingles, BiLo and HD have begun lowering prices, improving product lines, and raising wages in order to meet the competition.

I bought some fish from Ingles for the first time in 7 years.

We still have our hardware stores, auto parts stores, boutique candy shops and clothes stores.

Except that the alternative grocery has gone out of business (the building was condemned) and you can't buy single cigarettes any more, I think that WalMart has had a positive effect on our town.

hansikday

ira, as always, you are the calm voice of reason and experience.

Dr_DoGood

Hansikday, then let me enlighten you?
(And by the way I never said nor intimated that the EU was in anyway to be exonerated in this matter; CAP subsidies are just as bad and both US and EU governments are guilty of breathtaking hypocrisy at WTO negotiations)
In western Burkina Faso, in one of the poorest parts of one of the world's poorest countries, there are continual and real worries about the price the cotton crop will fetch.
That price will decide whether or not families have enough to eat, whether health costs can be met, and whether children schooled and educated -whether there is any hope for future development and prosperity.
Meanwhile, back at the ranch (so to speak) and America's cotton farmers share almost $4bn in government support - roughly $160,000 per head - shielding them from the deepest depression in world prices since the 1930s. These same subsidies deepened the current slump. By encouraging more production for a stagnant market they lowered world prices by a quarter, devastating the livelihoods of West Africa's 11 million cotton farmers in the process. The subsidy cheque delivered to US cotton producers was bigger than the total GDP of countries like Burkina Faso and Mali. And the world price decline cost West Africa alone some $200m - far more than it gets in US aid and debt relief.
Cotton is merely one of a number of examples which show the double standards at the heart of world agricultural trade. Subsidised US exports are destroying the livelihoods of impoverished maize farmers in Mexico, dairy farmers in Peru, and rice farmers in Haiti.
And, as you suggest, the EU is also doing its bit to keep the poor poor. Through the common agricultural policy, EU taxpayers and consumers pay farmers billions of dollars to overproduce sugar, cereals and dairy produce. Then they pay traders to dump the surpluses overseas, destroying the markets on which small farmers depend.
Last month, the WTO secretariat produced a proposal for reforming agricultural trade. Export subsidies would be slowly phased out from 2007. But over half of the $1bn a day now spent subsidising intensive agriculture at home and export dumping would be left untouched. EU and US officials have condemned the plan as "unhelpful and unrealistic".
And in a final breathless, stinking, hypocritical irony these are the same countries who are pressing developing nations to rapidly open up their markets in everything from banking and financial services to manufactured goods.
It beggars belief.
I hope you now understand a little more and agree that your earlier post was similarly misplaced.
Dr D.

hansikday

Dr. DoGood, you have motivated me to further research American farm subsidies. Don't push it by asking me to admit my position was wrong! LOL.

I do admire you for not letting the EU off the hook.

ira

Dear Dr. D

>...America's cotton farmers share almost $4bn in government support..<

According to the WTO, it's 2.6
http://www.inquit.com/article/356/wt...tton-subsidies

The EU provides about 1 billion to its cotton producers
http://www.fibre2fashion.com/news/Ne...p?News_id=6765

Overall, though, I agree with you.

just1dayoutoflife

I've had the luxury (and i do mean that with a most high level of sarcasm) to go to a Walmart once this past summer. I'd never really been inside of one, because before I moved to Minneapolis, I lived in Los Angeles...and Walmart doesn't have as much of a stranglehold on the California-mindsetted marketplace. In all honesty I find it disgusting that they think they could ever pull off success in Europe. As far as Im concerned, if they actually labeled their purchases in Europe with the Walmart name, it would be one hill they couldn't climb.

Walmart really epitomizes the reason, in my own opinion, that red America is crimson and blue America is almost navy. It's a cultural divide that most blue-state Americans dont relate to, at least urban ones dont. I think Walmart perpretuates the idea of America America America and renounces any possibility of foreign ideas being just as good or 'wholesome' (a word in which i loathe) to American ones.

It's rather sad. This entire country is going to the dogs.

SeaUrchin

When I was in Walmart something happened and I was talking to the manager about it and she told me that they employ transient workers. She said most of their employees are unskilled and lucky to be at Walmart or they would be working at another low paid job. She was in the mind that it is good for unskilled, low income people on both sides of the fence, those employed and those shopping.

It wasn't any worse of a shopping experience than Costco or any other of the discount stores that are mobbed and hectic. My local store is in a shopping mall with plenty of mom and pop stores as well as other chains and they are all thriving right alongside of each other.

I'm not defending Walmart, just sharing my experience.