dabodin

We just got back from France, and one thing I noticed right away is that almost all the hotels offered 2 little foil packets of liquid soap (for a double room). No bar soap of any kind. My husband hated this. I'm not exactly a soap waster, but this was not enough soap to get really clean.

On the plus side, I loved not having to figure out the 15% or 20% tip we always leave in the U.S. We just rounded up the bill by a few coins which everyone seemed pleased with. What a great system!

And the best thing was the French pharmacies that you find in every town. They are all pretty much the same in layout, are open late, and they replaced my lost medications without any prescriptions, on the spot and for about 1/4 of the cost I pay in the States. It saved my trip from being a disaster, and I was so relieved and grateful!

ira

>at least in Germany, if you go to a store and want to buy something, you pay exactly what it says on the price tag. You don't have to add taxes. <

That's because they have already added the 17% VAT for you.

ira

>I loved not having to figure out the 15% or 20% tip we always leave in the U.S. We just rounded up the bill by a few coins which everyone seemed pleased with. What a great system!<

That's because they have already added the 15% service charge for you.

RufusTFirefly

As a consumer, I want to control my own "service charge" (tip), and I also want to see clearly how much sales tax I'm paying.

It's not exactly differential calculus to figure out how much to tip or what the sales tax will be--more like 4th or 5th grade math.

logos999

> already added the 17% VAT for you
Ira, don't scare me now. I'm only declaring 16% every month for a number of years now. No complaints up to now, but then german tax law is the most complicated on the panet.

flanneruk

It may not take differential calculus to work out American sales tax.

But it most certainly takes skills of divination which are denied to all of us but Rex, since American merchants keep even the existence of these taxes a secret.

How many Americans, even of the most knee-jerk "if it's American it must be right" tendency, know what the tax on newspapers is in the state next door but one? (How many can justify any tax on newspapers is an altogether different story, but then given what pass for newspapers in the US, I suppose it's really a tax on comics)

The system's utterly indefensible: the only argument for it is that it makes life easier for merchants, by letting them show those mendacious "99c" posters.

To argue that you don't know what European sales taxes are is preposterous: it's almost impossible to find a receipt that doesn't show VAT.

Geordie

> already added the 17% VAT for you
<Ira, don't scare me now. I'm only declaring 16% every month for a number of years now. No complaints up to now, but then german tax law is the most complicated on the panet.>

As I'm a VAT Free Resident of Germany its even better as I get a nice juicy cheque at the end of each financial year.

Geordie

logos999

But then you don't have additional taxes in the US that aren't shown at all on the receipt as in Germany, do you?

We have Coffee-Tax, Gas-Tax (of course), Lightbulb-Tax, "Enjoyment-Tax" (that's i.e. the tax you pay in addition to the 16% VAT if you go to see a movie in a movie theatre). Do you get you tax back if you don't like the movie? - NO) and a number of other taxes that NEVER show on the receipt.

logos999

I forgot one most important tax: ;-) TV-tax. You're taxed if you own a tv-set or/and a radio. The funny thing with this tax is that since many people don't willingly pay they are sending "tax collectors" out to check and ask if you got a TV. What a criminal waste of money!

Kiahlin

Personally, I'd much rather pay inclusive VAT tax that goes to _at least_ somewhat (or vastly) more constructive use than what American tax goes to, though the sales tax paid in America is I think usually far more constructively spent than US Federal Income Tax (to see a graph on what US federal money is spent on education, etc., and then to see what is spent on "defense" boggles my mind incredibly -- and I know most of it's not going to soldiers' salaries). And as for adding it on with the price beforehand, I think that's simpler. And solve the "know exactly what was spent on tax" issue with having it separated on the receipt, as mentioned previously. I think adding it at the register is just plain ridiculous. As for math? Do it backward, then. Math either way, or itemized receipt.

As for the ice in your drink thing, I am definitely guilty of that American habit. A soda does not taste the same without the ice -- I like it continuously cold, and I like the minor dilution the ice brings (it just doesn't taste refreshing without the ice). Obviously I've come into multiple difficulties in every place I've been regarding ice & drink, outside of the USA. I understand it's not the custom elsewhere, but I do cling to this American trait.

Regarding the TV-tax thing, yes, I've had wonderful conversations with Americans here regarding having to have a TV permit/license in the UK, for instance, even a more expensive one for color sets -- (how common are B&W TV sets these days in the UK? I never saw any years ago when I frequently visited the UK to be with relatives). And I especially love relaying the bit about the triangulation vans that drive around looking for TV-watching culprits without a license (or should I say licence!). This always boggles the mind of any American who either does not have relatives there or is not well-travelled, or just simply not very knowledgable about such things. I'm sure that's because of the whole 'freedom of the airwaves' inalienable right here in the USA.

As for gas-tax and the like, that exists in the USA, too (just obviously not as much). As for getting any kind of money back if you don't like the movie you've just seen in the theatre, you won't get it back here, either. And whatever you do, don't get hungry at the movies, or you're likely to need a small loan to cover the costs of that popcorn & soda (I'd rather have a tax that goes to education or public welfare than the EXCESSIVE prices of such at the movies).

As for the list, I guess I can add my own, but I agree with a lot on the previous lists:

Europe:

FAR better chocolate (and much more white chocolate, my favorite -- and yes, yes, don't get started on the whole 'not chocolate' thing), variety and quality of different breads, wine, the whole relaxing and taking your time while eating thing (I do this anyway in the USA, much to the consternation of others), history, art, diversity in language and culture, less TV commercials, the fact that stores are NOT open all of the time (do I really need to ruin someone else's weekend or holiday for my own "convenience"??), that I can ask for and drink (hot) tea without getting a weird look (I can't stand coffee), more knowledgable customer service, naptime, water-conserving toilets (when you find such) that have separate buttons for a #1 or #2, and MASS TRANSPORTATION, MASS TRANSPORTATION, and MASS TRANSPORTATION.

My list could be quite a bit longer for Europe, but I've already said too much political stuff as it is. Ok, I will say having enough holiday/vacation time to actually enjoy life is a HUGE plus, imo, for Europe (I'd rather live in Europe, and visit the USA for the positive points of the USA), but then, that's not really travel-related except for Europeans.

USA:

hotels/motels everywhere, interstate highways spanning the nation (they may not be connected, but even Hawai'i has them!), cheap(er) gas, the vast number of beautiful national parks, pancakes & maple syrup, crispy bacon, bigger fridges, bigscreen TVs (they are nice, but given the choice of working myself to death to get one or having more time off, I'd take more time off, though I already have one and didn't have to work to death to get it, but many Americans ARE heavily over-worked) and lots of channels (though I don't advocate becoming a TV-Zombie at all), Goodwill stores (you can find decent designer clothing in a Goodwill, believe it or not, for next-to-nothing, if you look), oh yeah, and iced drinks.

I'm sure there's a lot more I could think of for both sides, but that's what comes to my mind at the moment, at least.

twoflower

what's the point of this posting? surely travel is about experiencing and appreciating and enjoying differences, not making comparisons or judgements?

Kate

logos, I'm not sure how widespread 'TV TAX' is across Europe. We have it in the UK, but the vast majority are more than happy about this because it pays for the BBC - quality, and AD FREE, TV and radio. I think it's actually great value for only £10 a month - beats paying for rubbish cable stuff any day of the week. Give me that over the 'ad break every 5 mins' you get in the US. I couldn't believe it when I realised there was an ad break inbetween the opening credits and the programme actually starting!

And the TV licensing people don't waste all this tax money randomly knocking on doors to see who's got a TV - technology nowadays means they know exactly who hasn't got a licence, so just send out a fine!

logos999

> they know exactly who hasn't got a licence
How do they do it? Do you heve to register right where the TV's are sold? In Germany its over 15€, they're showings ads and do product placement on TV. Plus there sending there spys out, to find people who don't pay. I'm paying but I actually don't see why I should any longer since I don't get anything in return plus a large number gets it all for free. I would love to get all the BBC chanels to, but I can't set up the 1 meter dish needed to receive it here.

Carola22

One point that hasn't been mentioned here (I think) is 'quality of clothing/fabrics'. I lived in the US for 5 months in 1997, and I STILL wear just about all the clothing I bought there - excellent quality, almost no wear. Anything I buy here (Holland) and wear often, I can throw away after just a few years. So the question is: what makes American fabrics so durable, and such good quality? And also: does anybody know a reliable website where you can order clothing by Internet straight from the US?

Kate

logos, it's all database driven nowadays. They have the address of every residential property in the UK so can identify homes that haven't got a licence. So they target their efforst at those homes.

The BBC itself is responsible for collecting the licence fee, so all the money goes direct to the BBC rather than getting 'lost' or misdirected in Government coffers. It also means the BBC isn't subject to government/political interests, or for that matter the interests of shareholders or advertisers.

Because it's funded by the tax payer, it's also obliged to produce quality programming on a diverse range of subjects - including minority interest programming. It's not allowed to just churn out cheap TV in the form of endless quiz shows and soap operas.

That's why the BBC is fondly thought of in the UK, and why the tax payer doesn't begrudge the licence fee.

flanneruk

Carola:

Try Lands' End (sic). But remember you have to pay EU import duty and VAT, plus shipping and that - like all US retailers - Lands' End haven't got the hang of selling from bond, so you're paying all that on top of the (disgracefully high) import duty the US has already levied on the clothes. Even if they've been made by the poorest people in the world.

As for quality, my experience is precisely the opposite from yours. But it's also true that durability has decined everywhere in the past decade. Few of us wear anything we wore ten years ago anyway (would that we could fit!), the easiest way to meet a price point is to make the fabric thinner and it's a lot tougher to check quality on something being made 8,000 miles away.

RufusTFirefly

Among online clothing sellers we've had good results with (and that ship intl). Some might require a phone call:

www.llbean.com
www.coldwatercreek.com
www.chicos.com
www.jcpenny.com

Carola22

Thanks everybody, will check out these sites! (Good point about not fitting into clothes one bought 10 years ago - oh, how to get rid of these extra pounds...!)

mah1980

jcrew.com
macys.com
gap.com

flanneruk

Mah:

Gap don't allow foreign sales on the web, and when I last spoke to an operator, they referred me to their physical stores. However since they pulled out of Germany, that makes it difficult for Continentals like Carola. Has Gap's policy changed? Their website certainly hasn't.

Macy's don't acknowledge the existence of a world outside the US on their website either.

J Crew's site believes the outside world consists of Canada and Japan and nowhere else.

I doubt either is of much use to Carola.